Does anybody use target turrets on their scopes for long range work? I'm looking for glass to top my new to me .308 with, and am contemplating putting an elevation turret on the scope to allow me to hold hair not air for beyond 250 yds. As far as I know only leupold offers target turrets, and I haven't heard back from them about installing them on their pistol scopes.

Paul,
I use target turrets.
Some only have the elevation turret while others have both.
Burris offers their LER's with target turrets.
All of my hunting SP's have Burris (with either the Ballistic Plex Reticle and one Burris rifle scope has the Ballistic Plex Mil-Dot Reticle) on them with the exception of one with a Leupold Mark 4 8.5-20 side focus with TMR.
The BP reticle is very fast in the field (out to 450 yds. or so), but when ranges get longer turning knobs is the only way to go.

Paul: You might also consider a 300 yd. sight in. For for a 165 Gr. 308 Nosler Ballistic tip bullet, with a Bc of .475, the trajectory is as follows with a 300m yd. sight in at 2,400 fps: 100 yds. + 6.4", 200 yds. + 7.2", 300 yds 0, 400 yds - 17.2 inches, which allows you to aim slightly low out to 200 yards, dead on at 300, and with a slight hold over at 400 yds...Rusty.

Check these guys out before you lay down alot of cash for a turret scope:

http://www.kentonindustries.com/

Ron

300 yd zero has way too arched of a trajectory for me, I'd hate to shoot over or make a high wounding hit with such an arched trajectory. I just don't see a short barreld 308 as much more than a 300 yd round anyhow, so 200-250 yd zero should do the trick.

Paul H: The flight of a bullet is pretty well fixed by physics: The velocity it starts at, the weight and BC of the bullet, the angle of departure, and wind if any, all determinr the drop a bullet will take. You can't make a bullet fly any flatter by what yardage you sight it in at, you just change the aim points with your sight in zero...Rusty.

I worded my post incorrectly, true trajectory is trajectory.

What I meant was I want my Point of Impact (POI) to be reasonably close to my Point of Aim (POA) With a 300 yd zero for the given load, and 100 yd POI 6.4" higher than POA, and 200 yd 7.2" higher than POA, I'd imagine 150 yd POI would be some 9" higher than POA. Our blacktails are fairly small, and thus I'd be looking at alot of shots that would be high lung, iffy spine or over for the majority of the shots I'd take.

I'd much rather be ~3" high at 100, on at 200, and ~4" low at 250 and dial in elevation for further shots, where'd I'd have the time, then miss high for the closer shots.

It's all become sort of an achedemic excercise anyhow as it looks like I'll have to sell the encore before I get a chance to hunt with it.

Paul H: Sighting the 165 Gr 308 Ballistic Tip bullet in at 200 yards at a muzzle velocity of 2,400 fps would make the bullet + 2.8" at 100 yds, dead on at 200 yds, -10.8" low at 300 yds and - 31.6" low at 400 yds per Nosler Reloading Guide No 4.

It's easier to judge yardiage and hold over closer to the gun than it is farther out, and easier to hold on hair than it is in the air over the back once you get used to the low holds, still on hair, required with the 300 yard zero closer to the gun. But if you aren't going to be shooting any farther than 300 yards, which is still a long ways for a handgun, either a 200 or a 300 yard zero should work just fine.

Turrets work great on the range because you are shooting at known distances. Out in the field, hunting, you need to range the animal so you know where to set the turret, which introduces a new set of complications into the equasion.

Using a 300 yard zero, you use a military 6 o'clock sight picture. Sighting into the hair slightly below the animal at distances under 100 yards, and putting the belly on the cross hair out to 200 yards. At 300 yards you hold dead on, and set the cross hair on top of the back, with a little air showing underneath at 400 yards.

You have positive points to aim at all distances from point blank out to 400 yards, not holding on the point of impact but close enough to it so that you know exactly what you are doing. once you get used to using this system, it becomes very quick and automatic. It's the same sight picture you use with a shot gun, so it comes pretty natural if you do several different types of shooting.

I have my 22 LR barrel sighted in an inch high at 50 yards so I can set a squirrel's head on top of the cross hair and see the whole head when the head is all that I can see, giving me a better margin for error than a point of impact hold would. At 100 yards, I use the heavy lower portion of the vertical plex cross hair as my elevation aiming point. Give it a try with your small bore and see what you think.

I think you will find holding on the bottom of the bull's eye at the range to be a lot easier than trying to hold on the center of the bulls eye. I had a friend who was apretty successful benchrest shooter. He attributed a lot of his success to aligning the right side of the vertical crosshair with the left side of a 1 inch spotter and the horizontal crosshair with the bottom of the spotter. He said a center hold wasn't precise enough. Give that a try the next time you shoot some groups and see if it isn't better than holding in the center...Rusty.

Rusty,

I figure a rangefinder is necessary for any application when your shooting beyond your PBR, and at longer distances, one has the time to check out ranges and be sure of how far far is. Much easier to misguess 325 yds vs 300 yds.

I've always lined up the crosshairs on the corner of target squares and agree it is the mose precise way to aim, especially with low power scopes and heavier duplex reticles. I can shoot 3/4" groups all day long with my 350 Rigby rifle topped with a 2.5X scope, when holding on the corners of squares.

I've used the bottom of the plex for shooting the 22 at 100 yds, lotsa fun!

Paul H: I'm using the Burris 3 to 12 pistol scope on my 6.5 Dreadnaught. The heavy part of the plex substends a 6" bull at 100 rards when on 12 power. That means it will bracket 12" at 200 amd 18" at 300 yards, so I have a range finder built right into my scope.

It won't necessarily be the same as the way it has worked out for me with my Burris, but the same thing can be done by anyone using a plex type reticle in any scope. You just have to find out what your reticle substends at the range using a measured grid. It's quick and efficient, with no extra investments to make or extra gear to have to pack along hunting, for those of you who don't already own a range finder...Rusty.

If using a plex reticle while hunting i always put the reticle stadia to work. My 17 Mach IV XP has the 4-12X Burris Compact on it with the plex reticle. The reticle subtends 2.7 MOA to the post tip which puts me dead on at 340 yds. I also establish a tactical interpolative system for closer ranges as well by dividing the drop in MOA by the reticle's subtension. Recently i shot a 2" group at 300 yds. using an interpolative zero of .6 of the reticle's post tip subtension. Interpolative zeroing between stadia is not a bad way to go, and is surprisingly very accurate. It's based on the same system used by mil-dot guys for ranging. I also do the same for windage as well.

Another way to go is to establish the magnification that the plex post tip zeros at 300 yds. Say u have the 2.5-8X Leupold with plex post tip. According to the website the subtension is 2.65 inch per hundred yard (IPHY) to lower post tip @ 8X. If u decrease magnification you increase reticle subtension, and it's linear, so if u want a 300 yd. reference and the drop at that range is 10.8" as mentioned earlier then that's 3.6 IPHY. Since 2.65 IPHY is 73.6% of 3.6 IPHY, then that corresponds to 6 magnification, since 6X is also 73.6% of 8X. So set the scope to 6X and that should be your 300 yd. zero (assuming the power ring is calibrated properly).

After all this i usually use a turret also once the range strethces beyond the lower post's zero using the lower post as my zero reference.

1 BIG advantage of using an elevation turret is it gives long-range zeroing a lot more flexibility for rezeroing with condition changes-- especially when using a ballistic reticle.

Here's a link to the system i use for tactical reticle applications including reticle ranging with any multi-stadia reticle by using the "modified mil-ranging formula"--

www.ottllc.com/specialtypistols/sp20.pdf