quote:

Originally posted by SLDG:
Dear Mr G a head measured by the CIC at 429g would not make a gold medal normally. But i am not familiar with all the differnt methods of measurement. Can you point me to were the Rowland Ward system is and may i add 117 would be a low silver normally. I am interested in roe heads and they way they are done. Many thanks.

SLDG, the scandinavian or maybe even nordic way of measuring roe heads consider only the scull weight, not volume and weight when calculating points. When using the nordic method you multiply the weight of the scull by 0,25 to get the points (no volume involved), then the rest of the points are given the same way as CIC. With the CIC method weight is multiplied by 0,1 and volume is multiplied by 0,3 before you get the points from weight and volume. The points from my buck the nordic way was as following:

Average lenght of left/right beam: (29cm+30cm)/2 = 14,75 points
Weight 429g x 0,25 = 107,25 points
Inside span = 4 points (4 points maximum)
Colour = 2 points (4 points maximum)
Pearling = 1,5 points (4 points maximum)
Coronets = 2 points (4 points maximum)
Tine ends = 2 points (2 points maximum)
Regularity and quality = 4,5 points (5 points maximum)
Penalty points = 0 (5 points maximum)

Total = 138 points

Because I don't know the volume of left and right beam, I don't know what the CIC score would be. I've heard that theese two methods of measuring are both comparable.

quote:

may i add 117 would be a low silver normally.

Where do you get 117 from?

When it comes to the Rowland Ward method og measuring trophies i'll just post a link below. This method mainly consider the lenght and physical size of the trophy. The lenght of my trophy is 11 7/8".

Rowland Ward

Hope I answered your questions

What do you reckon is the average volume of a head like this?

The CIC Blue book gives the following for roe deer.

ROE DEER; CHEVREUIL; REHWILD; CORZO
Capreolus capreolus capreolus

Bronze 105,00 – 114,99
Silver 115,00 – 129,99
Gold 130,00 +

Yes, the same scale will be used with the method above.

Thanks for the link to Rowland Ward

I knew about them as A friend of mine keeps a herd of Barasinga and Rowland Ward is the only system for measuring Barasinga Head

Regardless of the score, it is a GREAT head Mr G!

It looks like the scoring system you cited above is partially the same as the CIC. As you pointed out, volume does not seem to be scored (measured with water in CIC) and mass is scored higher than it would be in CIC. Other than that, the systems look fairly equivalent.

In any event, that head could well be one of a lifetime, so savour it regardless of what the numbers or anybody else says.

- mike

MR.G Sorry i made a mistake about the 117. I was mixed up with the lenght post.
Was the head you got measured full scull or cut .If cut what was the cut. But for weight with the cic measurement the 429 grams would get you 42.9 cic points the other points seem very similar regards volume the normal amount i have found is about 10% more than the weight.That would give you a point score for volume of just under 47.2 cic points .
With the rest of the score the cic way would have got you. 120.85 CIC POINTS Now this is just going on what we know and we do not know the volume.

I read the rowland Ward and it seems that the lenght and span is what makes a good trophy with that measurement so i would imagine a few really big heads from here would not qualify at all.My friend has a gold that is only nine inch but weighs in at 647grm (full scull)It would not have been accepted.

mho, thanks! in the end it's the memories from the hunt that counts, not the trophy size.... I sure hope to find a trophy buck like this atleast once more before I call it the end. I find roe buck trophies in particular amongst top 3 of fascinating heads. Truth is this was the first roe buck I shot. Maybe beginners luck

SLDG, the head was measured cut. As far as I can remember, weight of full scull was 496g. The upper jaw when cut was 67g I reckon. About that 9 inch gold trophy...I was told that you would need a lenght of 25-26cm to make the Rowland Ward list. If I'm right that would be about 10 inches or more.

You are correct so there is a place to get the very tall nice even heads measured were they will get looked at. I am sure you will shoot many more trophys and i my self hope to shoot many many more.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr. G:
...this was the first roe buck I shot.

That will be hard to top, mate.

Was this taken in Norway?? Southern Sweden has an excellent reputation for large roe.

- mike

quote:

Originally posted by mho:
Was this taken in Norway?? Southern Sweden has an excellent reputation for large roe.

- mike

Yes this buck was shot in Norway. From a treestand not far from where I live I got some friends down in Sweden. Been there hunting once, but no success yet.