Just received my 22" 6.5JDJ, so I have about 40 cases to form. Being the cheap a$$ that I am. I was looking for a way to form these cases with out using a bullet. Did some searches on the net and found this:

"For those of us who tinker with wildcat cartridges and the like, sometimes fire-forming cases can be a tedious, and costly endeavor. For the Ackley versions of more popular cartridges, the common practice is to shoot standard ammo to fire-form cases. Try this for nice, well filled out shoulder definition and great looking cases without wasting a bullet to do it. Use a light charge of fast burning flake type shotgun or handgun powder loaded over any primer, fill the remainder of the case with either cornmeal or cream of wheat, then plug the neck with paraffin wax, by inserting the neck into a block of wax, resulting in a plug of wax filling the neck and sealing the cartridge. Then simply point in a safe direction and fire. The resulting case will be well filled out in the chamber. In the past I have used this to make everything from .458 Winchester out of .338 Winchester, in a pinch; to make great .375 Winchester cases from .30-30 or .32 Special and to fire-form a whole host of Ackley type improved cases from .223 Imp. to .375 H&H Imp. Favorite powders for this are Red Dot and Unique."

Has anyone here tried this? Sounds like it should work.

John

The only problem with that method is sometimes you'll want the case held firmly against the breachface in a firearm like the Contender.

You may be able to get away with this in the 6.5 JDJ IF there is minimal clearance at the rim counterbore as opposed to the rim thickness of the case itself. Thus you could use the rim itself for headspacing the fireforming load. Also, consider how much gap clearance there is between the standing breachface and the end of the barrel.

If there is a goodly amount of clearance, you need a fireforming method that holds the case against the breachface. The JDJ round among others blows the shoulder forward considerably.

You would use either the secondary shoulder method without a bullet or use a method with a bullet and seat it into the rifling to hold the case back under the firing pin strike.

You could pick up some of the OEM 6.5 bullets for a reasonably priced fireforming bullet.

Regards

John,
I don't use this method but I know of folks that do. They say it works fine.

I hate to prove what an idiot I am, but i used my fireforming rounds to find what bullet/powder my 6.5JDJ liked. Then after I had them fireformed, took the best 2 or 3 groups (can't remember for sure) and tweaked those. Got a couple groups in the .5" range - all luck I'm sure. Bottom line, didn't really waste any of the powder/bullets that way.

steve

Steve,

I have read/heard that the JDJ round is very accurate with even fireforming loads so as you say, the bullets really wouldn't be wasted from a standpoint of just being able to shoot them into the dirt.

Other rounds I'm sure behave this way too so, I think you used your noggin quite well and logically in finding some good loads for your 6.5 barrel by interpolating off of your fireforming loads.



[ 08-31-2002, 02:59: Message edited by: Headstamp ]

Headstamp,

After I posted this I started to think about some of the things you talked about in your post and
have come to the conclusion that I think it would be best to use bullets.

Steve,

What you said sounds good to me. If a load preforms well with sloppy chamber fit, then that seems a good place to start with a formed case.

John

When I first got my 309JDJ I figured I would use the cheapest bullets I had to fireform. I had 150gr win silvertips and 150gr rems. and loaded up 50 rounds of each with a reduced load for fireforming. They were all shot at 50yds and at the time, all I wanted to do is to get these cases formed so I can load them high dollar bullets. Well almost all of the fireformed loads came in at under an inch at 50 and that was 20 shots or so at the same bull. I was shooting at 1 or 2 targets and wasn't looking for accuracy, just wanted to get them cases formed. Took me about 3 or 4 times at the range with the Noslers and Sierras and Speers till I thought to myself...Maybe I should try the same bullets I used to fireform. The high dollar bullets did and still do shoot great in the barrel, But I have no problem gettin 3/4 to 1", 5 shot groups @ 100 out of them cheap bullets
What I'm saying is, don't think that just because a bullet is cheaper it can't be accurate.

So what does this have to do with this thread? I don't know, but i'll bet I wont get in trouble posting it.

[ 08-31-2002, 03:42: Message edited by: Jules ]

Jules,

I know what you mean. I have S&W 29-2 and it will not shoot Nosler bullets at all. I tried three powders and the best I could get was 3.5" @ 25 yrd. But with XTP's it will go under 2" if I do my part. Go figure.

John,
I have a 5" 629 classic and scoped I have got 2" groups at 75yds with the Nosler 200gr JHP and 200gr XTPs. This is just a factory gun...no custom work.
My custom 7 1/2" Ruger SRH will do 2 1/2" at 100 with Sierra 240JHP and 3" is the norm for all other bullets. It's been worked over by Jack Weigand.

I tried the flake powder and stuffing technigue in a 218 mashburn bee, and a 357 Herret. I didn't care too much for the technique, shoulders never formed sharply, and to do so, you'd have to run the pressures right up there, something I'd be very weary of doing with a fast powder.

Best bet is to pick up some cheap 6.5 pills and send them down range. Most of us don't live in areas where you can discharge a firearm in your backyard, projectile or no! Since that means you'll likely be at the range, you might as well be making holes in paper.

Just pick-up some Remington 120 gr SP. I'll use these to form the cases. There is an in-door ranger about 10 min down the road that has a rifle range. It's only 25 yd, but good enough for sighting the squirrel rifle and case forming.

I used to have a formula to use as rule of thumb but be damned if I can find it.
I'm with the rest tho, bulk bullets are cheap and if your going to pull the trigger anyway might as well get some enjoyment and let it go bang. I found my most accurate 7-30 load using these bullets and thats nice to use cheap bullets when ya just punch paper anyway.

Wes

Inexpensive fireforming is a snap. All you have to do is form a false or intermediate shoulder and you can form with no possibility of the case moving. I do this all the time with the 7TCU. Had my benchrest gunsmith turn up an expanding mandrel about .010 LARGER than the bullet diameter. One pass over the oversized mandrel then just run it thru your fl die which is set high and just bump the shoulder down in small steps till the breech or action just closes with a "feel"over the newly formed shoulder. Looks weird as hell but works the best. The case is held securely and you may fireform with powder and a wad or a cheap bullet. Chioce is yours. Regards