I know that this topic has probably been discussed many times before, but please forgive my curiosity. What are some opinions on the use of .22 centerfires (.22 Hornet, .222, .223, 5.6x50, 22-250, 5.6x57)on roe deer (or possibly chamois). I realize that caliber regulations vary greatly in Europe, and that .22 caliber centerfires are not legal for hunting roe deer in many areas. I am simply curious and want to hear some opinions from European hunters. Also, can anyone tell me if they are legal for roe deer (or chamois) in Austria? Any input would be appreciated. Thanks.

9.3, I can't answer all your questions, but I can have a go at a few of them.

On the Continent, I don't know of anywhere, where the the .22 Hornet is legal for roe - not in Germany, Switzerland... The legal minimum is usually taken to be the .222 Rem, but that is often based on some minimum energy measured at 100 m, say, and only a few factory loadings actually meet the minimum criteria (Hirtenberger). The .222 Rem works fine for roe, but it probably is a sensible minimum, so don't overstretch your distance, and choose your shots with care. You also need to make sure you are not shooting varmint bullets. But since the .222 Rem is so accurate, a lot of people use it to neck shoot roe (normally at pretty close distances). That works and takes away much of the worry about penetration capability of the .224 cal bullets - although at the price of a somewhat chancy shot.

Larger .224 calibers work fine for roe. Some have a bad rap for creating quite a bit of bloodshot meat, so if your twist rate will allow it, shooting slightly heavier bullets at somewhat lower velocities is probably not a bad idea. Calibers like the 5.6x50(R) and .22-250 have quite a following for roe.

If I'm not mistaken, Austria has some unusual requirements for minimum calibers. I don't believe they (like the German or Swiss) define minimums in terms of bore dimension or bullet energy. At least in one Bundesland (state), Salzburg, I believe the minimum caliber is based on the length of the case. The .222 Rem falls below the minimum, but pretty much anything longer than that (including the .223 Rem) is legal. I would personally not hesitate to take a chamois with a .22-250 with the right bullets. Only, don't expect much of a blood trail if you have to look for one.

FWIW - mike

P.S. In Germany you'll need a 6.5mm or larger for Chamois. In Switzerland, the minimum varies from Kanton to Kanton (state to state) - 7mm, 8mm or 10.3mm are minimum calibers that just come to mind

Hello,

In Scotland the min requirement is .222 but only for Roe.
I have used a 222 and 55gr Sako gameheads for many years and have been very pleased with the results,but then its where you hit them as much as what you use I suppose,and the .222 is accurate and negligible recoil is easy to shoot....good for foxes too.

cheers Roebuck

Hello 9.3 rifleman (nice nickname btw),

Hunting legislation in Austria is handled on the level of the 9 federal states "Bundesland". This not only applies to calibers but also shooting times and the other dozens of rules for hunting we have in place.

Since i am from Austria i can find out if you are telling me exactely which federal state / location you are heading for. Just let me know.

On a personal level, i have hunted roe bucks with everything from .17 Rem (which is legal in my place as we have just a minimal case length) up to a 416 WBY (now that was quite an experience ).
I think a 22. centerfire is a valid starting point for hunting roe deer as long as you follow some rules. First, in every occasion you should use proper bullets, which means take the heaviest, reliable expanding bullet your rifle will shoot accurately. Good shot placement will be necessary. The .222 and .223 will limit your shooting to about 100-150 yards, the faster calibers (22-250, 5,5x50 Mag, 5,6x57) will stretch that a little bit further (maybe 200-250 yards).
For chamois the .222 and .223 are out of place imho - this is the where the 5,6x57 or 22-250 come into the game. Most hunters will pick a heavier caliber for chamois - you would see more likely a .243 Win/6,5x57/.270 Win in the alps then a 5,6x57.

I personally hunt roe deer and chamois with my 7x64 most of the time. It´s a little bit on the overkill side for these animals but anyhow - i have supreme confindence in that specific rifle/cartridge combination.

Cheers
Roman

9.3 rifleman
In Sweden the legal cartridges for roe start with the 222 Rem, the 22 Hornet is only legal for Government hunters for depradation hunts /culls. I’ve used the 222 Rem a bit and find it to be a useful, quiet and efficient little killer as long as it is used with judgement. Bullet placement is important (!) and of course also your choice of projectile. If you only shoot behind the shoulders a soft bullet will do but if you aim for the shoulder the tougher bullets are vital for your results – both when it comes t not wounding the animal but also if you want something left to eat…!
I find it to be a good choice for hunts on open land (farm land), close to buildings/homes/villages etc at ranges up t0 200 meters. If your hunting in forested areas I prefer something with a heavier bullet as the slightest touch from a twig or even a straw will send the bullet astray. For me the 55 grain Sierra Game King has been a good performer.
One thing to remember is that the blood trail is very often small and sometimes totally inexistent.

Cheers
K9

Roe don't take a lot of killing.

K9-75 more or less exactly said what I think _

" find it to be a good choice for hunts on open land (farm land), close to buildings/homes/villages etc at ranges up t0 200 meters. If your hunting in forested areas I prefer something with a heavier bullet as the slightest touch from a twig or even a straw will send the bullet astray. For me the 55 grain Sierra Game King has been a good performer. "


I've shot some with a 222rem (55gr sierra gameking at 3,100fps)and a 5.6x50R (60gr hornady sp at 3,300fps) both worked nicely and were a pleasure to use.

The reduced noise and recoil are pleasant and in skilled hands they are tremendous fun but when the cull is under pressure the 243 or 6mm rem allow a little more flexibility.

I have shot a few roe with .224 cartridges, with bullets ranging from a 50gr Nosler Balistic Tip at 3,500 fps to the 74gr RWS Kegel Spitz at 3,000.
I never found any of them to be too soft on roe and always concluded that the softer ones killed much more efficiently that penetrators like the 60gr Nosler Partition or the 53gr Barnes X.
My choice, based in my own experience, would either be the 55gr Sierra Game King or the 60 gr Hornady Spire Point.
Regards,
Montero

I have shot about 40 roe with my CZ 233.rem.
Since I reload, I have tried several bullets.
Nosler BR 55.gr. Very effective, instand kills but massive destruction of meat. Hornady V-max. dito.
Now I use Berger HP 52 gr, in fact a target/varmint bullet, but very effective on roe size animals. These bullets don't explode like the Noslers and go through up to 150 mtrs. Animials either drop on the spot or run off 30 mtrs. max.

My load: 24,5 gr. AA 2230

In Italy the minimum legal caliber is 5.6, but in some regions regulations can change and minimum caliber is often 6.5 or 7 mm. Personally, since I'm not a first class sniper, I use the 270 Win. or even the 300 WM for roe deer or chamois; I know it's on the big side, but I feel more confident, especially for the chamois, due to frequent long range shooting. Anyway, I had equal or less meat damage by shooting critters with the 300 WM and 180 g. Hornady SST, than with the 270 W and 130 g. Nosler BT. A friend of mine, a fan of little calibers, saw a roe deer that I shot with my Tikka 300 WM, and he was surprised by the little meat damage; he admitted that his 25-06 is somewhat more devastating.

Thank you all for sharing your information. It was exactly what I was looking for.

EuroHunter,
Thank you for answering my questions about .22 calibers in Austria. I am interested in the minimum caliber regulations for Rehwild, Rotwild, and Gams in Tirol (Stubaital) and Steiermark (Salzkammergut region near Bad Aussee). I was also curious about how the .17 Rem. performed on the deer you shot with it. It sounds like you are a true rifleman who tries things out for himself and I respect that a lot. Thanks again for your help and good luck hunting!

In Germany there is no caliber regulation for roe deer but the bullet must have 1000 joule of energy at 100 meters, but this is only for roe deer, because roe der is by law not big game.

I just look for a 5,6x61 SE vom Hofe for a roe deer rifle, I love the old and rare calibers.

Burkhard

Burkhard,
I love those old and rare calibers too. They add something special to the hunt when you use them. The 5.6 x 61 Vom Hofe SE would be a cool cartridge to use, and I would guess that it works great on roe deer. After reading your post, I researched this caliber and found that reloading components are still available. I think I need to look into this caliber further. Thanks

Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using

[QUOTE]Originally posted by EuroHunter:
Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" caome to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gn cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season, where you usually do see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guees it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by EuroHunter:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EuroHunter:
Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" caome to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gn cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season, where you usually do see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guees it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine as that deer died in its track.

Third, i still think this was a very special situation and i am not going to propose the widespread use of the .17 Rem on deer. I know there are heavier .17 caliber bullets around but my personal comfort level is somewhere else.

I agree on your statement, about trying things out on our selfs. Unfortunately, in these times, to many hunters are stuck to the infomercials the hunting press is feeding them - instead of going out to the field and collecting experiences and memories on their own.

Good Hunting!
Roman

Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" caome to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gn cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season, where you usually do see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guees it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine as that deer died in its track.

Third, i still think this was a very special situation and i am not going to propose the widespread use of the .17 Rem on deer. I know there are heavier .17 caliber bullets around but my personal comfort level is somewhere else.

I agree on your statement about trying things out on our selfs. Unfortunately, in these times, to many hunters are stuck to the infomercials the hunting press is feeding them - instead of going out to the field and collecting experiences and memories on their own. A very well known hungarian red deer hunter (Esterhazy) was asked, after having shoot his 1000st red deer with the 6,5x64 Mannlicher Schoenauer, what the perfect caliber for hunting red deer would be. His answer was, i don´t know - i don´t have enough experience to tell you! Let´s just imagine, what the hunting press would think and write on this today....

Good Hunting!
Roman

Originally posted by EuroHunter:
Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule rule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" caome to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gn cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season, where you usually do see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guees it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine as that deer died in its track.

Third, i still think this was a very special situation and i am not going to propose the widespread use of the .17 Rem on deer. I know there are heavier .17 caliber bullets around but my personal comfort level is somewhere else.

I agree on your statement about trying things out on our selfs. Unfortunately, in these times, to many hunters are stuck to the infomercials the hunting press is feeding them - instead of going out to the field and collecting experiences and memories on their own. A very well known hungarian red deer hunter (Esterhazy) was asked, after having shoot his 1000st red deer with the 6,5x64 Mannlicher Schoenauer, what the perfect caliber for hunting red deer would be. His answer was, i don´t know - i don´t have enough experience to tell you! Let´s just imagine, what the hunting press would think and write on this today....

Good Hunting!
Roman

Originally posted by EuroHunter:
Originally posted by EuroHunter:
Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule rule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" come to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gun cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season and you usually do not see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guees it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine as that deer died in its track.

Third, i still think this was a very special situation and i am not going to propose the widespread use of the .17 Rem on deer. I know there are heavier .17 caliber bullets around but my personal comfort level is somewhere else.

I agree on your statement about trying things out on our selfs. Unfortunately, in these times, to many hunters are stuck to the infomercials the hunting press is feeding them - instead of going out to the field and collecting experiences and memories on their own. A very well known hungarian red deer hunter (Esterhazy) was asked, after having shoot his 1000st red deer with the 6,5x64 Mannlicher Schoenauer, what the perfect caliber for hunting red deer would be. His answer was, i don´t know - i don´t have enough experience to tell you! Let´s just imagine, what the hunting press would think and write on this today....

Good Hunting!
Roman[/QUOTE]

Hello 9,3 rifleman,

the minimal caliber regulations for Tirol are: Rehwild (roe deer) - a bullet energy of 980 Joule at 100 meters and for Gams (chamois) and Rotwild (red deer) - a bullet energy of 2300 Joule at 100 meters. For Styria it is very similar, 1000 Joule at 100 meters for Rehwild and 2000 Joule at 100 meters for the other two.

So that would make any .22 centerfire cartridge from the .222 Rem up legal for roe deer and the .243 Win for chamois and red deer in both federal states. You may also note that some high power 22´s like the 5,6x57 are outlawed by the 2300 Joule limit in Tirol but legal by the 2000 Joule rule in Styria.

I hope this answers your questions and wish you good hunting in Austria. Both locations, the Stubaital and the Salzkammergut are among the most precious locations in Austria.

For the .17 Remington on roe deer - that deserves further exploration. First, i am using that rifle (a 20+ years old Rem 700 BDL with a Schmid&Bender 12x56) primarily for hunting red fox and badger. I have prime confidence in this old friend as it shoots better than i am and gives me sub 1/2 inch 5 shoot groups as long as i do my part. Several "stunt shoots" come to my mind when i put out this rifle from my gun cabinet, including a neck shot badger at 180 yards.

Second, at that day i was not going for hunting roe deer, as early July here in Austria is pre-rut season and you usually do not see any old roe buck at all. So i was heading for hunting red fox on a stubble field that early morning. As the darkness of the night and the hours went by - no foxes appeared. Instead - you might already guessed it - a nice antlered 6-pointer roe buck went over that field just about 50 yards from my elevated stand. Then, for some reason, he decided to stop and have a look around. He stand there for minutes that appeared like hours to me. You might also guess which thoughts crossed my mind in these minutes. Should i or should i not? Now, for the .17 Rem - the main limitation on hunting a game like a 40 pound roe deer is in the limited penetration a bullet, like the 25 grs. Hornady HP i was using at that time, is offering. A classic behind-the-shoulder-shoot was not an option, as i had experienced no exit wound on several badgers shoot before. So the only option i saw was a neck shoot at that deer at approx. 50 yards. Quite some risk but it worked out fine as that deer died in its track.

Third, i still think this was a very special situation and i am not going to propose the widespread use of the .17 Rem on deer. I know there are heavier .17 caliber bullets around but my personal comfort level is somewhere else.

I agree on your statement about trying things out on our selfs. Unfortunately, in these times, to many hunters are stuck to the infomercials the hunting press is feeding them - instead of going out to the field and collecting experiences and memories on their own. A very well known hungarian red deer hunter (Esterhazy) was asked, after having shoot his 1000st red deer with the 6,5x64 Mannlicher Schoenauer, what the perfect caliber for hunting red deer would be. His answer was, i don´t know - i don´t have enough experience to tell you! Let´s just imagine, what the hunting press would think and write on this today....

Good Hunting!
Roman

EuroHunter,
Thank you very much for the information on the minimum caliber regulations in Tyrol and Styria. I agree with you about the use of the .17 Rem on deer, but I would have done the same thing in your situation. Also, I agree that the hunting world (and the world in general) would be a better place with more men like Esterhazy. Thanks again.