Your buffaloes, are they bigger than cape buffaloes?
What are the average cartridges, used by the majority, for harvesting them?
Besides the spectacular Woodleighs, what other bullets are popular?


On a good note, I had a stroke of good luck a while back! I had the good fortune of meeting an Ausie here, Bevin King. A fantastic barrel maker, he was taught by P.O. Ackley. I have .257 AI, 30-338, 300WSM, 338 Win.Mag. and soon a 9.3x64 barrels by him. Four 375 H&H AIs were rechambered and all barreles and rechambers are deadly accurate!!!!!

The sad part is he is RETIRING!!!!!!! Damn it!!

our Buffalo are smaller than cape buffalo the 338win mag 375 H&H and 458win are all popular I would suggest you get that 9.3x64 built it would work great as for bullets woodleigh's would be what I would want to use

quote:

Originally posted by smlekid:
our Buffalo are smaller than cape buffalo the 338win mag 375 H&H and 458win are all popular I would suggest you get that 9.3x64 built it would work great as for bullets woodleigh's would be what I would want to use

err its the other way around mate our old tame water buff are quite a bit heavier than the African jobs mate.

Gryphon 1... I just looked up your site and looked at the pictures of your fine hounds .. I wish that I had known them.

The one that tried to kill me a couple of months back certainly wasnt tame Gryphon!

Wild, bush-bred buffalo, three hundred miles from the nearest stock fence - just because they dont run away from you at first sight doesnt mean they are tame!! Unless you know something I don't know...?

Matt

We had a couple that didn't seem one bit tame either. The African cape buffalo is given a average weight of 1850#'s for mature bulls. The Australian water buffalo is given as 2200#'s for the same. Everyone that I know who has experience with both says that the water buff in OZ are definately bulkier, maybe they just get better feed. I saw some water buff on a station in Queensland during the drought and the body shape on them much more closely resembled cape buffalo.

I have hunted both, and the cape buff is a real game animal, tuff to hunt, tuff to kill, and a mean tempered beast! The water buff in Australia is like hunting cattle in comparison, the easiest big game i've ever hunted! from a size point of view there is not a great deal of diffrence, from a trophy/sporting point of view, the water buff is not in the ball park. Cape buff have a well deserved reputation as a top game animal, the water buff is a poor substitute!!

One thing I forgot, how much is it for an Australian to hunt a buffalo?

a 5 day hunt starts from about $3500 australian dollars, but generaly $5000 australian dollars including trophy fee is the average price.

dugaboybuff

What rifle is that with the Aussie Buff?

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:
The one that tried to kill me a couple of months back certainly wasnt tame Gryphon!

Wild, bush-bred buffalo, three hundred miles from the nearest stock fence - just because they dont run away from you at first sight doesnt mean they are tame!! Unless you know something I don't know...?

Matt

Yes talk em up all you like it go`s with your role in proffessional guiding a lot of us understand that of course.....tell me as you are the one thats hands on all the time are they as dangerous as the Cape Buffalo at all...

I especially like Duggaboys answer actually ...someone that has been there and back on both of them ..sorta says to me what many have said before

mickey1, I shot the water buff with a Chapius PH in .375 H & H double, topped with a Quick release Zeiss 1.5 x 4.5 DG scope.

quote:

Originally posted by gryphon1:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:
The one that tried to kill me a couple of months back certainly wasnt tame Gryphon!

Wild, bush-bred buffalo, three hundred miles from the nearest stock fence - just because they dont run away from you at first sight doesnt mean they are tame!! Unless you know something I don't know...?

Matt

Yes talk em up all you like it go`s with your role in proffessional guiding a lot of us understand that of course.....tell me as you are the one thats hands on all the time are they as dangerous as the Cape Buffalo at all...

I especially like Duggaboys answer actually ...someone that has been there and back on both of them ..sorta says to me what many have said before

Gryphon my friend - you should know by now that I never comment on things that I don't have sufficient experience with (ie. Cape Buff) - so maybe you should do the same (ie. water buffalo et al).

As for duggaboy's comments - well we must be hunting different water buffalo!

Matt Graham

The Australian buffulo is larger, ....the water buff when touched up becomes like any other animal ....pretty sneaky , however as a general rule they are pretty placid, i have walked in to a heard of 10-15 buffulo and just stood there among them , me watching them and they watching me
taking on the water buffulo is not real hunting its just shooting much the same as brumbies you dont hunt them you go out and shoot them
if you want to hunt grab your rifle and go after sambar...thats hunting!
daniel

quote:

if you want to hunt grab your rifle and go after sambar...thats hunting!

Dont know you from a bar of soap M 98 but you are asolutely right on with that line mate...and the relevant word is HUNTING

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:


Gryphon my friend - you should know by now that I never comment on things that I don't have sufficient experience with (ie. Cape Buff) - so maybe you should do the same (ie. water buffalo et al).

As for duggaboy's comments - well we must be hunting different water buffalo!

Matt Graham

I think that "comment" line will come back to haunt you in any future posts on the net Matt

Matt.. I am not about to tell you that i know more about Water Buff than you do, you being the guide and all, I'm sure you know as much about them than most....But, you are not doing yourself any favours if you are claiming them to be a difficult game animal to hunt. I have spoken to many ,many, trophy hunters here and overseas and NOT ONE of them thought much of the Water Buff as a Game animal. Sure, they are big and impressive looking, even tough to kill sometimes, but a game animal I think not. I 've been offered a few hunts up in the teritory for buff at little or no cost at all but have declined the offer to go up there again, based on the fact, i would rather spend my hunting time, doing exactly that..........Hunting ie Sambar. In fact i will start a new post and ask what other peoples impression of them as a game animal!!

quote:

Originally posted by duggaboybuff:
Matt.. I am not about to tell you that i know more about Water Buff than you do, you being the guide and all, I'm sure you know as much about them than most....But, you are not doing yourself any favours if you are claiming them to be a difficult game animal to hunt. I have spoken to many ,many, trophy hunters here and overseas and NOT ONE of them thought much of the Water Buff as a Game animal. Sure, they are big and impressive looking, even tough to kill sometimes, but a game animal I think not. I 've been offered a few hunts up in the teritory for buff at little or no cost at all but have declined the offer to go up there again, based on the fact, i would rather spend my hunting time, doing exactly that..........Hunting ie Sambar. In fact i will start a new post and ask what other peoples impression of them as a game animal!!

Mate I never said they are difficult to hunt! I just dont think you can make sweaping generalisations that they are a shit game animal. They are just different and behave in varying unpredictable ways, that's all. Sure sometimes it's downright embarrassing when you drive up to an undisturbed bull, that may never have seen a vehicle before (literally) but I see a lot of other occasions when we find an old lone bull and we just cannot get them - they can be very, very sneaky and can cover a lot of ground at walking pace to avoid trouble. So to too they can become agreesive in some situations. They are definately not a naturally aggressive animal but they sure can turn it on when they decide to. Finding a truely big old bull is one thing -but killing it is not guaranteed. I speak from bitter experience - in that some of my hunters have missed out on certain big bulls (some only a couple months ago) where we just could not get a shot at them - I think that's called hunting...

Water buffalo have excellent senses - sight, smell, hearing - certainly right up there with most typical game. The only thing that might make them less of a game animal is the fact that they dont always gallop off when they see a human. I dont think that makes them less of a game animal - it just means that they usually arent scared of humans or Toyotas. Of course you do see some in areas where they have been chased a lot and they can be very, very spooky. No doubt animals in other countries that have a wider range and number of predators and hunting pressure become more spooky because they get chased more often too.

Interestingly, I am just reading a Ruark book at the moment about his first hunt in old Tanganyika. He wrote about seeing Cape buffalo that were totally unperturbed by the hunting vehicle and humans. That was in the 'good old days', I bet you will find them a bit spookier now...

All the best
Matt

Sir Samual Baker probably hunted and killed more COMBINED cape and water buffalo than anybody and he rated cape and water buffalo DEAD even as game animals. ANY animal can be easy at times and young bulls that have never been hunted are for sure not that difficult. MATURE buffalo bulls or cows can be very dangerous and difficult to hunt. Cape and water buffalo are VERY closely related. I think the only reasons you see differences in their behaviour is due to the water buffalo not being harassed by lions, hyeanas, poachers and hunters. A lot of water buffalo in remote areas have never even seen a human. Although I have been charged flat out by a water buffalo that I am fairly sure never saw a human before.

quote:

I think the only reasons you see differences in their behaviour is due to the water buffalo not being harassed by lions, hyeanas, poachers and hunters.

Loboga, I think you hit the nail on the head with this quote.
At the end of the day, this is what makes cape Buff hunting so challenging.

matt , this is only my opinion and the remarks of other hunters during disscusions about hunting. after hunting the Buff in Africa all I want to do is to hunt them again and again. The water buff hunt did not do this for me due to the lack of a challenge.

I think everyone is bound to have a different opinion on all hunted animals based on thier personal experiences. No one person is right are they?
Some say one particular animal is hard/tough to get and that another animal is easy and then another person says just the opposite.

Me , i havnt hunted either of the two but i'd prefer a cape buff based on what ive read/heard/seen in films about them.
I also think the cape buff makes a more impressive mount.