I know the big JDJ calibers are great, but I want something in a 10" barrel length for deer, caribou, black bear, and possibly moose? I do have a .300 Whisper, that I love, but wondering about other possibilites? Thanks for your help! Dennis e-mail at dmadriaga@ascg.com
I would go with a 12" or 12" Hunter bbl. in 35 Rem loaded to 40,000 CUP (stiffer) loads than the factory rounds.
Usable barrel length in the Hunter bbl is about 10 3/4 or 11" and I can get around 2000 to 2100 with a 180 out of it with a safe load. The 200 gr Core-Lokt component bullet is also an excellent bullet for the shorter distances.
I have an excellent article by Jay Turner on the 35 Rem Contender he uses in Alaska if you would like a scanned copy.
It's a tough call being that you mention some good sized animals there. To me a 12" tube is a good compromise between short and long tubes with the performance trade-off.
but I want something in a 10" barrel length for deer, caribou, black bear, and possibly moose?
My Thought in a 10" barrel would be 445 SUPER MAG
Look in the reloading books at the energy and FPS of the 250 and 300 grain bullets. In a 10" barrel this may be the ULTIMATE chambering. And with the option of all the new HARD CAST bullets up to 325 grains and Hornady has reintroduced the 265 flat point that worked so well in the 444.
With the 445 in a 10" barrel you will get a lot of KILLING power in a small package.
quote:Originally posted by Fireball: but I want something in a 10" barrel length for deer, caribou, black bear, and possibly moose?
My Thought in a 10" barrel would be 445 SUPER MAG
Look in the reloading books at the energy and FPS of the 250 and 300 grain bullets. In a 10" barrel this may be the ULTIMATE chambering. And with the option of all the new HARD CAST bullets up to 325 grains and Hornady has reintroduced the 265 flat point that worked so well in the 444.
With the 445 in a 10" barrel you will get a lot of KILLING power in a small package.
Just my thoughts
Fireball
I know Dennis likes recoil, but the .445 SM in a 10" barrel is brutal.
Mike
Posts: 791 | Location: Grants Pass, OR USA | Registered: 30 March 2002
For a 10" barrel, .357 Maximum is awfully hard to beat.
Rechambered, tapered factory barrels are good, but even better handling yet is an untapered custom barrel in .357 Max. Just seems "right."
I have not made any .414 Super Mags yet, but this might prove to be a good 10" round not too difficult to handle without a brake.
A tapered factory barrel rechamber I did last summer was not too hard to hang onto test firing it.
This may be about the upper limit before a brake becomes nearly mandatory, and with just 10" of barrel, in smaller bore sizes, I don't think you want to give up barrel length to a brake.
On the other hand, larger bore sizes like .44 Mag. work well with short barrel lengths and don't give up as much to a brake as the smaller calibers.
That .44 Mag of Sean's is a sweetheart to shoot, and it is only 8" including the brake.
Headstamp and possibly others here have had braked sub-10" barrels in .44 Mag. and can lend some insight on that subject.
Mike
Posts: 791 | Location: Grants Pass, OR USA | Registered: 30 March 2002
Hey Dennis, When you said you wanted a 10 incher I started laughing and remembered years back when I stopped by JD's, he had a 8 incher in 375JDJ in the stubs inventory. OUCH!!!!!
[ 01-07-2003, 08:01: Message edited by: HHI6818 ]
Posts: 104 | Location: Ohio USA | Registered: 16 March 2002
quote:Originally posted by Mike Bellm: I know Dennis likes recoil, but the .445 SM in a 10" barrel is brutal.
Mike
You got that right!!!! The 10" 445 is a serious handful!!!! I bought one during the TC barrel close out several years ago and, as Mike described, it was absolutely brutal. I shot some hot 300 grain loads in that barrel (no scope) and I finally resorted to wearing a shooting glove to keep it from peeling skin from my hand when I shot it!
I have a brand new 12" stainless VVCG 445 barrel that really needs to be exercised.....wish I had been smart enough to have it drilled for front sights......guess I'll just have to put a low power scope on it and wring it out!
Posts: 1499 | Location: NE Okla | Registered: 22 May 2002
Maybe a narrowing down of the criteria is in order. What ranges/hunting situations are we looking at? Are you going to scope it?
I too thought of the 44's and such but figured in the recoil area would be rough in the 10" tube.
I agree the Max is about there in recoil in an unbraked bbl. If you could get close to a moose, might be the one. Herrett or Rem can go a couple hundred FPS more though. Like the sectional density of the 35 bullets too.
My 44 Mag snubby is unbraked and honestly anything with a heavier than about 280 gr bullet is rough to shoot alot. I've actually gone down to the standard 240 gr WFN at about 1400-1500.
No Mike, don't shoot much heavy kickers lately. Last big bore was a stainless 11 1/4" SSK .50 American Eagle encore barrel. It shot pulled .50 BMG 700 Armor Piercing pulled bullets under an inch at 50 yards, and easily shot 500 Maximum ballistics with bullet weights from 350 grainers all the way up to 495 lead bullets. Recoil actually wasn't as bad as I thought, but Encore is just a little too big for my small hands. I'm just in that project mode again? Prefer the 10" balance, but "might" stretch it to 12 1/2"?????
i just got a 480r -10bbl,if you handload will handle any of the animals you stated,plus side will also shoot the 475 linebaugh chamber is so big,plenty of cast bullets out there for anything.
You know my answer, 357 max. It'll easily push 200 gr cast 1800 fps, which is a very shootable load. It would not be my first choice for moose, but I would have no qualms using it on black bears, black tails or caribou.
PS, if those 150 gr jacketed bullets become available, then I figure we can push them 2200 fps, which will extend the range just a tad for critters in the 200-300# range.
[ 01-08-2003, 22:45: Message edited by: Paul H ]
Posts: 7213 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 27 February 2001
I also like and agree with the 357max and 44mag suggestions. I have both and bought them specifically for hunting after going through a lot of other cartridge/barrel combinations.
I also have a 375Win that would certainly do it but mine's 14" and I dunno how much you'd lose at 10".
The 445 Super Mag in 10" is beyond brutal to the hand, ears, and sensibilities. I've shot one and have no desire to shoot one again or be near anyone shooting one.
quote:Originally posted by LDHunter: I also like and agree with the 357max and 44mag suggestions. I have both and bought them specifically for hunting after going through a lot of other cartridge/barrel combinations.
I also have a 375Win that would certainly do it but mine's 14" and I dunno how much you'd lose at 10".
The 445 Super Mag in 10" is beyond brutal to the hand, ears, and sensibilities. I've shot one and have no desire to shoot one again or be near anyone shooting one.
$bob$
I have a 10" 357 Herrett that I've shot several deer with with excellent results. Recently I purchased a 12" Hunter barrel in 375 Win and it's quickly become a favorite of mine. The ported barrel creates a bit of a racket when a round is touched off, the recoil reduction is well worth the increased muzzle blast. For light game, the 220 gr. Hornady FP would be my choice, and the 225 gr Hornady or 260 Nosler BT a good choice for something bigger like moose.
If ammo availability is a concern, the 35 Remincton or even 30-30 might be a better choice.
Posts: 940 | Location: Oregon | Registered: 23 November 2002
quote:Originally posted by Grey Eagle: 357 Herrett! Maximum efficiency in a 10" barrel compared to many others without skull rattling recoil. Also deadly accurate.
I used to think that until getting a 357 max. You get nearly identicle velocity, but burn 2/3 the powder to achieve that speed. Also no effort to make brass. In my 357 Herret, it maxed out at 1950 fps w/ 200 gr WFN's, but accuracy was in the 1850-1900 fps range. The 357 max pushes 200's 1800+ accurately.
Posts: 7213 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 27 February 2001
The 357 Herrett was designed for a 10 inch barrel, which makes it hard to beat. I also like the 357 Max. I prefer to get as much Feet-per-Second as possible out of my 10 inch barrels (when I use them for hunting) because higher velocity is more forgiving on misjudged ranges. For that reason, I would say away from bigger but slower cartridges (plus my bum wrist can't handle much punishment). Good Luck
Mike Bellm, How would a 10" 445 SuperMag do with one of your machined in brakes? I have a 10" .44 Mag with the toilet bowl throat that I have considered rechambering mostly to get the bullet closer to the rifling. I did a Cerrosafe chamber cast of this one and I couldn't believe it when I took some measurements! Just for test purposes I had to seat a 310 gr Lee cast bullet out to 1.975 COL just to get it to touch the rifling!! Anyhow, if I was to get it rechambered,recrowned, and your brake machined in I would think that it should be tolerable as far as recoil. Anybody else have such a beast? Any comments or feedback would be appreciated.
That's one of those Williams blades up front? What height are you running and how's your point of impact with heavier bullets?
Regards
Headstamp,
That is part of a discontinued T/C fiber optic sight set generously given me by Mike Sirois at MBMCO. Specifically for the 44mag, and point of impact is great
Posts: 830 | Location: Virginia, USA | Registered: 08 March 2002
quote:Originally posted by Andrew Hostetler: Mike Bellm, How would a 10" 445 SuperMag do with one of your machined in brakes? I have a 10" .44 Mag with the toilet bowl throat that I have considered rechambering mostly to get the bullet closer to the rifling. I did a Cerrosafe chamber cast of this one and I couldn't believe it when I took some measurements! Just for test purposes I had to seat a 310 gr Lee cast bullet out to 1.975 COL just to get it to touch the rifling!! Anyhow, if I was to get it rechambered,recrowned, and your brake machined in I would think that it should be tolerable as far as recoil. Anybody else have such a beast? Any comments or feedback would be appreciated.
Andrew, While shortening the toilet bowl/.4" long forcing cone is a noble endeavor, a 10" barrel is going to have quite a shock wave coming back at you with a lot of powder unburned blasting out the front end. 12" barrels are a pretty good minimum, but I doubt you would warm up to a 10."
The blast at the brake does jerk the barrel forward and depress it, but you still get the recoil of the bullet accelerating regardless. The tapered 10" factory barrels are noticeably lighter than the untapered factory 12" Hunter barrels, and thus you will get more recoil with the tapered 10."
I'm not really too sure who the 10" factory .44s were made for or what to do with one, except find someone who likes it more than you do.
Mike
Posts: 791 | Location: Grants Pass, OR USA | Registered: 30 March 2002
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Just figured from the standpoint of a standard caliber and dies. You could go the 35 Rem Rimmed route too.
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