I'm interested in what methods are used to cull deer in managed deer herds in Europe.

Are the hunting rules of fair chase always followed or are the herd 'managers' allowed short cuts which would not be allowed for hunting?

Thanks.

Here in Italy if you are granted culls or required to exectute cull programs like I am, you get to take advantage of a series out otherwise illegal practises.

To begin with a cull may take place outside of the usual hunting season. Also, in culling programs, we may also shoot on the "silence" days, Friday and Tuesday when hunting otherwise wouldn't be allowed.

They allow you to shoot at night with the use of a spotlight, unlike normal hunting which is limited to daylight legal shooting hours.

You may not shoot from a vehicle however you may use it for transport, support, lights, etc. then shoot across the bonnet from outside the vehicle.

Care needs to be taken in identifying you target, since the deer culls are sex/age specific to some very finite levels.

For deer, we are required to use a rifle with scope (the wording of the article implies no iron sights) and the rifle must be .22cal or above have a longer case length than 40mm. (would exclude some calibers that are in fact allowed - 6PPC, .44rem mag rifle) shotguns are allowed only for culling pigs, though it is seems they too should require the same firearms, but since it is the norm to use a shotgun it hasn't been made an issue.

Each year I am granted about 3 culls that last around a month and include about 20 animals(pigs and/or deer). Further this year I have been called upon to partake in a programme for the total eradication of wild pigs in specific area.

They aim to conclude this particular program by Dec 2005, though I have very serious doubts as to whether they will do anything more than give a lot of people a chance to have shot here and there.

According to German hunting law the forestry administration issues a game management plan for major game like roe deer, red stag, mufflon and chamois. The base for the plan is historical experience, observation on the quantity of heads around and the state of the vegetation in the woods, especially the just germinated, little trees of the species which are eaten with preference (nordic pine, oak).

I won't go into details regarding red stag because it's a somewhat complicated business, the management plan is based not only on sexes but also on age classes. Usually for stag not only one lease (usually around 300 to 1000 hectares) but a whole reagion is managed.

For roe deer it's quite simple: Averaged over three years a given quantity of males and the same amount of females has to be shot, no matter what age. Included into the count is game animals found dead and road kill.

No "short cuts" are allowed, to shoot fawns which is honestly not the most pleasing thing to do even though after eating them you might think differently is subject to the same respect and ethics as killing a trophy buck.

Especially for the young or not so well connected hunter this kind of "culling" is a good way to get acceptance on a lease and "earn" the opportunity for a buck. I think it's a good way to start. It doesn't have to have antlers in order to make an exciting hunt.

Hey Express,
What is the reason for the eradication of the wildboar?
Are the silent days a new addition to the law, can you hunt without a gun on those days?

As for 'culling', I believe that in France/Belgium, the same hunting methods are used for both sexes (drives/stalking). On the whole driven shooting is quite effective in reducing populations and looks more exciting than spotlighting.

The reason they want to eradicate the wild boar over some zones in the Province of Siena is due to incompatible interest between agriculturalists and the beasts.

It has been deducted that wild boar are found in densities that cannot be sustained by the crop growers so they are seeking to eradicate them.

Of course, there are contingency funds for the damaged farmers, and the whole thing is a complete farse.

It all revolves around getting your mate, who works in a government office to let you have a shot at some pigs. In exchange for some salami, wine or some other favour. Unless you live here, you cannot understand the way it all works, or better put, doesn't work.

I have noticed a marked decreace in the populations of all wild game in the last 5 years, mostly due to climate and drought, partly due to poaching and also due the the lack of support or management if you like, of the wild game itself.

No farmer is out of pocket because of vermin eating his crops, they are handed out subsidies to cover thier losses.
All farms, my own included are giving subsidy just for planting a variety of given crops, and manage to outweigh costs even before harvesting. I take full advantage of the subsidy for planting each year. Though I do not harvest and leave it for the game.
My property is a preserve, a place where wild game is supposed to be allowed to mulitply unmolestered.
So to the uninitated, it might appear that the said eredication plan should not apply. However the arable field I own, even though they are confined within and make up part of the preserve are to be considered ecomonical goods, so I should kill off all the pigs that dare wonder out there.

Here we are a nation of beurocrats. The comlicated culling is just another demonstartion of this. It is supported by a pool of "experts" who engage in a series of studies that are, from a game management, or even scientific point of view, questionable.

Planting a stake on a ramdom spot on a map with a piece of string attatched to it and counting the amout of shit(feaces) that is found within the range of the cord is one such method of census of the wild game population accepted here.
It is all made to sounds so awefully sophisticated to the unniciated who unfortunately are the ones who pass the laws.

Just consider that in order to partake in said culling you may either qulify as the landowner, his employee or a game warden. In order to attain the status person qualified to participate in the prescence of the game warded for the property you must participate in a labourisous government "training" course(very long, boring and expensive). They will teach you the difference between a fallow, roe, boar, sow, and not much else. Once you have been so trained you can partake. But you should remember to invote whoever it was that put in a good work for you at the final exam.

I am willing to bet everything I own, and everything I could ever possibly hope to own that the wild boar will still be here in 2006 and the Provincal admin will still be thinking of ways to solve the "problem"

Ignorance and greed will prevail.

do I sound bitter?

NitroX,

German hunting laws do not apply to culling fenced deer. The owner of the herd needs a shooting permit (not a hunting license). When hunting, there are certain minimum requirements for the calibers used, while culling is often done with a .22 to the head, or with silenced rifles. It is more like killing cattle than hunting.

Management of wild deer is done by normal hunting, without any short cuts. There is no legal differentiation between trophy hunting and shooting females for reduction purposes.

Interested in your use of the words hunting and culling as seperate activities.



Speaking for myself in England my hunting is by virtue of my culling. All must be done within season, no shots from vehicles, no shots at night or with a lamp and no driving deer with vehicles.



If you are talking about fenced deer I cannot offer any insight.

Thanks for everyones replies.

No I was referring to wild deer, not farmed or fenced deer.

My questions was due to the large number of offspring from a decent sized herd that would need to be culled each year, leaving some to grow older for poachers ( ) and also allow some to allow selective culling as they age.

While some of it ca be fun, shooting say 20 to 40 spikers and yearlings each year could be a lot of work, especially if it has all to be done by hunting fair chase. From hochsitz or by stalking. On the other hand it can be quite easy to shoot a half dozen to ten in a night using a spotlight.

Th choice of words "shooting" vs "hunting" was deliberate. I will use non-fair chase methods if the situation calls for it but do not regard it as sporting or hunting. We have the advantage and disadvantage of next to no laws and no protection for deer whatsoever except for general cruelty laws. Advantage as you can do what you want. Disadvantage as a person can do what they want ( ) and perhaps shoot out a herd quickly if the country is accessible and landowner protection is removed.

I was wondering if eg in parts of Europe culling could be done using less sporting but efficient methods or whether it had to be all done by fair chase as with "trophy" animals.

Thanks again.

Nitro X



In the UK less than "sporting" methods are often used to kill wild deer and the chief perpetrator being the Forestry Commission, a Government body.



This organisation often portays itself as semi Green with Conservation at its heart, but lots of stalkers in the UK know of another private side which essentially espouses the idea that "the only good deer is a dead deer". The FC have other willing partners within the Government such as the Deer Comission For Scotland and English Nature.



In Scotland if you lease from any of the major Forestry company's, the DCS virtually gives away Night Shooting Lisences and Out of Season Licenses on a whim .dditionally, FC rangers shoot large number of deer out of season on the pretext of crop damage to timber. The law of course allows them to do this, but they often exploit it to the full...



In addition to spotlighting at night, many deer are also shot from vehicles which again is actually legal in Scotland. Before the recent uproar surrounding a big cull by DCS stalkers, they were actively using helicopters as part of their culls.. Their use was supposedly simply for moving stalkers around the hills and carcass extraction, but stories abound about them being used to drive deer and even deer being culled from them New Zealand style.



Regards,



Peter

1894

Are you saying you get out hunting 4-5 times per week over the entire year ie appox 200 hunts a year? That's a lot of hunting!