Shankspony was kind enough to invite me on a tahr hunt with him and his 2 mates, Ben and David. A dedicated outdoorsman, Shankspony is very concerned about New Zealand Dept. of Conservation (DOC) granting permits to slaughter game from a helicopter in wilderness areas which is contrary to the ethics of Fair Chase as we understand it to be defined in the U.S., as well as a majority of ethical hunters define it in New Zealand. His contention is that any reasonably fit hunter, even if he is slightly overweight and past his prime at 56, can hunt tahr without violating every precept of Fair Chase. Consequently, he extended an invitation to me to accompany his group with the only stipulation that I share expenses.
I first met the group at the ferry terminal to transit from the North Island to the South Island where we would be hunting. While waiting for the boarding time for the ferry, I was immediately welcomed into the group. Competent, jovial, good natured and oblivious to harsh conditions are just a few adjectives that describe the group with whom I shared one of my most enjoyable hunts.
We would hunt the same area that was hunted the previous year. The weather they experienced was sunny days with daytime temperatures in the high forties and nighttime temperatures just below freezing. As can be expected in any mountainous area around the globe, the vagaries of Mother Nature dealt us a different hand. When we arrived in the high country we had ankle deep snow but by the time Shankspony made the well advised decision to leave the mountains the snow was knee deep. I was graciously offered the first shot at a respectable tahr at about 200 yards but passed because I knew I could not retrieve the animal. The Kiwi’s were adamant that they could get to the fallen tahr but I did not think it was prudent to be climbing in those conditions without crampons. Later in the hunt I was presented with a shot at a female chamois but passed on it also. In no way did the fact that I did not fire a shot detract in the least from my hunting experience in New Zealand.
A few photos of the hunt are attached. I will also provide a much more detailed hunt report in the future but I thought the members of this board would enjoy a few photos. If any board members are also members of SCI or have any ideas on how we can support the real hunters of New Zealand in their quest to stop the shooting of game animals from helicopters by slobs masquerading as “sportsman” , please feel free to make suggestions. As a foreign visitor to New Zealand, it not my place to judge hunting regulations in another country as they pertain to the concept of fair chase. However, if any game animal is taken from the skids of a helicopter, it certainly has no place in the record books.

Bob,
I agree with the sentiments in your last few sentences. It is up to the Kiwis to determine how they want to deal with the wild, feral tahr. Let's remember that most tahr would not be taken without the extensive use of helicopters - major loss of revenues, leaving DOC to pay to reduce or exterminate the species.I have a feeling they are going to get shot from the air one way or the other.
Perhaps the SCI Record Book should designate the helicopter-shot tahr in another category. 'Estate' is a category, so 'Helicopter Assisted' could be another.
Dave

Thats a true NZ wilderness hunt bobmn - well done.

I've just come out of the next block up river from where you were. The snow has gone back past the upper bushline, the conditions we had were a lot more pleasant, must have been a little chilly when you were in there.

This was a public land hunt (as was mine) where a helicopter was used for access and you were dropped at a designated landing site. Those of us who want heli-hunting stopped have no problem with this sort of hunt, we do it all the time. Fly in, establish a base camp and hunt from there for however many days.

It is the heli-hunting on public land we have had a gutsful of, where animals are chased by the helicopter to exhaustion and a standstill, then the hunter gets out and shoots the animal - that is the poorest ethic of hunting available on the planet.

Good on you for hunting how kiwis and genuine NZ guides hunt. I'm sure that it was an experience you will never forget and that you understand that to take a mature Himalayan bull tahr on public land in NZ is perhaps one of the greatest hunting challenges the world has to offer.

DAL: It is my personal opinion that any record book entry associated with my name in a catagory of helicopter hunting would be an acute embarrassment to me and an absolute public humiliation. For clarification, as a guest in the fine country of New Zealand, it is not my place to debate how the people of New Zealand manage their wildlife for this should be determined by the citizens of New Zealand. However, there is a movement within their country to stop the pursuit of game from helicopters in designated wilderness areas and I would like to publicize the difference between a wildlife culling operation and ethical hunting. Imagine enduring the conditions depicted in the photos, putting a daylong stalk on a tahr and than have your hunt abruptly terminated by someone wealthy enough to hire a helicopter to use as a shooting platform. I do not believe that the true hunters of New Zealand object to the shooting from helicopters on private land but the objection is to the use of helicopters on public land for other than transportation to the hunting area.
Regarding your comment about culling operations being inevitable, my understanding is the proponents of fair chase in New Zealand acknowledge that culling will occur once the tahr exit into the exclusion zones but they do not want their hunts being conducted under what most hunters define as fair chase being interupted by heli-hunting. They also want the culling operations to occur outside the normal hunting months.

BoBm

Thank you for that report and thank you Shankspony

quote:

Originally posted by DAL:
Bob,
I agree with the sentiments in your last few sentences. It is up to the Kiwis to determine how they want to deal with the wild, feral tahr.

Thank you DAL respectfully I will address your reply

quote:

Originally posted by DAL:
Let's remember that most tahr would not be taken without the extensive use of helicopters - major loss of revenues,

Not correct, the majority of tahr are taken with fourwheel drive and foot access by NZ recreational hunters.
What sort of major loss of revenue are you refering to trophies don't disappear because there are no helicopters to hunt them.
NZ hunters also use helicopters to access camps. NZ guides and rec hunters have no issue with the current level of legal aerial helicopter access available. Overseas hunters on public land are the only group to use helicopters almost exclusivley to take trophy tahr. Do not confuse helicopters to access camps with the use of a helicopter to hunt tahr.

quote:

Originally posted by DAL:
leaving DOC to pay to reduce or exterminate the species.I have a feeling they are going to get shot from the air one way or the other.

Not correct, tahr whilst still carrying the title of pest are managed under a Wild Animal Control Plan. This plan sets densities and specifiies range it is a mangement program by default it does not allow for extirmination of tahr in New Zealands Alps unless legislative change allows this.
DoC search and destroy activity is decided in conjunction with the tahr liason group and the tahr interestt group.
3013 tahr were shot under SAD by DoC in 2008. A large reason for this is our 80%/20% male female imbalance. We wish to correct that with better management. The annual tahr control plan budget varies between $120,000 to $ 280,000 PA. This is funded from the general tax fund, overseas hunters are not charged a cent for their public land trophies.

quote:

Originally posted by DAL:

Perhaps the SCI Record Book should designate the helicopter-shot tahr in another category. 'Estate' is a category, so 'Helicopter Assisted' could be another.
Dave

No need to change the SCI book just for New Zealand. If New Zeland hunters are allowed to have a say there will be no need for a helicopter category for trophy tahr off New Zeland public land.

Freeranger: Glad to hear conditions improved for you. Considering the history of deer culling and meat recovery operations in NZ, it is no wonder that the line between hunting and wildlife control is a bit blurred (I just finished reading "The Venison Hunters" by Mike Bennett). In North America there is a necessity to control the number of snow geese because of their impact on the ecology of the Hudson Bay region. However, the spring control actions are not called hunts.
Alaska faced a similar assault on sheep from aircraft. Their response was to stipulate in the regulations that no hunting was to occur on the day you flew in and this requlation is vigorously enforced. However, I am not so naive to think that it is never violated but it has virtually eliminated the interruption of legal ground hunts because outlaws usually prefer not to have witnesses.
By illustrating how North Americans have dealt with similar conflicts I do not purport to have the answer to the struggle occurring in your country. I am sure the citizens of New Zealand will reach a decision which is worthy of your admirable country.

Bob good on you,sounds like Shankspony is coming to USA to hunt,he will never be the same again

Hey Bob,Hopefully managed to send you the last of the photo's today.
This is Bob's story to tell, so will not post an account of event's myself. I wll say though that though conditions were harsh, the company I enjoyed was superb and Bob would be welcome around any campfire in the country.
The set of Alaskan hunting regulations you left with me makes for sobering reading when i compare them too what we face here.

Shankspony: I fervently hope that New Zealanders never find it necessary to adopt the complex restrictions that North Americans have found necessary to reduce conflict among user groups of the ever shrinking wildernes. That would mean that your wonderful country is moving towards overcrowding. It is a balancing act between conflict resolution and letting the nose of the camel into the tent.

Top Predator: The only problem with Shankspony going to Alaska is that he will never be allowed to leave the state once the outfitters of Alaska see the loads he can pack and how those long legs of his eat up the miles whether straight up or straight down.

Bobmn and Weathered,
Thanks for shedding more light on this. I am sure it will get resolved by the Kiwi's sooner than later.

DAL: It is my personal opinion that any record book entry associated with my name in a catagory of helicopter hunting would be an acute embarrassment to me and an absolute public humiliation.

Bobmn,
My name will be in the record book soon, and no helicopter was involved. 4-wheel drive and stalk, crawl and slide. It will be in the Archery Book.

That last pic crossing the water,I can oly imagine how bloody cold a dip in that would have been..brrr!

Good account bobmn and a pleasure to read of from fellas Tahr hunting from the ground.

Like the pic of operating the mountain radio. Its a good service.

After all the roger..roger..rogering it is usually possible to get a meassage out.

Just another part of a kiwi wilderness experience.

DAL: Congratulations on your success taking a tahr with a bow. What an accomplishment!