I suspect you are correct on the base plug - the sectioned cartridge illustrated has a porcelain plug and a large airgap . ( the cartridge is one issued to the NSW Prisons Service for use in the snider carbine , but isnt actually a snider as such , it is more like the .58 Berdan Musket , but isnt one of those either ,. definately English manufacture , and the same style of projectile as the ones under discussion )



Hope this gives some idea of the actual situation with the snider projectile . Kinda neat too , I thought

No worries Marrakai, Just give me a yell if you want to check it out and I'll bring it up next time I come up your way. I was going to come up this weekend to do some crabbing, but we've become a bit busy here at Tindal

Thanks for your replies, guys. Plenty to think about.



Hobie: As I said in my original post, I have been a member of the Brit Militaria Forums for some time, and believe me, all is not necessarily answered there! They do however recognize the fact that the minie bullet was only loaded in the Snider as a stop-gap, to use up the miles of war-stock minies held in warehouses for the Enfield. It is far from ideal! They had all but run out of surplus minies, and were probably on the verge of re-chambering for a groove-diameter bullet, when the Martini Henry was adopted and Snider development ceased. Perhaps its up to us to now continue on and 'correct' those design faults!



Some of the guys on the Brit Mil Forums have developed a 'driving-band' bullet to better take the rifling, but it is only .590 dia, a big improvement on .577 but still too small for my rifle.



BTW Muzza, the base-plugs for the minie need to be cast seperately (from automotive body-filler these days) because there has to be a space ahead of the plug in the bullet's hollow-base for the plug to move forward under pressure to expand the skirt. A fair idea, but the skirt is still within the case-mouth at peak pressure, so it still doesn't expand properly. This is why the Snider has a ho-hum reputation for accuracy. With a groove-diameter bullet or ball loaded ahead of the case, the Mk.IIIs are capable of holding 3 inches for 5 shots at 100 yards, by all accounts. Most shooters couldn't do any better than that with an open-sighted Remington 700!



Bakes: Thanks for the offer. I've got a couple, one's a standard Lee .577 minie mold, the other's a period original, but missing the hollow-base bit. I could be happy just shooting this rifle with .577 minies and copping sweet the 1-foot groups at 100 yds, but if the lads in the UK can get 3 inches, I deserve it too!

Muzz: there was a short Snider cartridge made, same ballistics as the original, same charge weight too if I remember correctly. I do, however, forget the reason for developing the shorter round. Your sectioned cartridge may be the Short Snider.



Its on the left in this pic of .577 cartridges from my collection:



Short Snider, Snider, .577 Express, .577 NE.





Bakes:

Good call on the crabbing, mate! I don't like boating in blustery rain-squalls either! (Where the hell is our Dry Season?!)



BAW:

Can you ask your mate what size 100yd 5-shot group he gets with the Lyman minie and no base-plug? I need an honest answer if possible, not a guess! Plenty of Snider-owners shoot for fun and don't really care about accuracy, and that's fine of course, but I need hard data if possible! Ta.

The Short Snider ( aka .57 Snider ) was loaded for the Turkish Snider rifle , which had a shorter case . Most of the commercial short snider cartridges found today are Canadian in manufacture , due to C.I.L. making ammo for the milsurp rifles that turned up in Canada at the end of the 1800's.

The sectioned example I posted isnt one of those short cartridges , nor is it a 58 Berdan Musket cartridge , but it definately chambers in a normal snider chamber , and definately was issued to the NSW Prison service as a service cartridge . It is English in origin , but not much else is known about it , but it shows the basic design of the snider ball load anyway . Interesting none the less .

Hope you have some luck in finding an accurate projectile for the snider you own .