XP Hunter, My idea of long range is above 300 yds.I'm looking for a 300-400 yd shot at a dear(with alot of practice). my shots may be questionable, I only shot at head. my idea is a bad shot is a miss. so I must have accuracy and power. Thanks for help. what about custom bolt gun. thanks CFP

cfp,
I have several custom bolt guns (Centergrip XP-100's 6.5-284, 284 Win., & 7.82 Patriot ) and a MOA. Another shooter mentioned 6-284 which would be a flat shooter. I would lean toward the 25-284 or 6.5-284, 25WSM or 6.5WSM. I don't know if MOA will build you anything longer than a 14 inch. I am also unsure if the WSM case will work in the MOA.
With these larger case capacities I would prefer the 15-16 inch barrel. My rule of thumb is that cases based off of the 284 (6-284, 25-284, 6.5-284) will basically equal rifle length velocities of cartridges designed off of the 308 case (243 Win., 25 Super, 260 Remington). The WSM's and short action Lazzeroni cases are going to give you 06 case capacity rifle velocities. Bullet selection (that will perform correctly over a wide range of velocities--this is harder to find than one would think) for given animal, especially elk becomes paramount. A Ballistic Plex Reticule, chronograph, Laser Rangefinder, and a great field rest would be a neccesity to be consistent at long ranges in field conditions for me. Practicing with field rests at 300 yards or beyond is equally important, to learn how your bullet reacts to wind. I want to know as much as humanly possible what that bullet is going to do and how it is going to react to wind and body tissue.
I personally prefer center-grip over rear grip but that is "just" my preference.
I will shoot @ big game beyond 300 yards under the right conditions, but not head shots. It is possible to wound a deer with a head shot also, like blowing off part of the lower jaw. I go for the heart/lung area. I have passed up shots under 150 yards, because I believed I would wound animal and I have taken big game beyond 300 yards feeling as sure as a person can feel that I would not only hit the animal, but put him down with one shot. Shooting game at or beyond 300 yards is controversial for some and can hurt the sport if animals are wounded or if people do not understand the technical level and many hours of practice that go into the shot. The animal we hunt deserve to die humanly also. This year I was hunting whitetail with 7.82 Patriot XP-100 which was set-up dead on @ 300 yards with a 150 grain Ballistic Tip (MV 3001 f.p.s.) and was pleased as pie to make a 30 yard standing off-hand shot. I also do a lot of practice with revolvers and semi-auto handguns and was sure glad. Sorry for being so long-winded, but there is so much more than cartridge selection involved for me anyways.
xphunter

[ 02-13-2003, 17:05: Message edited by: xphunter ]

CFP, I am XP's hunting partner, though not willingly... Believe it or not I met him hitchhiking in northern CO 20 or so odd years ago. He had a brochure sitting on the seat about Contenders, and was getting ready to purchase one. He had very little experience reloading at the time, and i showed how to do it for general hunting. Now 20 years later I often consider him my main source for technical information about accuracy reloading techniques...though not willingly.
We have been recently investigating the application of big cases/high B.C. bullets with the aid of laser rangefinders, and reference reticle/target turret scopes for more precise placement of bullets at long-range in the field. His specialty is big game, and mine is coyotes. Not long ago I came out with a portable target design that I can set up at any range to assess group shooting performance at long-range. It is some of the most fascinating work I've ever done, and until it is tested shooters will never know what is possible UNDER THE RIGHT CONDITIONS. This last year we attended Don Bowers Long-Range Pistol Shooting Seminar which was very educational and enlightening for us also. I have followed XP's advice when it comes to selectiion of components/reloading techniques, and it hasbeen working well for me (I'm obtaining less than M.O.A. performance out to 700 yds. so far-- the limit of my testing as yet). and have done well on coyotes beyond 300 yds. with a 6.5-284 Win XP.