I've got a hunt booked with Buzz Charlton in March and am having to make up my mind about what firearms to take. I need to decide whether to take two much loved classics (a WR Double 470NE .458 Win Mag and a Mauser 66) or to elect to take the double and a rifle I could afford to lose. The Mauser and Westley richards are my "forever" rifles - I will never sell them and hope my grandson will be hunting with them in 2050.

My thinking is that I want one open sighted rifle and one scoped rifle. I have a bit of a disability and want to be prepared for longer shots and dusk and dawn shots as Buzz may not be able to get me up close. The Mauser 66 shoots 400gn Woodleigh PPs into an inch at 100 yards with a MV of 2392fps so I can use it for PG

If I nominate on the paperwork the double and a cheap rifle and things look really grim in Zimbabwe when I leave, I could leave the double at home and just take the rifle I am prepared to lose. But, I really love the Mauser 66, shoot it very well and and would like to take an ele with it, if I have to use a scope. The rifle I would be prepared to lose is Brno 375H&H U/O double - regulates without the scope with 300gn FMJs at 2525fps but crosses with its scope attached so, when scoped, is really a single shot.

I'll be flying Qantas.

Has anyone had any problems with firearms theft/loss at the airport or in transit in Zim? What would you recommend doing? Any other tips?

Thanks in advance for your comments and advice.


Mike

Insure them and then take the favorites hunting. What the hell is the point of owning a rifle you don't hunt with?

My rifles and shotguns are listed under my home owner's policy. I would hope to never use the policy but its there and provides enough coverage to replace my rifles and shotguns - even if they apreciate. That way I can take my favorite rifles and shotguns hunting - which is what they were made for!

JPK

Why can't you decide at the last minute? Zim doesn't require any advance paperwork for getting rifles in.

In the past, tourist hunters' rifles were never in danger at all in Zim. There is a much greater danger that the Oz government would decide it doesn't want you to have them.

500 grains hit the nail on the head. The Australian Government has seized far more guns than Zims. Enjoy your hunt.

Thanks for the replies:

JPK - I will insure them - but I really don't want to lose either the Mauser (I have five other barrels for it) or the WR. Emotional attachment, if you like.

500grains & dbltap - don't I know it! I always worry about getting my rifles back into the country - I know someone who was away during a change in laws and had a lot of trouble getting his custom Mauser back in because he didn't have the right paperwork.

I didn't know that I didn't have to have prearranged paperwork to get them into Zim - that's very helpful info. I can do the Oz paperwork on all three (apparently needs to be done 4 weeks prior to departure) and then find out from you guys and Buzz what the conditions are like a day or two before I leave.

Thanks again for your input

regards,

mike

Zim doesn't require paperwork for you guns until the moment you arrive with them.

The problem might be if you can't get a direct flight into Zim and have to go through SA. I'd be more worried about my guns in SA than Zim, and like the others said, the most probable danger would be in getting them back to you island.

I was in Zim two weeks ago, going through SA. I didn't have any problems with my guns, but had anything and everything of value stolen out of my checked bag. Thankfully, my camera and binos were in my carry on, and the ammo was in my partners bag. I'm sure it happened in Zim, as the customs guy wanted to look through my gun bag (hard case with large locks), and my carry on, but had no interest in my check bag.

Stokes,

Your story about the checked baggage is a worry - being on crutches, I have to keep my carry on luggage to a bare minimum. That means cameras, computer, bino's etc in the hold luggage. Not sure what I'll do.

I think that the Qantas flight stops in Jo'berg but carries on to Harare so that should be ok.

BTW - what do you do with your firearms if your flight is interrupted and you have to stay overnight somewhere unexpected? Does the airline hold onto the guns or do you have to pick them up and then go through customs in whatever country (eg RSA) you're stuck in?

regards,

mike

Aussiemike

Qantas does not fly to Harare - you would have to complete that scetor on SAA or Air Zim if its still operating.

My advice would be SAA as Air Zim is real dodgy - they keep on running out of fuel.

Comair (owned by BA) may also provide a scheduled service to Harare and they would be good to if thats the case.

Aussiemike
I have had the pleasure to hunt in Zim the past five years on my own, with a group and with a friend.
On these past trips the only trouble I have experienced were rifles delayed on the transfer through Johannesburg .
Some tips are; if flying from Sydney or Melbourne do get a flight direct to Jo'Burg, ie, no domestic stop over at Perth or Adelaide.
When flying to Harare from Sydney you can have an appox four hour stop over in Jo'Burg then onto Harare the same day.
When in Jo'Burg terminal for appox one hour go down to the SA ticket counter and ask them to check on the where abouts of your luggage this takes little time, then do this again at the boarding counter when leaving for Zim.
I like to have spare time in Harare incase of delayed luggage and to get over jetlag.
This year I went on my own with two rifles, a 470NE and a 9.3x62 plus ammo {heavy} and as flights from Aus have a twenty KG limit I had to pay a steep add fee for the first time.
Next time I hunt Zim will be for Ele so to minimize the hassle I will only bring the 470NE.
Also Buzz runs a good outfit.
What are you hunting for?
Best luck,
Adam C.

Why don't you consider renting a rifle from your outfitter. No hassle and you don't have to lug one around while on crutches. Most outfitters have 375s and 458s for hire.

As to LJS comments; "Why don't you consider renting a firearm from your outfitter?", I went to RSA with my rifles because I'm a rifle person primarily and a hunter secondarily. I talked to a women who hunted with my outfitter (getting recommendations) and asked what she had used on her cape buffalo. She replied that she didn't remember, she wasn't a "gun person". Well, I am a gun person and understand why you want to take your own firearms and will do so until I am convinced there is little possibility of me returning home with my own guns. I take it from your comments about passing the Westley-Richards on to your grandson that you definately are a gun person. From other comments her and my own experience in RSA and specifically Jo'berg, will be the only "sticky point' you will have with your guns.

We had a 16 hour layover in J'berg. We considered leaving the airport, but our luggage was being checked through to Bulawayo, and if we left the airport, they'd take the luggage off the planes. This would mean we'd have to check our GUNS through SA Customs twice, once in, and once out. This just seemed too painful, so we stayed in the airport the whole time.

They do have a hotel inside the airport that you can stay at without going through customs. I think it was about US$100 for a twelve hour stay. You can get a slot as short as 6 hours if you need.

If I were to do it again (and it looks like we might in June), I'd do it like my travel partner did. He had a larger Pelican hard case with stout locks. He had no problems.

BTW, when going through Zim, they require some sort of official payoff each time you go through customs. I think it was about $30. We paid it on the way in, but they forgot to collect it from us on the way out, even though there were signs posted. I guess keeping your mouth closed about the monies owed worked for our benefit!

I believe I've made 6 trips into zim and never have had a problem, nor do I know of anybody who has. Remember you're bringing foreign currency into zim so you're special people. Stay the hell off of air zim. if you book a flight on air zim odds are against it flying. I've been left on the tarmack more than once because of air zim. If uncle bob or one of his cronies decide to go someplace, they just take the plane and leave you sit.

I didn't mean to identify myself as a non gun person. Couldn't be a more inaccurate description. I made a hunting trip shortly after a knee replacement and was dependent on a cane to get around. If it was not for the assisstance of some very nice people getting around with a backpack, a duffle and a guncase is nearly impossible with a bad leg. My suggestion was simply one made to address the problems encountered in airport travel.

Does Oz really take a lot of rifles? What is the reason they give for taking this action?

AussieMike,

There is no right answer to your question. I will tell you about a couple of experiences that I don't care to repeat in the future .

Two times I have arrived in Zim, only to find that my rifles didn't make it there with me. Luckily, in both cases they eventually showed up, but both times the airline had no idea where they were initially. In both cases they were lost in the terminal in Joburg.

The first time it cost me an extra day in Harare, and one day of my hunt. The second time it cost me two days near Bulawayo, and a day of my hunt, since I had only set aside one day of "airline limbo" in case of a repeat of the original problem .

Due to these problems I am very hesitant to take irreplaceable firearms any more, however I still take "expensive" rifles that have been insured, even one of my vintage "using doubles", but nothing that I have not come to terms with losing. That is the reason that I have both a Rhodda and a Westley Richards in 450-400 3"NE (guess which has been to Africa with me ).

That is another reason that I have switched over almost totally to digital cameras now. I don't have to worry about the film in the luggage inspection devices, and I can carry all the "photos" of my trip on digital media cards in a small case in my shirt pocket on the way home. This way even if my cameras are stolen from my carry-on I still have the trip pics.

Good luck with your decision,
Jim

Bulldog,

We had all our semi autos (rifles in .22LRs, shotguns) and semi pump action shotguns confiscated about 10 years ago. Earlier this year the police in my state were ordered to check that every firearms licence holder had safe storage and, in the process confiscated 20,000+ fireams.

This is all for our safety, of course. There was a front page article in a major newspaper claiming that the fireams laws were a failure because in the ten years since introduction because the number of registered firearms in NSW (population 5 million) had increased from 550,000 to 600, 000. The same article admitted that firearms related crime had dropped during the period - so I think that you can see the real motive.

We've had some race related riots here over the last week - a bunch of people got tired of ethnic gangs intimidating other beach users and attacked some gang members. The gangs retaliated, braeking car wiindscreens and even burning a church (the gangs are Muslim). A number of gang members showed their Glocks to television reporters. Law abiding citizens have been very restricted in access to handguns since the 1930's and there is absolutely no right to own or carry a gun for self defence, so I don't think that these Glocks were legal.

Strangely, the firearms laws don't make me feel any safer.

mike

mbogo375,

I had the WR go missing at Jo'berg in transit to Zim in 1996 and didn't enjoy the 3 days 'til I got it back.

It really is a difficult decision, part of having the rifle is having the memories of the hunts in which it played a part. I'll think about it over Xmas and I'll get some practice with the Brno and decide just before leaving. I got a form from my PH and he wanted rifle serial numbers listed, so I thought I had to decide now, but it seems I've got a bit of time.

mike

Off point but the US media blames the european decendent Aussies for the violence.

Also gun laws only stop the law abiding from having guns, and they weren't the problem to begin with.

Go with your favorites, enjoy them for what they were made for, but take the precation of insurance and Optima to try to make sure they get to you and on time.

JPK

Mike,

Buzz Charlton will get you up CLOSE.

Take the 470 and enjoy yourself!

His partner, Myles McCallum got me to within 9 paces of my cow elephant in November, and this was in open country!!!

Imagine what Buzz can do for you when their is foilage on the trees! You will be shooting them off your boot laces.

This may be the only time you ever hunt africa so take your favorite rifles.

Zimbabwe customs, immigration and airlines treated me as a hunter with more respect comming and going than I got domestically in the USA. Hunters are an important part of the Zim economy and everyone has got the word to treat you and your rifles with courtesy.

I was escorted with my rifles and own personal attendant comming and going. It ws not a busy time of year, but they had excellent control of my rifle and ammo at all times. (And were courteous about it too).

Do not worry about your rifles in Zimbabwe!

Andy