Hello ,i need a couple of recoil reducers, ideally i would like mercury [extra weight etc]does anyone in Aust make them ? I have tried Fabarm reducer with iron filings ,but couldnt tell any difference in recoil ,or RPG firearms advertise progressive spring type reducers which im not familiar with
Thanks for any info advice
Cheers and Happy New Year !

G'Day Tank Hunter,

I only recently (On-Line) seen a Qld gun shop advertising theirs.
I'll try and remember to look them up, and I'll post the info here!

Doh!
Homer

Cant help you with a local source, but for what its worth, my experience with mercury recoil reducers has been so-so at best.

I have found that the reduction of perceived recoil from mercury reducers is about equal to their additional weight. IE you could get about the same amount of reduction by adding their equivalent weight via material such as lead, or simply using some heavier materials in the build. So in my experience, a mercury reducer wont hurt, but its an expensive way to add weight to your rifle.

G'Day Again,

As promised click on; www.rpgfirearms.com.au/RECOILREDUCERS/htm

Well that didn't work!
Try www.rpgfirearms.com.au and click on Rifles and or Shotguns and scroll down.

Hope that helps

Doh!
Homer

If you do get a mercury recoil reducer, don't be surprised if they don't let you on a plane with it, since it's a toxic substance Air NZ is allergic to, at least.

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
If you do get a mercury recoil reducer, don't be surprised if they don't let you on a plane with it, since it's a toxic substance Air NZ is allergic to, at least.

Well, they'd have to be magicians to figure out that there was one in a gunstock.

I agree with the above poster that my experience with them is they are weight. There may be some SLIGHT additional spreading out of recoil speed by the movement of the mercury, but I personally can't detect it. Easier and much cheaper to use lead shot, or a cast lead wt IMO.

tankhunter

The only recoil reducer I have used is the Blaser. It uses tungsten powder instead of mercury. It is also weighted to make the blaser rifle balance perefectly when the heavier Safari, or Match barrels are used.

However I have also used it when testing loads and hunting with the Blaser 375 H&H Tracker [19 3/4" barrels. I can say it does reduce recoil, as I have shot the exact rifle with and without it.

However I can say that a KDF type muzzle break will reduce the recoil a lot more,[but they are louder], and Magna-Port, while not as effective as the KDF, reduces recoil and especially muzzle rise quite a bit and seems no louder when hunting than a standard barrel.

I have Magna Port in 2 Blaser barrels, a 300 Win Mag and a 375 H&H.

I like them.

What calibre rifle are you trying to reduce the recoil on?

Sure not what I was hoping to read about these things. I just spent almost $200 on three of them. One for the .300win, two for the build I'm in the middle of .358U/m. both have 26", fit me just right and the wt is or will be up there, same as balance under the magazine, and a good pad.

In the 358 I put a 7oz in the forearm and 13oz in the butt. It should be at least 12#, maybe 13# I sure hope it's not over that. None of my rifles have a sling on them. I'm a non believer in slings. This rifle won't be finished until July. Hope I'm healed up from new shoulders by then. We'll see.

Since this will shoot a 250gr at 3200fps I fully expect quite a bit of recoil. Nothing compared to the big bores I'm sure.

Good to read experience so I can have an idea what to expect. Hope the OP learns what he is looking for too. I bought these from Brownell's about $60 each here in the states of course.
Many thanks guys,
George

The only way to reduce recoil is by either a muzzle break or adding weight.

You can add your own by melting lead into shape and installing in the stock.

I agree. I put the reducers on a 500 NE . I could tell no difference.

This stock is solid wood.
Need to hollow it out to add anything to it.

Sure am disappointed in reading this. I have over a ton of scrap lead in the shop just waiting to be used for something.
Oh well, it's only money.
George

Shame you aussies cant have suppressors on your rifles.

Thats a certain way to reduce felt recoil and save your hearing at the same time.

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
If you do get a mercury recoil reducer, don't be surprised if they don't let you on a plane with it, since it's a toxic substance Air NZ is allergic to, at least.

Not just Air NZ. All airlines and rightly so. Mercury desolves aluminium. The amount in a large thermometer does enought damage to ground a 737 for months of expensive repairs.

Now that most hold luggage is xrayed the chance ot the recoil reducer being detected and questions asked is high. I use the ones from the RPG site.

quote:

Originally posted by Rule 303:

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
If you do get a mercury recoil reducer, don't be surprised if they don't let you on a plane with it, since it's a toxic substance Air NZ is allergic to, at least.

Not just Air NZ. All airlines and rightly so. Mercury desolves aluminium. The amount in a large thermometer does enought damage to ground a 737 for months of expensive repairs.

Now that most hold luggage is xrayed the chance ot the recoil reducer being detected and questions asked is high. I use the ones from the RPG site.

Actually, the new airport x-ray machines can differentiate and pick a lot of different materials.

Back to the subject at hand.

I shoot a lot of large caliber rifles here at our range.

I use a PAST Magnum shoulder pad, and it works great.

Does this mean IF I have mercury in the stock of my rifle that I can't fly it over to oz??
George

I have recoil reducers in 3 of my shotguns and two of my rifles. Each reducer weighs 7 or 8 onces. One or two of the reducers in my shotguns are mercury, all the rest are mechanical. They all help to reduce the felt recoil, but I don't know if one type is better than the other. Like Saeed posted, maybe just adding an equal weight of lead would give the same results.

From Magnaport's website, magnaporting only reduces felt recoil up to 15%. It is designed more to reduce muzzle jump. Magnaport does make a muzzle brake that they advertize will reduce recoil up to 45%.

Two of my competetion shotguns are ported and have recoil reducers. There is difinately a felt reduction of recoil.

I also have KDF muzzle brakes on two of my rifles, and they greately reduce the amount of felt recoil. Both of those rifles also have mechanical recoil reducers in their stocks.

The mercury reducers are completely sealed, but if you are worried about the mercury, either install a mechanical reducer instead, or first try an equal weight of lead in the stock.

I wouldn't have a muzzle break if you gave me the factory and all the rifles in it!
Don't even want to be at the range when one's being fired. I don't have much hearing left and sure don't want it to go from that.
Thanks anyway, always good to hear what works for others.
George

Thanks Gents for the advice ,i think i will give the mercury reducers a miss ,considering at least in the future as well ,with airline x rays and possibility of them being regarded as a ''Concealment'' etc and an excuse for them, [being Mercury] to disallow you from having it on board the aircraft .
Rule 303 how did you find the recoil reducers[ mechanical]offered by RPG firearms ? other than that, i will just add weight as Saeed suggested as i dont want to muzzle brake this gun
Thanks again Cheers everyone

quote:

Originally posted by georgeld:
Does this mean IF I have mercury in the stock of my rifle that I can't fly it over to oz??
George

Means,if found, no western airline will let it on board and you could possible face charges for consigning/carrying undeclared dangers goods on board an aircraft.

Tankhunter I found no noticeable difference initialy while firing off a bench. However instead of my tolerance being 16 shots over a range session before starting to flinch I could go to about 20 over a range session. I put the smallest one in , if they had the other 2 on the market when I did mine I would of put the largest in.

The recoil reducers work in two ways. 1st is a slight increase in weight. The 2nd is spreading the total amount of force applied to your shoulder over a longer period of time. If rifle recoils with 80foot pound of energy you still receive the 80fp. However instead of receiving it over -just picking figures out of the air as an example- 1 millisecond with a peak energy of say 75fp your receive it over 1.5 milliseconds with a peak energy of 70fps. As the ones sold by RPG use a spring to slow the moveable weight down this would strech the total time and hence the peak engery down a bit more.

This is because the moveable weight in the reducer picks up some of th energy and moves this reward slightly behind the main energy carrier, the stock. This is only a basic explination -I am no guru -hope it helps.

Just how is it going to be found once it's embedded and epoxied in place inside the stock?

303: I think you're trying to spread bullshit myself.
George

quote:

Originally posted by georgeld:
Just how is it going to be found once it's embedded and epoxied in place inside the stock?

As has been said, by what's visible on the X-ray screen. Even the older generation machines show a lot of detail, and would make it obvious that the reducers contain a very radio-opaque liquid. There's only one metal that's liquid at normal ambient temperatures...

quote:

303: I think you're trying to spread bullshit myself.
George

You're entitled to your opinion.
But he's perfectly correct, on the issue of aluminium corrosion by mercury. It's actually more a catalytic effect than normal oxidation; the mercury destroys the oxide film that normally prevents oxidation of the aluminium, but isn't involved in the oxidation reaction. Put it this way, a drop of mercury rubbed on a small piece [say 5 grams] of aluminium alloy will turn it into a heap of white fluffy oxide powder in a couple of minutes.

So Mercury is banned from air transport [except for two very specific circumstances] as Dangerous Goods Class 8, Corrosive; not Class 6, Toxic.

George what Gadge says is quite correct. Might pay to do a bit of research before you call bullshit.

In a former job I worked at arports and got see the damage mercury did to aircraft. I am talking from experience.

I don't reject the fact mercury would eat up aluminum at all.

Nor do I believe x rays couldn't/won't show the metal tubes in the stocks either.

I do question how mercury could escape from a sealed stainless steel capsule even if it wasn't epoxied in place so it can't move or be taken out.

I've sent Spradling a note asking him to post on this as he has some in most of his rifles and just took one or more of them to Aust from the US on planes. Hasn't said anything about having problems with it.

Thanks for the comments though, I do know you guys are trying to help us "fools" from getting into trouble. That's appreciated too.
George

I see where you are coming from now George. While no one thinks to find out what is in the recoil reducers and any other place in the rifle people are fine. If how ever a person is found to have dangerous goods on board without the proper clearences then they can and probably will be charged.

It does not matter that the mercury can not/should not escape it is still a dangerous goods and the regulations apply.

FWIW, I can not begin to guess how many hundreds of thousands of flights mercury recoil reducers have been flown on airplanes in the US. Many trap shooters, and I suppose other varieties of shotgun sport shooters, have them in their shotguns.

I'm sure the posters are right about the dangers of mercury in airplanes, but I had never heard of it before, nor do I think (m)any of those competition shooters are aware of it.

Thats the point I was trying to make.
Thanks Gato.
George

I dare say most of those who scan the xray machines don't know about it either. I think it is just a matter of time before a security person notices the liquid in a gun stock and starts to as questions.

The question I ask is on the off chance you are found to have consigned a dangerous good onto the aircraft are you willing to take the risk of a jail term or very heavy fine. Don't know what the penalties are in the US or else where but it may pay to start leting your buddies know the risk they are running.

quote:

The question I ask is on the off chance you are found to have consigned a dangerous good onto the aircraft are you willing to take the risk of a jail term or very heavy fine. Don't know what the penalties are in the US or else where but it may pay to start leting your buddies know the risk they are running.

Give me a break!

Rule 303 is quite correct, as regards penalties for undeclared Dangerous Goods on board aircraft.

The chances of being pinged for mercury in recoil reducers may not be all that great, but the penalties definitely apply, if you are.
See the first two listed case studies on the Oz CASA [equivalent to the US FAA] website, c=PC_90386" target="_blank">CASA DG

The type of containment used is of no significance here; the presence of elemental mercury is what matters.

BTW, mercury clinical thermometers were added to the IATA DG Rules [these rules govern all international, and at least first world internal, airlines] prohibited list last year; they were previously exempted if appropriately packed.