Using hunting rifles, BSA Hunter 7x57, Tikka T3 25/06, Whitworth 308, Sako 222, if I rest the forend on a sandbag, or use a bipod the groups are awful. Holding the forend, groups are brilliant. Lots seem to get good groups resting the forend/using a bipod – any ideas what I am doing wrong?

Thanks

Too much to discuss here. First you should not be resting the "forend" but rather the stock perhaps just forward of the receiver. You should also be resting the stock on a rear bag. The whole point of this exercise to have a steady "hold". If you can see the crosshairs moving around on the target, whatever method you use, it is not steady enough! Bipods can be a problem with a high recoiling rifle, if you use it on a bench or other hard surface. Off the ground or grass it should be fine. Again, there are two different things going on here, one is the steadyness of your rifle on it's rest, the other is the bedding etc. of the rifle which can cause it to behave adversely depending on the type of rest used. Plenty of people shoot very well in F class from a bipod. It sound to me that perhaps your technique needs looking at as well. Can you not hold the rifle steady without the left hand holding the forend? If so, then get a different front rest. What kind are you using? You need a "U" shape of some kind to cradle the forend. The rear rest should be "rabbit ears" of some kind, again, to cradle the rear of the stock from side to side motion. The idea of a rest is simply to provide a stable platform for the rifle.
Peter

Hunting rifles are not bench guns. They are probably not fully free-floated and set up for such endeavors. A hunting rifle is made to be shot off your hands, so to get the best accuracy off a bench from a hunting rifle, you'll need to use your support hand under the forearm, between the rest and the rifle (meat and bone dampen the harmonics of a supported barrel (meaning the barrel channel probably contacts the barrel near the end of the forend-with slight upward pressure, especially if a wooden stock).

Many older hunting rifles, when shot off bags, exhibit poor accuracy, but when fired from a properly built field position (sitting or prone with a sling, they shoot very well; design.

If you are minded to check, remove your action from the stock, see if there is a slight bulge in the channel near the end, which contacts teh bottom 1/3 of the barrel; if so, you can scrape it down until the barrel floats fully, beware, unless the action is well inletted or bedded, it may not shoot any better, maybe worse.

Good luck!

Gents thanks for the help.

I have been resting the fore end behind the front swivel – perhaps a bit too far forward? The rear of the stock is on a sand bag and every thing is steady –at least as far as I can detect with a 10x scope.

I suspect you may be right on the bipod of the bench, I will try if off the ground to compare.

Probably better bags would help, but as soon as I hold the fore end groups shrink dramatically.

Apart from the Whitworth, the rifle have floating barrels, all sporter weights.

Thanks again.

LIncs, when you say "hold the forend" what do you mean? Do you mean "rest the forend on your hand, with the hand resting on the front rest" or do you mean "forend resting on the front rest, but the lsft hand steadying the forend"?
As to forend "pressure" you don't need to remove the action from the stock, just try to slide a dollar bill or business card between the stock and the barrel at the forend. This will tell you whether you have contact between stock and barrel. However it looks like all are free floated (at least partially). I say this because unless you have a stiff barrel and a big gap, you may still have contact between barrel and stock upon firing the gun.
If you are only steadying the gun on the front rest, I see no harm in that. It just means that the front rest is not doing it's full job. Try putting a towel (double thickness) on the rest and resting the rifle on that. Let us know.
Peter.

If you are resting the fore stock on bags or a full-fledged front rest behind the sling swivel stud, that stud will catch on the bag as the rifle recoils rearward. That will cause inaccuracy.

quote:

The rear of the stock is on a sand bag

Spring for a rear bag with the bigger ears. Get the leather Protektor 13B, I think it is. It's well worth the money. Don't waste your time or cash on those tiny Caldwell things in nylon.

Gents

Thanks again. When I hold the fore end, I use a normal hunting grip and placement with the back of the hand rested on the sand bag – then I get nice groups. I will try the towel trick. The floating barrels all easily pass the business card test, but the Whitworth that isn’t floating responds in the same way as the other rifles when rested on the front rest or hand held.

Thanks again.

Lots of time has now passed and I am now consistently getting good groups. The bench I am using on a indoor range is cut up for both right and left handed shooters, so I was forcing my sitting position forward and getting to a acute angle behind the gun to get support for the right elbow. Now I sit straight, the right elbow is forced down to get support on the side of the bench and groups are good.

The best group at the moment (25/06) is the Barnes TSX 100g at 3102 that shoots to the same point of impact as a Speer 100g at 3248 – so I have cheap practise ammo and under ½” groups if I do my part with both bullets. The TSX has only taken one deer, and performed admirably but need more use to form a opinion.