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Another hunter killed
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A hunter was shot and killed near Perth at the weekend and now one in New Zealand. Frowner
http://www.stuff.co.nz/southla...ng-on-Stewart-Island


"Never in the field of human conflict
was so much owed by so many to so few." Sir Winston Churchill

 
Posts: 1881 | Location: Throughout the British Empire | Registered: 08 October 2004Reply With Quote
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Always makes me sick in the guts to hear such news. Condolences to the family.


"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
 
Posts: 11420 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 July 2008Reply With Quote
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The one near Perth was actually about 300km away. Customer of mine, 36 with 2 kids. Was on an organised fox shoot at Westonia as was I. Tragic accident. Shot by a 17 year old member of his own team who reportedly tripped and fell before the firearm discharged. He has been charged with manslaughter but I'm not sure why.


The hunting imperative was part of every man's soul; some denied or suppressed it, others diverted it into less blatantly violent avenues of expression, wielding clubs on the golf course or racquets on the court, substituting a little white ball for the prey of flesh and blood.
Wilbur Smith
 
Posts: 916 | Location: L.H. side of downunder | Registered: 07 November 2004Reply With Quote
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Bushchook, What part of negligent firearms handling causing death would not be Manslaughter ?
 
Posts: 462 | Location: New Zealand - Australia - South Africa | Registered: 14 October 2007Reply With Quote
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Was the 17 year old licensed? What is the minimum age to have a firearms license in Oz? In NZ it is 18.

Was he under supervision? In NZ an under aged hunter must be supervised by a license holder - one gun between 2 people.

quote:
Originally posted by Sarg:
Bushchook, What part of negligent firearms handling causing death would not be Manslaughter ?


"When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick."
 
Posts: 11420 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 July 2008Reply With Quote
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Was the 17 year old licensed? What is the minimum age to have a firearms license in Oz? In NZ it is 18.

Was he under supervision? In NZ an under aged hunter must be supervised by a license holder - one gun between 2 people.


Don't quote rules or give info on New Zealand issues if you don't know the facts Nakihunter, it is 16yrs of age in NZ & has been since I left school
 
Posts: 462 | Location: New Zealand - Australia - South Africa | Registered: 14 October 2007Reply With Quote
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16 is age in New Zealand for A cat firearms licence.


"Never in the field of human conflict
was so much owed by so many to so few." Sir Winston Churchill

 
Posts: 1881 | Location: Throughout the British Empire | Registered: 08 October 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarg:
Bushchook, What part of negligent firearms handling causing death would not be Manslaughter ?


Need to be carful where we go with Negligent. We do not have the facts about what caused the discharge.

Back in the 70's A Mount Isa man was charged with Mudering his wife. He claimed the rifle had droped out of his hands, hit the sloor but first and went off. No one believed him. Took a while but it was shown the model of Sako he had, had a habit of doing just that but not every time you smacked the butt on the floor. What I am saying is the lad may of tripped and rifle has discharged without his finger being on the trigger. Lets wait and see what the out come is.

Condolences to family and friends. That lad has to live with this for the rest of his life.
 
Posts: 492 | Location: Queensland, Australia | Registered: 26 August 2012Reply With Quote
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So did the mount Isa man get oFF without any charge/conviction?...or did he just ecape the murder charge?


In regards the 17 y.o. in WA,
Despite being an unintentional killing,
We don't if he was being reckless in his actions whilst holding a firearm that may have caused him to fall & discharge.

heres some WA law....

http://www.lrc.justice.wa.gov.au/_files/P97-ch03.pdf ... coffee


The way I read it- is that:

the 17 yo comes under the second category: 'Unintentional manslaughter"..(or "involuntary manslaughter" under common law.)

I don't see anyway the 17 y.o. could escape an unitentional manslaughter (category 1st or 2nd) charge.
The question is whether he is under the FIRST or SECOND category of unintentional manslaughter.

IF he was fooling around and fell or otherwise showed lack of due care & responsibility whilst in possession of firearm causing
him to fall & discharge, ... Id say "1st cat. unintentional manslaughter"

EG;...what if to no one elses knowledge at the time of the incident,
but is later found out the 17y.o. was taking-effected by some form of illicit drug?

IF he showed reasonable due care whilst with a firearm , but still stumbled-tripped,
.... id say "2nd cat. unintentional manslaughter"....cause its still negligent handling of a firearm causing death.(moral culpability)


quote:



MANSLAUGHTER UNDER THE CRIMINAL CODE (WA)

The elements of manslaughter are that:
• the accused caused the death of the victim;8
• the accused did not intend to kill or intend to cause grievous bodily harm to any person
(or that the circumstances were such that the offence does not constitute wilful murder or murder); and
• the killing is not authorised, justified or excused by law.9


There are two broad categories of manslaughter under the Code: intentional and unintentional

The second category—unintentional manslaughter—applies to unlawful killings where the accused did not form
the required intention for wilful murder or murder. This category is similar, but not identical, to the category
of involuntary manslaughter at common law.16
Under the Commission’s recommendations this category will apply where the accused caused death but did not intend to
kill and did not intend to cause an injury likely to endanger life.
17 Unintentional manslaughter can be divided into two further categories.
18 The first category applies where death is caused by a deliberate (voluntary) act.
19 The second category, also known as manslaughter by criminal negligence, applies where death is caused by negligent conduct.





quote:
page 103

The Commission does not consider that there is any need to exclude criminal negligence from the offence of manslaughter in Western Australia.
The test for criminal negligence ensures that only extremely culpable negligence will suffice to establish criminal responsibility.
Bearing this in mind the two categories of unintentional manslaughter are essentially comparable in terms of moral culpability .
Any difference in culpability can be taken into account during sentencing because all sentencing dispositions are available for manslaughter.



So if the 17 y.o. took all reasonable steps to prevent such incident, likely he avoids Criminal responsibility,
but faces some level of moral culpability.


quote:
page 91

Manslaughter by criminal negligence

Under the Code and at common law an accused may be convicted of manslaughter on the basis of criminal
negligence. Manslaughter by criminal negligence may arise as a result of either a negligent act or a negligent omission.
Generally, there is no criminal liability for failing to act.46
However, both the Code and the common law recognise ‘a series of specific duties to act based on special relationships or
understandings between the parties or upon responsibility for a dangerous situation’.47

Sections 262 to 267 of the Code provide for two different types of duties. The first category (found in ss 262–263) imposes a duty
where there is a special relationship between two people so that one person owes a duty to provide the necessaries of life to the other.
The second category (found in ss 265, 266 & 267) provides for particular duties in relation to dangerous conduct. In order to provide a basis
for criminal liability there must be a duty to act and a breach of that duty – the ‘duty is to do whatever would be reasonable to prevent harm
from occurring’.48
The effect of failure to perform the duty is that the accused is held to have caused any consequences resulting to the life or health of another
person by reason of the failure to comply with the duty.

In Callaghan,49 the High Court considered s 266 of the Code which defines the duty of persons in charge of dangerous objects .
The court held that the degree of negligence required under s 266 is the same as the degree of negligence required for manslaughter at
common law.50

The common law test for manslaughter by criminal negligence, as pronounced in Nydam,51 is that there must have been such a great falling short
of the standard of care which a reasonable man would have exercised and which involved such a high risk that death or grievous bodily harm would
follow that the doing of the act merited criminal punishment.5

Thus, manslaughter by criminal negligence requires an objective assessment of what a reasonable person would have done in the circumstances.
In some cases an accused may have been aware of the risk of harm but failed to comply with the relevant duty to act; whereas in other cases an
accused may be held criminally responsible on the basis of a failure to appreciate the risk in the circumstances. 53 But a mere failure to do
what a reasonable person would have done in the same circumstances is not sufficient. There must have been ‘a serious departure from the standard
of care that a reasonable member of the community would observe in the same circumstances’54 or in other words, a ‘serious degree of negligence’.55
 
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