Automatic Transmissions run thousands of miles, moving parts and ATF is lubing them. Seems it should be dandy as firearm lube. Thoughts and experience?

No experience, but my thoughts are why chance possible harm to a costly firearm by going on the cheap with a product not specifically made to be compatible with it? For example, from what I've read, the DIY solvent/lube Ed's Red really works, but it can damage stock finishes. IMHO the cost savings realized by use of "non-gun" products, over a lifetime of shooting, just isn't worth the risk. My 2 cents worth.

Been using it for years, no issues whatsoever.

500 shooter--not to flame and thanks for the response--valid points. I do use Ed's Red and have for years. It is supposed to duplicate Hoppe's #9 (which I have also used for many years), neither have ever done any stock finish damage, but I suspect a heavy coat of either one left on could damage some finishes.

I'm neither a mechanic nor a chemist, but an online search reveals that a car needs about 15 quarts of tranny fluid and operates at about 175-200 degrees F. I'm guessing that most of the tranny gears, etc., are continually bathed in that hot fluid and this is what keeps things humming along. I don't know if a very small amount of that same fluid would adhere to the bolt on my Anschutz 1413 Super Match .22 and give it the low temp lube it needs while I shoot all afternoon, but I'm not going to chance it. Glad that Ed's Red has worked for you, and I hope it continues to do so.

I used ATF on my and my 3 sons auto shotguns this last game bird season. We shoot a lot of rounds on our duckshooting opening weekend and previously by the time we were half way through shooting on the Sunday our gas operated semis were starting to fail to feed on occasion.
This past season saw none of that, all our guns performed without fail all weekend.

quote:

Originally posted by 500_shooter:
No experience, but my thoughts are why chance possible harm to a costly firearm by going on the cheap with a product not specifically made to be compatible with it? For example, from what I've read, the DIY solvent/lube Ed's Red really works, but it can damage stock finishes. IMHO the cost savings realized by use of "non-gun" products, over a lifetime of shooting, just isn't worth the risk. My 2 cents worth.

ATF is a very high spec fluid and is not cheap. It is also used in some higher stressed manual gearboxes too and is not harmful to metals both steel and base metals which are all used in gearboxes. In auto boxes it is the hard working clutch packs that operate under high stress and temperatures that require ATF.

As mentioned in my previous post ATF used on the magazine tube, gas piston and breech block of our semi auto shotguns did the trick where these guns were operating under cold, wet and dirty conditions.

ATF is supposed to be highly refined with a lot of cleaning agents in the mix. It is supposed to perform throughout a wide range of temperatures.

I will say this: it is a poor rust preventative.

I ran a test about 10 years ago. From memory, it was the worst of the lot. Even olive oil performed much better. It seemed that water just washed the ATF away, and allowed the rust to go crazy.

I stopped using it as a gun lube for that reason.

eagle27 -- Wow, ATF in NZ must be quite a bit more expensive than in the US. A local major retail chain store sells name brand ATF for an average of $7/quart (22 cents/oz). They also have name brand gun oils (Rem, Hoppes, CLP) for an average of $3.40/oz ($108/qt). This is why I stated that using tranny juice as a gun oil was doing it on the cheap. What advice would you offer the OP regarding ATF as a gun lube? I'm not being contentious. I'm asking, since your Oct. 14 post relates about one hunt where there were FTF problems, then another time when there were none.

quote:

Originally posted by 500_shooter:
eagle27 -- Wow, ATF in NZ must be quite a bit more expensive than in the US. A local major retail chain store sells name brand ATF for an average of $7/quart (22 cents/oz). They also have name brand gun oils (Rem, Hoppes, CLP) for an average of $3.40/oz ($108/qt). This is why I stated that using tranny juice as a gun oil was doing it on the cheap. What advice would you offer the OP regarding ATF as a gun lube? I'm not being contentious. I'm asking, since your Oct. 14 post relates about one hunt where there were FTF problems, then another time when there were none.

I don't think there is one fluid or oil that can do all things for certain firearms. If you are looking at mild lube and rust protection say on a bolt action then any oil will do including standard engine oil. This oil is anti corrosive and has good lube qualities, while it is anti-corrosive it does burn under higher temps but a bolt action has no moving parts that operate at high temps. So for bolts, levers and pumps any gun oil or engine oil will serve to do the job.

The OP seemed more to be asking about an oil, namely ATF, in association with moving parts i.e. semi auto firearms. Anything operated by a piston and exposed to hot gas created by the gunpowder burn is a different kettle of fish. Hence the military have done a lot of R&D to come up with suitable oils for their semi autos.

Of course one oil to do all is best for the military but for sporting use an oil such as ATF can be used for the gas or recoil operated mechanisms and another for corrosion resistance of the firearm surfaces exposed to the elements.

I just read somewhere where engine oil and a lot of gun oils are not the best for piston operated guns whereas ATF stands up to heat and scuffing without burning and creating varnish type by product.

If you have seen an automatic transmission that is taken apart, it is shiny and no rust. Mechanics that work on automatic transmissions hands are usually clean. ATF is relatively cheap here. There seems to be a big difference in the types of ATF--put the wrong type in your transmission and it will slip and have all kinds of problems.

carpetman1 -- What's the verdict? Have you decided to use ATF to lube all, some, or none of your guns?

500 shooter--I'd not be afraid of giving it a try.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
If you have seen an automatic transmission that is taken apart, it is shiny and no rust. Mechanics that work on automatic transmissions hands are usually clean. ATF is relatively cheap here. There seems to be a big difference in the types of ATF--put the wrong type in your transmission and it will slip and have all kinds of problems.

I have been told that ATF has a lot of detergents, which are vital to its performance in its intended application.

From what I have seen, those same detergents make AFT pretty easy to wash off. For example, have you ever spilled ATF on concrete? It doesn't stain like engine oil and is fairly simple to wash off. Even rain will do it given a bit of time.

I have no doubt that ATF would be outstanding in a lot of firearm applications due to the fact that it is super refined, impervious to temperature, etc. In some applications the detergents would be a benefit as they would dissolve and loosen gunk, but I believe that they would be a drawback in any application where they could be washed away.

If rust protection is of interest to you, I would recommend testing some ATF next to some of your favorite gun lubes. If you treat a bare piece of steel with ATF and leave it outside where it can be rained on, I believe that you will be shocked by the aggressiveness of the rust that forms.

If your test produces rust like mine did, I would be willing to bet that you won't trust for rust protection on your guns.

As I posted on the 1911 "best lubricant" tread, I've used ATF as a lube with no issues ever for a few decades now. It also is my oil of choice when sharpening using oilstones.

Back when zombies were the rage, I remember seeing a red gun oil labelled "Zombie Blood" and dollars to donuts someone was just repackaging ATF into 30 ml bottles.

I used RESLONE and ATF Dextron, that was the slip fluid, i DID NOT MIX THEM, I could not find fault, and then there was STP. i HAD NO INTEREST IN STP UNLESS IT WAS DISTRUBITED BY STUDERBAKER.

F. Guffey

Jason,
You state that in your tests that ATF washes off easily in the rain.

You also state that rust forms aggressively when a piece of metal is left out in the rain.

Have you tested it for rust protection in climates where it is just very humid but NOT rained on?

Hip