What are they ?

Is the one in the middle a hornady V-Max Moly?

No, it's French. Yes, it's moly.

There's a prize for the identification of the 2 cartridges on left and right, the one in the middle is a .50 BMG. What are the two other rounds ?

The winner receives a DCB Brass cleaner package, air delivered.

Bah, all I know about anything French is crepes.

With that background, I feel I can say with absolute confidence that neither of the two on the left and right are crepes.

The one on the left is it a lathe turned solid bronze match.Right looks like ball.

The one in the center is made of a cold drawn brass sabot and a forged bronze insert, they are assembled and machined to exact specifications.

the left and right ammo are identical, they are not .50 BMG.

Are they Russian 12.7 mm?

Nope!

Give me 20 minutes with 'em in a machine shop and they CAN BE ...

Only problem is that russian/soviet Doushka uses lacquered steel not brass.

quote:

Originally posted by Ben589:
Is the one in the middle a hornady V-Max Moly?

No V Max in .50 , only A Max as shown here.

Yeah, I don't know what I was thinking earlier ... V's are for the little guys for varmint rounds.

I remembered Hornady made a Moly 50, but didn't remember "which" max it was. Thanks for the update.

I've got it!
Individual French Army brandy field ration thermos in 50 cal configuration to more easily link a weeks rations in spent links to ease distribution and carrying.
Jim
PS
If it was US issue I'd know what they were also.
Field tampons for female E-6 and above.

Looks like ---13.2 x 96 and/or 13.2 x 99 ??--Hotchkiss designed heavy machine guns and
Breda 1931, Japan used one I think.Ed

Getting very close, have to click a bit for the elevation.

quote:

Originally posted by Ben589:
Yeah, I don't know what I was thinking earlier ... V's are for the little guys for varmint rounds.

I remembered Hornady made a Moly 50, but didn't remember "which" max it was. Thanks for the update.

Sorry, no moly coated Hornady .50, I did it with my own product.

quote:

Originally posted by arkypete:
I've got it!
Individual French Army brandy field ration thermos in 50 cal configuration to more easily link a weeks rations in spent links to ease distribution and carrying.
Jim
PS
If it was US issue I'd know what they were also.
Field tampons for female E-6 and above.

Big, expensive and kick like hell!! Did I win??? LOL

13.2mm/76

all those who think 13,2 mm are very close but there were 13 mm before the 13.2 mm.

quote:

Originally posted by coues:
Big, expensive and kick like hell!! Did I win??? LOL

No because you forgot almost unknown, disappeared and extremely rare.

The winner is hubel458

quote:

Originally posted by hubel458:
Looks like ---13.2 x 96 and/or 13.2 x 99 ??--Hotchkiss designed heavy machine guns and
Breda 1931, Japan used one I think.Ed

Nobody will cite exactly the right name and you are really close:
In 1915, in order to use incendiary ammunition against the artillery balloons and the Zeppelin, the French modified the old 11 mm round used in the 1874 gras rifle to become an incendiary round and build a Heavy Machine Gun to use this ammo.
This was a rim case and the ordnance began to work on a rimless case for a bigger round once the situation stabilized on the front lines.
In 1916 a 13mm x 93 mm ammo was produced and adopted in 1917, it was modified in 1918 with a case lenghtened to 96 mm to have more power against armored targets.( the round described below on the data sheet of Hotchkiss to SFM)
It was again lenghtened to 99 mm ( the round of the quiz) and used mainly in Air Force.

The last modification was to increase the diameter to 13.2 mm, it was copied by Japan, Italy, Germany.

Only one member on a french board gave me the exact name and datas, he was a former aviation technician and knew the history of the development of Hotchkiss 13 mm ammo and MG.

It is said that the Chauchat (1915) gave the idea of the BAR 1918 to JM Browning and the 13 mm Hotchkiss (1916) the idea of the .50 BMG.




hubel 458, please confirm your mailing adress for the shipping of the DCB Brass cleaner.

Thank you Sir-
Address-Ed Hubel
7450 W. Stevenson Lake Rd
Lake, MI
48632 -- USA

On the way! congrats!

Thanks Edmond,
I was just being silly LOL.
Coues

quote:

Originally posted by coues:
Thanks Edmond,
I was just being silly LOL.
Coues

As long as you play silly, I don't worry about you. Life is too short to cross it without humour.

The one in the center

The biggest rounds I am playing with at the moment are 45-110 and 45-120 sharps. LOl. Working up loads in i 500 535 and 545 semi spitzer,round nosed and in postell type bullets.
The wife says I have way too many silly moments. LOL I was pretty doped up when I made that last post. The docs stuck a rather large caliber needle full of pain killers and steroids in my bursa!! LOL I swear that thing was in the 50 bmg league LOL.
Coues

I got some mails inquiring about the 'waves' on the sabot, it allow the bullets to have less abrasion in the barrel since there is less contact surface like for an artillery shell and its belts.
There is much less barrel erosion.

I sent some to test to an american friend, I mailed to tell him this forum opened, he can post to share his experience.

http://worldatwar.net/chandelle/v2/v2n1/hd1for.html


One or two Belgian Hanriots were the subject of an interesting and highly successful armament experiment. By 1917, the Hanriot's single .303-cal Vickers machine gun was seriously inadequate. Like the Italians before them, the Belgians experimented with twin Vickers guns, but found that performance suffered too severely with the extra weight. The single weapon was a particular liability during the balloon-busting sorties that were Coppens' specialty. With high-speed winches reeling in the target and zeroed-in antiaircraft guns firing at the attacker's aircraft, there was little time for the deliberate shooting that light-weight armament demanded. Accordingly, the French sent Coppens an early prototype of a new, purpose-built weapon, the "balloon gun." This was a license-built Vickers chambered for an experimental, high-velocity 11-mm (.45 cal.) cartridge (inspired, no doubt, by the standard, early-war anti-balloon weapon, a .45-cal, low-velocity incendiary bullet fired from a Victorian-era Martini-Henry carbine). Coppens had the gun fitted to one of his several Hanriots (No. 17) and used it alongside the standard machines. Coppens considered the experiment a great success. The 11-mm gun was far more effective than two of the standard 7.7-mm (.303 cal.) weapons but weighed less. At least one other Belgian Hanriot may have carried the gun, but the weapons never reached production due to the end of the war. Interestingly, the 11-mm balloon gun inspired one of the most successful automatic weapons of all times, the .50-cal (12.7-mm) Browning. The U.S. Army in France wanted to produce the French weapon in the USA for use against the armored loopholes of late-war German machine-gun nests and pill boxes. But, in a foretaste of the M-16 controversy of the 1960s, the Ordnance Department refused to accept the French cartridge without modifications, citing the allegedly sub-optimal ballistics of the 11-mm projectile. Ordinance set out to "improve" on the foreign product and, some years after the end of the war, came out with an altogether different but ultimately successful cartridge.

Note from Ed

I found just a small mistake, the incendiary low velocity 11 mm round at the beginning of the war was in fact a 11 mm Gras 1874 that was still in french forces inventory and was still used by the territorial defense units at the back of the front lines.

Vickers modified a HMG for this round. funnily the French developped a rimless 13 mm when the German made a 13 mm with a rim based on the 11 mm Gras but lenghtened to 92 mm.