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Hurricane - Credit due !
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posted
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new...-Battle-Britain.html
Some good comments about the Hurricane - normally hard to find.
 
Posts: 7636 | Registered: 10 October 2002Reply With Quote
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Oh, I don't know. There's always something good to be said for the weapons platform that's good enough, available in sufficient numbers on-hand when you need them, that turn out to make a real difference.

If I recall correctly, the Hurricane was produced and employed in a variety of marks right up until the end of the war. That would have been unthinkable unless the basic concept was valid.
 
Posts: 8938 | Location: Dallas TX | Registered: 11 October 2005Reply With Quote
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the hurricane was:
less expensive to produce

had more effective firepower than the spit
(unless you compare to a cannon armed Spit MkII)
(caused more damage) because it was far superior as a gun platform.
was more easily repaired when battle damaged
had FAR better landing and low speed characteristics
(fewer operational loses as opposed to loses due to air combat)

and by the numbers the differences in performance were not material to it's combat effectiveness against the enemy aircraft it encountered.

Much as german fighter pilots beleved the Spitfire was a dangerous opponent there was again no real significant difference in performance between the Spit, the Hurricane
and the Bf109-E.

But the extra 30cal guns of the hurricane had a telling effect against the german bombers that were it's primary prey.

But a Hurricane was not a "sitting duck" against a 109E.
the odds were "even" but as the old saying goes if you are entering a fight with even odds you're doing something wrong.

Yes in free flight there were differences, but during actual combat air manuevering the differences disappeared
and were overwhelmed by differences in the skill of the pilots flying those aircraft and how agressive those pilots were willing to be.


the real secret is having a pilot know the strengths and weakness of his own aircraft and simply not try to do things he can't.

Hurricane pilots that could lure a 109 pilot into a low speed turning battle went home, the german pilot either got
first class military funeral in the english countryside or
a lengthy, all-expenses-paid stay at a nice comfy
POW camp in Canada.

One thing a german pilot making that mistake didn't get to do was to warn his surviving buddies what not to do...


AD


If I provoke you into thinking then I've done my good deed for the day!
Those who manage to provoke themselves into other activities have only themselves to blame.

*We Band of 45-70er's*

35 year Life Member of the NRA

NRA Life Member since 1984
 
Posts: 4601 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: 21 March 2005Reply With Quote
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Picture of TrapperP
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quote:
Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
the hurricane was:
less expensive to produce

had more effective firepower than the spit
(unless you compare to a cannon armed Spit MkII)
(caused more damage) because it was far superior as a gun platform.
was more easily repaired when battle damaged
had FAR better landing and low speed characteristics
(fewer operational loses as opposed to loses due to air combat)

and by the numbers the differences in performance were not material to it's combat effectiveness against the enemy aircraft it encountered.

Much as german fighter pilots beleved the Spitfire was a dangerous opponent there was again no real significant difference in performance between the Spit, the Hurricane
and the Bf109-E.

But the extra 30cal guns of the hurricane had a telling effect against the german bombers that were it's primary prey.

But a Hurricane was not a "sitting duck" against a 109E.
the odds were "even" but as the old saying goes if you are entering a fight with even odds you're doing something wrong.

Yes in free flight there were differences, but during actual combat air manuevering the differences disappeared
and were overwhelmed by differences in the skill of the pilots flying those aircraft and how agressive those pilots were willing to be.


the real secret is having a pilot know the strengths and weakness of his own aircraft and simply not try to do things he can't.

Hurricane pilots that could lure a 109 pilot into a low speed turning battle went home, the german pilot either got
first class military funeral in the english countryside or
a lengthy, all-expenses-paid stay at a nice comfy
POW camp in Canada.

One thing a german pilot making that mistake didn't get to do was to warn his surviving buddies what not to do...


AD

Quite agree. An older gentleman in our little village was an RAF pilot during the B of B, flew mainly Beaufighters of all things. He had good things to say about the Hurricane and its armaments being superior to that of the Spitfire although he thought the Spit was the most enjoyable craft he ever flew. I've listened to him tell some interesting stories over the years, things like he had seven close mates; he alone survived WWII. And the most enlightening thing I ever heard him say was you must not only pick your fights carefully but you must also pick the scene of the fight with equal care. He and others I have heard say you must always fight within the best performance envelope of your ride while making the necessary allowances for the other guys performance where ever it is equal or better than yours. I think this was played out to the utmost in the case of the Flying Tigers use of the P40 against the Japanese Zero.
I also heard Adolf Galland ["Battle of Britain, Forty Years Later"] say the Spitfire and the Bf109 were so nearly equal the pilot flying the plane made the real difference. May all these guys rest in peace no matter what flag they flew under.
Good pilots playing the game to the best performance characteristics of the A/C in all these cases made the difference.


Lord, give me patience 'cuz if you give me strength I'll need bail money!!
'TrapperP'
 
Posts: 3742 | Location: Moving on - Again! | Registered: 25 December 2003Reply With Quote
one of us
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To set the cause above renown,
To love the game beyond the prize,
To honour, while you strike him down,
The foe that comes with fearless eyes;
To count the life of battle good,
And dear the land that gave you birth,
And dearer yet the brotherhood
That binds the brave of all the earth--

Clifton Chapel - Sir Henry Newbolt

Peter.


Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong;
 
Posts: 10515 | Location: Jacksonville, Florida | Registered: 09 January 2004Reply With Quote
Moderator

Picture of Mark
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Yep, Hurricames are still getting stiffed.

I just happened across this pic this evening:



Here is the text:


RAF 'Spitfire' shot down on Dunkirk beach

From here:

http://gallery.nen.gov.uk/image651563-swgfl.html

Now, look at the wingtips and the tail.


for every hour in front of the computer you should have 3 hours outside
 
Posts: 7776 | Location: Between 2 rivers, Middle USA | Registered: 19 August 2000Reply With Quote
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