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OK, SO why don't all you retired pilots buy a couple of DC3/Dakota's and start an air service to Zimbabwe??? Or maybe get something modern like a 707.  DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | ||
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Sounds like a great idea, someone will make a small fortune! (provided of course they start with a large fortune!) for every hour in front of the computer you should have 3 hours outside | |||
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Now that would be a good flight if restricted to hunters. We could all carry our rifles on board with us. ALLEN W. JOHNSON - DRSS Into my heart on air that kills From yon far country blows: What are those blue remembered hills, What spires, what farms are those? That is the land of lost content, I see it shining plain, The happy highways where I went And cannot come again. A. E. Housman | |||
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ZIM might be OK about things, but where's the departure point? ******************************** A gun is a tool. A moron is a moron. A moron with a hammer who busts something is still just a moron, it's not a hammer problem. Daniel77 | |||
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My thoughts were to avoid J'Berg. Have the flight go straight to the country of the hunt. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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I've spent a bit of time considering this whole general line of thought. As I see it, the basic problem is utilization of capital (planes, space at airports, etc)......If you could find a long distance aircraft at a deal it MIGHT work, but I suspect that Jo'burg or Windhoek might put up obstacles to your success. Luggage handling is another problem. I don't claim any expertise in these areas but my thought is one or two RT flights a week, let's say one going, one return, and one going, one return, same aircraft would not provide enough revenue to support the operation. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Have the PAX handle their own luggage. Depart from a GA or a private airport. Land at one too. You hand your bag to the loading guy in the pit who travels with the airplane. No question as to whether your bags got on or not. You could make this thing like a fractional. Just cut out the BS. It will be a privately owned airplane by our own group of say 500 or a 1000 hunters. Something like a Long range 737 would fit the bill nicely. Screw a schedule we'll make bi monthly trips to where ever we need to go say a GA field in LA basin to Alliant field in Dallas to Du Page in Chicago Somewhere in the North east somewhere inn the south east to Manaus Brazil. Tech stop crew change Direct to Windhoek, Crew change, Harare, Dar layover and pick them up on the way back. Ok so you'll need several jets on board cargo handlers, and an on board mechanic, catering could be nice but self serve or you could make it self catered with designated "flt attendants" for safety purposes. Our very own Will is the first thought about who we designate. Hey I know it's wildly impractical but it's fun to dream. | |||
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OK, I held off as long as I could and as much as I hate to say it, it ain't gonna work - no way, no how! Historically speaking, you are doomed to failure for so many reasons I could not list them in a full day of trying. Go read the different bits published on the "Atlanta Skylarks" and you will start to get the picture. These people started with a DC-7, then up to a Caravelle and progressed to a B707 which they dropped in the Azores, coming in on final and killed all 144 onboard - this was in 1984, IIRC. I don't think anyone will ever again get all the tickets, docs and certs to attmpt such an endeavor on their own hook. Sounds good to start, many interesting possibilities but go ahead and buy a ticket on a Sched carrier - best bet by far. Someone mentioned a B737, one of the later dash numbers would certainly be a great choice. Now, we pay to get that sucker ETOPS cert [read $$] and then we get it ground serviced [more $$$] and we buy liability [again $$$] open purchase our fuel as we have no purchase commits [mega $$$ this time] - starting to get the picture here? Oh, we got to pay a couple of guys with the right paperwork to sit up front in the cockpit and drive this thing too. Maybe the Texas SCI or someone could afford to do this but I doubt it. Anyone have any idea of what the exposure costs for a B737-700 sitting on the tarmac might be?? I thought not. Don't even think about what you would pay for a letter check or a general overhaul. God knows I hate to cloud up and rain on a parade but that;s exactly how it is. Lord, give me patience 'cuz if you give me strength I'll need bail money!! 'TrapperP' | |||
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Much along the lines of Trapper P's post. There were several clubs that did this in Texas. Perhaps the largest was the World Travelers based out of Dallas. None have survived, the economics are tough; and like most things run by committee --fail miserably even without the tough economy. DuggaBoye-O NRA-Life Whittington-Life TSRA-Life DRSS DSC HSC SCI | |||
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I don't claim to know much about this but I am pretty good with numbers. SW Airlines was flying passengers for about 5 cents per mile on 737s figuring a full load of about 125 passengers in 2003. I doubt you could do this for twice that now, but let's say you can fly 100 people for 10 cents per mile per person, that's $10/mile.....very roughly 8000 miles Dallas to Windhoek, for example (and I'm not factoring in stops etc. this is just for illustrative purposes)........that's $80,000 one way, RT $160,000 divided by 100 passengers 1600 dollars each or not much savings over commercial and I'm sure there are other costs I've left out, ESPECIALLY since SW uses their airplanes almost constantly and that lowers the cost per passenger mile. I think it would be difficult to line nearly that many hunters up at any one time slot......the whole idea is a non-starter monetarily. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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While I am not going to cite real and current figures for obvious reasons I can list out some published data which is astonishingly close to such real data. We’ll start with the B737-700ER which has the longest legs of any of the B737 A/C and should serve our purpose well. We are looking at a real cost of some $47-55 mil US dependent upon furnishings and equipage to buy this A/C. For these bucks we get an A/C that can fly 5510 nautical milesat 0.82 MACH carrying 126 psgrs, It has a fuel capacity of 6875 gals or 26020 L. Current spot fuel into plane pricings are $4.51 to $5.05 domestic for Jet A and a high of $1.83 per L. or $6.93 per GL – so we’ll pay $31,006.25 to $64,718.75 to gas her up in country but it’ll be $47,616.60 say at FCO [Rome, Italy] Or we could just say ‘excuse me, I think we’ll lease it for a while!’ and only pay $230,000pm dry lease - stll have to buy that fuel though. After we have flown it for while, we’ll need to do a little maintenance and we see a ‘D’ check is on schedule, costs us $1.2Mil on average. An engine overhaul on the CFM-56 will be something like $2.3 mil on average. Now, operationally we need to remember that we can only operate this beastie when we have some 8500 ft of paved runway if we want to takeoff at max weight. And I won’t post up any cost per hour for aircrew – or tires – or ground support and handling - you get the idea. Again, I love the idea and I was not writing what I said to just be critical [damn bean counters!] But, again, look at the figures I presented, most of them from current data supplied by Boeing, and you’ll run right over and purchase a ticket – probably ought to go first class! Lord, give me patience 'cuz if you give me strength I'll need bail money!! 'TrapperP' | |||
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In keeping with my "takes a large fortune to make a small one" theme, I'd want to stress the "memorable" aspect instead of "convenience". How about getting a DC-6 or -7 (there are a few still around and working) and doing a total repower with some zero time Klimov turboprops or some such. Then outfit the entire plane in a first-class format circa 1940's. Then, start booking the flights where a ticket will cost about what the safari will. You can use the fact that passengers are not in danger of getting jet lag as a selling point.... for every hour in front of the computer you should have 3 hours outside | |||
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Always with the negative vibes dude..  | |||
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Mark, I reckon there is some merit in your concept ... a 'Once in a lifetime opportunity to experience....' type of thing... Promoted at the right level, it'd have legs - for how long, I don't know. Having had a little bit of recent exposure to operational aspects of keeping a DC3 in the air, it's bloody expensive... however there are people with the resources and desire to 'live a dream'.... just gotta find the market and promote accordingly. ******************************** A gun is a tool. A moron is a moron. A moron with a hammer who busts something is still just a moron, it's not a hammer problem. Daniel77 | |||
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How about just going by Steam Ship? Nice rest going Nice rest returning, and you can take three rifles and 3000 rounds of ammo and shoot 1000 head of game in three months. Of course you would need to go back to 1909 or there about. Building the Time Machine would be the kicker, Lets see if the laws of Physics allow it, and you can get the Funding for the R+D say 15 or 20 trillion to start, yea maybe in a 150 years from now we could go back in time, for a small fee of a Million or two. and Have Africa of the storied pass. Or you can just pay for a first class ticket and have a reasonable comfortable flight now. Airplanes are a bottomless pit, money wise, and that is the little piston bangers, going heavy jet and well unless you can print money, you will loose your shirt. | |||
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The oldest cliche in the aircraft world is , "How do you convert a hundred million dollars into a million dollars? Buy an airline." As too many to count have discovered. | |||
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