Your last post clarified your stance, and I have to agree with you..My posts intent was simplistic, a common fault with my post as I seldom put a lot of thought into..

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Glock is the first cousin to the Matel Toy, the most worthless pistol in the history of mankind! Pistols need to be made of steel!

Yeah, that's why the Glock is one of the most (if not the most) popular/widely used handgun in the world.

WRONG! The Glock has its preeminence strictly through fantastic merchandising, + very savvy sales reps. Also easy to use for a novice that has no concept about how firearms work.

quote:

Originally posted by NormanConquest:
WRONG! The Glock has its preeminence strictly through fantastic merchandising, + very savvy sales reps. Also easy to use for a novice that has no concept about how firearms work.

OK, so what is RIGHT! ?

I have seen 10 glocks 17/19 shoot 40,0000 rounds between then - average 4000 - in 6 hours with 200 different shooters handling them.

There was not a single malfunction that was not user induced and there were few user induced malfunctions.

No other handgun or rifle offers that kind of dependability.

Mike

As an law enforcement firearms instructor and armorer.

I have seen thousands of handguns being fired. Many different makes and models.

They have fired hundreds of thousands of rounds.

99 percent of Handguns from the major manufactures work well out of the box.

They all can turn out a bad one. They are made out of mass produce parts on a assembly line.

One tends to hear about the ones that do not work. Not the thousands that do.

The same with modern ammunition.

Here is what the cause of handgun failures.

Number 1 shooter error.

Number 2 improper mainitance. IE shooter error shooter failure to do mainitance.

Number 3 defective ammo.
#3-4 could be switched it is close.
Number 4 poor/defective magazines

Number 5 defective firearm

Remember these apply to the major manufactures.

The 2nd rate manufactures have a much higher rate of firearm failures caused by poor firearms.

quote:

WRONG! The Glock has its preeminence strictly through fantastic merchandising, + very savvy sales reps. Also easy to use for a novice that has no concept about how firearms work.

And other firearms manufacturers are incapable of doing the same thing?

The simple fact is that the Glock "safe action" trigger design is a game changer. Why did American manufacturers not think of this? Well, because they were busy making money selling the same 'ol single action pistols to blue blooded Americans!
I own several Glocks and several safe
action pistols.
Peter.

There are many good usable handguns on the market.

My idea of a good handgun for self-defense.

Is one they go bang when you pull the trigger each and every time.

They are accurate enough to get the job done.

They are in a caliber the is powerful enough to get the Job done.

I prefer them in materials that stand up. Stainless steal and composites.

I do not carry extra small handguns very much any more. the smallest I carry is a Glock 23.

If your a experienced handgun user you can adapt to using any trigger system.

Boy howdy, caused a feeding frenzy...Give me steel and wood on any firearm like a HI Power or 1911, I doubt the 40,000 rounds and even more for that matter, but do believe several world wars and many clashes set the 1911 and the Browning apart from plastic and a sales pitch..

quote:

but do believe several world wars and many clashes set the 1911 and the Browning apart from plastic and a sales pitch..

Like most handguns military ones are carried a lot and shot little.

Except those used for training.

Want to look at handguns that are shot a lot. Look to the ones used for training and competition.

Nothing wrong with steel 1911's and the high powers.

But new materials have pasted them by.

Same old, same old, bottom line is pack what you can shoot and whats proven itself to you and you alone..and now the HI Power comes in a 40 caliber, thats interresting..I have no use for one, but you can bet I will own one asap...

I have two Browning Hi-Powers in 40 S&W, and love them! Also, one in 9mm.

I keep 4 Beretta 81BB mags loaded for long periods and have not had any issues. Three of them were loaded for three years before I emptied them at the range. If you had some really old mags I could imagine there might could be an issue with weakening springs .

Not sure if the OP's question has been answered sufficiently.

Current thinking is that cycling a spring does more damage than leaving it compressed for extended periods.

One of my pistols lives fully loaded and cocked almost all the time. I have 5 mags for it. Two remain fully loaded (one in the gun, one in the holster) When I shoot it, I usually use the other 3 mags. The carry mags only get cycled when I replace my carry ammo.

After about 25 years of use, some of those other 3 have started causing infrequent stoppages. The carry mags (and the mainspring) are all still fine.

Gun is a Star Model 30PK.

Regarding the conversation about Eddie Rickenbacker: I have read in a number of accounts that ammo dimensional consistency in WWI was not what we are used to today, and it was not all that uncommon to get over-sized rounds that would jam in a chamber and thus not go into battery.
In the cramped confines of a WWI cockpit, such a jam would have been tough to clear in the middle of a dogfight.

I love the 1911 and recently added another 38 super to my closet and glove compartment BUT Im a great fan of high capacity magazines that you can load on Monday and shoot til next sunday..Loading a clip, even switching to a new clip is a whole nuther story when bullets are zinging past your ears!!, and counting your shots is hard to do..I alway felt more secure with a Hi Power with a full clip and a clip in each pocket when working on the cartel side of the Rio Grande..

Ray, speaking of counting your rounds, reminds me of a story that Bill Jordan told about when he + another Border Patrol agent were in a fire fight with the bad guys + behind their cars. They were using revolvers in those days, + literally when the smoke had cleared, he noticed that his partner had been carefully stacking his empty brass as he was a hand loader. Now that, I must say, is Cool dedication.

Ive never been able to determine if I liked the 1911 with single stack magazine in 38 Super or my Hi Power with 14 or 16 and the new SA-35 holds 17 with a squeeze, caliber against number of shots??
but today its of little if any concern to me, those days are long gone..IM "super" happy these days, (38 super) When the SA-35 9mm gets down to factory price of $666.00 I will buy another and there coming down of late!!!

It s hard to argue with P-dog, in that he is in a position of know on the Glocks and Im basing my opine on "It just aint purty"

Magazine springs under tension don't "weaken" or wear out any faster than magazine springs that are not under tension. It is the cycling, as Peter pointed out, that weakens the springs. I bought a 1913 vintage Colt 1911 back in about 1976 or so. It had a fully loaded magazine that had been in the gun since around 1920. I know this because I bought the gun from the original owners grandson. He said he knew nothing about guns except to make sure they were unlaoded. He took the magazine out of the gun when he inherited it, made sure the chamber was clear, put the magazine in the box next to the 1911 and put it in a safe place. That magazine could have been loaded since his grandfather bought the gun in 1919, as it was kept as a "tractor" gun on the man's farm. I unloaded the the 1918 dated rounds and proceded to shoot the 1911 with the original magazine. I sold the gun about 10 or 12 years ago, with the original magazine. I don't see how a double stack, or high capacity magazine would be any different. The only issue I see is that if the magazine is plastic, it might warp for some reason, but that would have nothing to do with the actual spring tension.

WDM "karamojo" Bell was a WWI aviator also who had amazing above average vision.
He would close on a German aircraft and take out the pilot with very few rounds...returning with partial belts of 303 brit ball ammunition unused.

He also took most of his elephant with a 7X57
275 Mauser.

Most do not know that a 1911 Govt Model is most reliable in 45 ACP with the original 5 in barrel length. Colt found that the Officers Model and other non-standard models including Commanders and Combat Commander models in 45 ACP had more malfunctions than the original model.

The 38 Super is popular in Mexico because it is not a military cartridge, as the 9mm or 45 ACP-
which are illegal in Mexico.

I keep 7 rds in a 8 rd magazine right up until I
carry the 45 into a high crime area...
or out the door with a full 8 rd magazine.

quote:

Originally posted by 450 Fuller:


Most do not know that a 1911 Govt Model is most reliable in 45 ACP with the original 5 in barrel length. Colt found that the Officers Model and other non-standard models including Commanders and Combat Commander models in 45 ACP had more malfunctions than the original model.

Hmm, interesting. Been doing gun training with high-cap mags and noticed a tad bit more jamming myself, but not sure if it's in any way related.

The 45 is not allowed except for the Military, the 38 super and 9MM Lugar are allowed to anyone so to speak..That said Law is a matter of connivence in Mexico including Murder under payment set by a Judge, called a writ of ?? forgot.