Shooters,
I've got a new 6.5-284 that I'm just breaking in. As many of you know this caliber has a reputation for forming a carbon ring, and with the long bearing surface of the bullet, copper fouling.

So I scrub and scrub with Montana Extreme, Shooter's Choice, Butches, Bore Tech Elimnator, and I always get a blue patch. I use bronze and nylon brushes and tight fitting patches.

The Bore Tech Eliminator will start bluing the patch as soon as the saturated patch touches the jag...How am I supposed to know if the copper is gone?(btw I've got a muzzle brake so looking down the bore is not an option)

Why do have to use brass jags? What about other materials? Delrin, aluminum, other ideas?

Thanks,
Jim

Check with Hoppe's. I have an ancient old 22cal cleaning kit that came with a Nylon Jag. And it might be Hoppe's that makes some kind of Synthetic Jags that are Orange colored.

You might try just using a Brass 22cal Jag and use Paper Shop Towel material to cut some patches from. I got some HEAVY White ones from Lowe's or Home Depot, maybe both. Anyway, you can get the Patches thick enough with 2-3 "folds" that they are snug in the Bore. The Bore Cleaner doesn't soak through the Paper Patches to the Jag quick enough to fake me out.

Best of luck to you.

Tipton makes nickel plated jags that solve that issue, same with nylon brushes with non-brass cores.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?s...id=812503&t=11082005

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=817552

Wrongtarget,
You were right ON target with that suggestion. Of course, they don't have 6.5 but .25 should work just fine.

I've got the nylon brushes and still use the bronze brushes to loosen the junk up, and now I'll hopefully be able to tell when I've got the copper out as well.

Thanks to all,
Jim

I have one of those Tipton Plated jags and they are the way to go with those amonia based products.

The .25/6.5 jag is a one size fits both jag as marked on the container they come in.

quote:

Originally posted by Rasp65:
I have one of those Tipton Plated jags and they are the way to go with those amonia based products.

Bore Tech Eliminator claims no ammonia (unlike Montana Extreme 50BMG) and does better than the ME50BMG to boot.

I wanna try the KG stuff.

Regards,
Jimno

I stopped using jags and started using an undersize bore brusk. A .223 works well with my 270 bores. Brownells has some that are plain metal and not brass. I roll a 1.5" patch around the brush like a cowboy rolls a Bulldurham cigarett. It works and does not give you a false reading.

RogerK,
Are you concerned that the metal will scratch the bore? I'm not familiar with the brushes you reference, but know the stainless "tornado" brushes are a no-no.

Does your warthog solvent take our carbon?

Regards,
Jim

On my small cals,I use very heavy weed trimmer line and can push a patch through. On cals large enough to push a loop of small weed eater line through,I place my patch into the loop and drag it through. You can drag a much tighter patch this way than you can push through. Dont think weed eater line is going to damage anything.

Hey guys! This Ammonia to remove copper based fouling issue is a biggy with me and it really chaps my hide when I'm leaving more brass/copper in the bore than I'm taking out.

Happy to report that I am producing a run of totally inert non-scuffing non fouling jags that should be ready in a few days or so. When they are ready I will post some photos for your review. They will be a little more than the ones we have all used but well worth the price.

Maccifi, what material are you nmaking them of.

Where is 117wx32n? looks like tijuana mex?

Top Secret GSP7 but they are metal without coating or plating.

We're in San Diego.

Would aluminum work?

Jimno

NO! Aluminum is reactive to many solvents and tends to scrape off the rod/jag and leave particles in your bore.

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:
Top Secret GSP7 but they are metal without coating or plating.

We're in San Diego.

Ah...San Diego, Mexico. I Just finished some school in S.D. Im up near the invaded Mexican imagrant city of Temecula.

Get a set of Tiptons Nickle plated Jags. Thats what I use and no problems for me.

Macifej, will the new top secret jags be threaded for Dewey rods, or Parker Hale rods or (shudder) something else? Who do I need to know to get one of these? Are you making a universal jag or several sizes. And since I'm asking all the right questions, when's your next visit to Paris? I'm ex-Coronado myself (class of '70).

Wink,

Dewey - 12-28 thread, three sizes in a three pack. Will cover 9.3 & 375, 416 & 458, 505 & 510.

Will have them available in a couple weeks. PM with your address and I will send you a pack when they are ready.

Haven't been to Paris since '94. I'm in Europe every year for a couple weeks visiting the outlaws in-laws. I guess I could swing through Paris in the spring. Have to be in Germany, Austria and Hungary then.

Macifej, PM sent. I see you've already got three countries on your itinerary. That's a lot of relatives. If Paris fits in let me know.

quote:

Originally posted by Jimno2506:

quote:

Originally posted by Rasp65:
I have one of those Tipton Plated jags and they are the way to go with those amonia based products.

Bore Tech Eliminator claims no ammonia (unlike Montana Extreme 50BMG) and does better than the ME50BMG to boot.

I wanna try the KG stuff.

Regards,
Jimno

Even with the coated jags if your cleaning rod has a brass end on it, it will still show blue. I got a breach plug and just let mine soak overnight. That's with the eliminator.

I bought some of the nickel coated jags and they are very nice.

I tend to disagree with ya TerryO. My patches don't come in contact with the brass tip of my rod, they are too short to touch.

I think my bore might be clean, and I'm not getting a solid blue patch anymore.

KG stuff should be here monday and I'll let you know how it works.

I'm going to try the Danzac stuff as this rifle loooooves to make carbon.

Regards,
Jimno

If you are wetting your bore, it gets on the brass and it still comes out light blue. I've cleaned on my gun while reloading and the patch will start turning blue off my fingers where I have handled the brass if I wet my patch before putting it on the jag. The Eliminator is super reactive and does a super job. I put the Ultra Bore Coat in my 700VS and cleaned for 3 days trying to stop the patch from coming out light blue. I had an old rod with no brass and after 3 patches there was no blue. I now use my Boretech for carbon and have a solid stainless rod with the coated Tipton jag to do my copper cleaning. If you try the SLIP 2000 Carbon Killer your carbon cleaning problem will be a lot less. The Ultra Bore Coat cut my cleaning in half but no where near what they say it will do. I would say it will pay for itself in a while on cleaning supplies. http://www.slip2000.com/carbonkiller.html check there web site check out there oil while you are at it. This stuff did wonders for my Bushmaster. Doesn't smell either just like the Eliminator no compliants from the wife when cleaning inside anymore and both excellent products. Check this out ,too http://www.ultracoatingsinc.com/products.html It gets better with time. Took about 30 minutes to clean the copper after about 150 rds of Speer 65 gr game kings today. Still not as good as they said about the carbon, but one heck of an improvement. I've done 3 223 with one kit and have enough left to do at least 3 more. Need to buy me a cheap muzzel loader to give it a try on it.

KG shipment arrived. Bought the copper cleaner, carbon cleaner, and degreaser.

Using a nickel plated jag I could not get any evidence of copper out of my bore. I had been cleaning repeatedly for several days with BoreTech ELiminator and it appears that all copper is gone.

The carbon cleaner showed a little grey even after several days of soaking and scrubbing with GM TEC on brass and nylon brushes and tight patches.

I'm waiting on some Danzac for the 6.5 so won't be shooting it until I get it coated. It's been too damn rainy here to shoot anything so a complete report from the 204 and 2506 will have to wait.

Regards,
Jim

I think some of you guys have way too much time on your hands, you need a full time job!

I use a nylon brush sometimes and then swab the bore with a brass jag and patch and I get pretty clean patches after a few passes..I use blue goop and thats tough stuff. I make it myself. It is a quart of 25% comm. amonia with a cup of Hydrogen Peroxide and a penny tossed in to activate it (maybe). Oil after use for sure.

Lately I have been using Wipe Out and it works great, then swab it out with a brass jag and a few patches and finish up with a bore snake followed by a patch soaked with WD-40.

You don't need a surgically clean bore btw, you will have to foul it to shoot to POI as a rule anyway.

I think too many folks get to tied up in cleaning to the point of bore damage. I know some bench rest boys that are GOOD and all they ever do is use a bore snake and some Hoppes! A bore snake btw is 140 patches per pass, in an instant!

My first shot is a 3/8" high and right. Don't have to guess and with devloped load will be 1/2" group or tighter afterwards. Quick clean on the range every 50 rds. Complete cleaning when I get home. If you use a bore snake and don't wash it often you're just pulling the grit back through. I do use one on my rimfires but no more than twice without washing. If someone made one with nylon brushes might use one more. All things the same, what ever floats your boat.

The only way to truly evaluate your cleaning is to have a bore scope. I broke down and bought a Hawkeye bore scope about four years ago and it changed the way I maintain my rifles.
I also learned that taking out all of the copper is not required. In fact, with some of the older rifles, the accuracy deteriorated when the barrel was squeaky clean. Would not have understood this prior to the bore scope.

The bore scope will also assist you in the fair purchase (or sale) price of used guns. If you can see and show the seller the condition of the bore, you often will do better on your trades.

Merry Christmas to all!