removed

puntgunner
keep far away from that prick if you ever shake hands with that bastard count your fingers afterwards.
hes nothing but a crook ask about him on guntrader
BE WARNED
REGARDS SCIRROCO

Puntgunner,
I think thats a yes, he does know "Peter Carr". Not exactly what I would call a glowing endorsement, But hey! I've been wrong before.
regards
griff

Well gentlemen.

That was interesting.

Thanks for you views.

S4A is now owned and run by David Carr. I don't know who Peter is. I know he (David) has a son that is supposed to do the IT side of the business, but I don't know what his name is.

A mate of mine set the company up a few years ago then sold it last year. Ever since I haven't heard much about it good or bad. I used to write for the site magazine and they closed that when they bought it so I've not had much to do with them.

The only thing I wil say is that a lot of their shooting is not particularly cheap anymore. The company never used to mark up shooting but I think the new owners do, so a lot of good deals don't get through to the customer.

Scirocco, can you be a bit more specific about what happened to you which left you sitting on the fence about this guy...

I am aware about an incident regarding some pigeon shooting that went wrong but that wasn't the fault of S4A.

Incidentally I can't find anything on Guntrader. What section ae the posts in?

FB

FB, I don't know, but I suspect that these Carrs are closely related by blood if not business interest.
I do know there is a Peter Carr who farms/ranches sheep in the Brighton/Rottingdean locality. I'm just putting 2 and 2 together. What it adds up too I know not.

Trans,

Sounds like the same people.

I'd be interested in knowing more specifics about peoples experiences though either here or on the PM.

Rgds,
FB

All,
Does Roger Buss have anything to do with S4ALL?
If so then I'm going to learn a few more swear words for the next post.

regards
griff

Roger Buss is D&G consultants, I don't think any connection with Shooting4all.
Personally I have no dealing or experience of any of these outfits and can neither condemn or condone any of them.
There is another who advertises in Shooting Times most/every week with various pieces of stalking/roughshooting that membership entitles you to access.....internet rumour has you avoid like the plague!!!"shooting.sh" no longer advertise their identity but just use a mobile number or three.
As to Peter Carr hope Scirroco may further enlighten us experience/ location/identity wise.

Hi All,

I just spoke to a mate who started S4A up. Peter Carr has no connection to David Carr and John Carr of S4A. David fronts up S4A and is the son of John, who runs two shoots in Suffolk. Anything Peter has done to upset anyone is nothing to do with S4A. In fact the stalking side of the business is also franchised out to a company called Ayrestalk (sp?) . Another guy had that for a couple of years but let the franchise go as he was asked to go to Namibia and set up a 100k acre hunting operation.

As for D&G I can add my name to the list of disgruntled people. I spoke to him some years ago when he was advertising a list as long as your arm for properties available for stalking leases. You had to register and pay a fee, £15-£25 i can't remember exactly how much. When the fee was paid he would send you the list. I never saw a list of properties and could not get in touch with him again.He was probably in the bank cashing everyones cheques!! With the ammount of advertising he put out I'm in no doubt that a lot of people fell foul of the stories.

Anyway I just wanted to remove Shooting4all from any unfair negative publicity because of the other two guys ations.

FB

Transpond,
the membership you speak of is offered by D&G consultants.They also have web site, it may be called "deerlanduk" or "deeruk" of something similar, please accept my apologies if there is no connection..
D&G Consultants is run by Roger Robbin Bastard Buss,I unfortunately have an intimate knowledge of the dealings of this man and decided at very early stage to distance myself from him,2 other members from AR have had what can only be described as a Butt F****ng in the hands of this man.. I'm sure their blood will boil as soon as they hear this mans name and there could be lengthy reply with lots of expletives!!

regards
griff

I too have heard a few horror stories about Roger Buss aka D&G Consultants. A few years back I mentioned him to a chap who I was out stalking with and the very name set off an epileptic like fit of rage!!

With this sort of reputation it makes you wander how D&G Consultants have remained in buisness for so long?

The last I heard was that he was offering for £200 level 1 awareness courses, which of course everbody who did one of these courses then had to sit a DMQ level 1 course and pay an extra fee, o'h did I not tell that is what you would have have to do, a'h well thanks for the £200 any way...

Pete,
I think he has stayed in business for so long because of the need for ground to stalk on,newbie stalkers and the uninformed are very susceptible to the car salesman like patter..

So to all you stalkers out there if you ever get shown a piece of ground by the super slick RB look at the bottom of the walking stick and you will see a nicely grafted roe foot,the next statement will be look at all the slots load of deer here ..
Don't piss up by back Roger and tell me it raining.

regards
griff

Griff,


By the way..............
Roger send his best .

Just would like to add my two pennath - when I first started stalking I came across Mr Buss what a total robbing lieing cheating chappy.

Permit, promises and £££ = 0 deer

Keep well away - You've been warned!!

I too can vouch for the money grabbing antics of Mr Buss. As a novice stalker he parted me with a fair quantity of my hard-earned in return for lots of early mornings and not a lot else. Great Chew used to be one of his, along with Auchencairn nr Thornhill. To think a friend and I also paid for his dinner on a couple of occasions
He was supposed to have sold the business in about 2002 so either something went wrong or his pension wasn't as good as he thought

Peter Carr is now, I believe, heavily involved in the running of the Carminnows estate. Although having no experience of them myself I understand that you can hunt wild boar on this estate, they do not need much notice just enough time to let them out of the trailers apparently.

John

Yes John

Carminnows or "The Zoo" as it is referred to is a pretty sad state of affairs in my opinion.

Anyway, nevermind I suppose.............

I too spent a season sitting in various D&G highseats. Saw two deer in six months but never got a shot.
Also did the course without realising that the certificate wasn't worth diddly until my FLO filled me in.
Caveat emptor they say. I wish I'd known more about the whole qualifications business before I set out. But there's more to stalking than killing deer and, in truth, I've met some very nice people too who have become valued friends.
On balance, I've gained more than I've lost.

Regarding Mr.P.Carr.
2 months ago I recieved a call from a guy N.F. who booked stalking boar hunt with P.Carr. He and his mate paid a deposit and never heard from him a word.
Regarding other agents,
Do not trust to videos about driven boar in Europe because they are made in fenced areas.
I can organise a hunt to take 120 boars in 3 days but I won't put it on DVD. It's fenced

This Peter Carr guy is all over Sporting Rifle magazine.

Latest article is in the Nov'08 issue where he has an American up at Carminnows to shoot a Soay Ram.

quote:

Originally posted by Claret_Dabbler:
This Peter Carr guy is all over Sporting Rifle magazine.

Latest article is in the Nov'08 issue where he has an American up at Carminnows to shoot a Soay Ram.

I wondered if it was the same.Another name appeared in another shooting magazine in the UK which bore a remarkable similarity to a gentleman[sic] who shot a red deer,or was it 2?,in Kerry a couple of years ago.
I remember it made the papers here.Fined and rifles confiscated.
Can anyone elaborate on that ?
If anyone is wondering you cannot shoot red deer in Kerry.

Sika, I seem to remember two Engilsh gents got themselves into bad company in Kerry. They went home minus their rifles and hefty fines apiece...

I can't remember more details than that.

This one is from Sporting Rifle

I read the article in Sporting Rifle. I was a bit surprised to see the Soay listed as a target species. My understanding was that they were one of the oldes breeds of domesticated sheep and were still found on St Kilda long after the rest of the British Isles had switched to other breeds.
Despite the way the story is written, I can't quite plug into the thrill (if there is one) of stalking up to a flock of sheep to nail one.

I am booked to go on a driven boar trip with Mr Carr in January, so far so good.

Will post on it when I get back.

Regards,

Amir

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
I am booked to go on a driven boar trip with Mr Carr in January, so far so good.

Will post on it when I get back.

Regards,

Amir

you wont have a problem,Ive delt with Mr Carr for some years now and have been all over the place with him in Fact Ive had 3 trips to Africa with him all were superb ,we went to shoot cull beasts and ended up shooting trophies at no extra cost and the package price coundnt be beat by anyone in the world,in fact the team I took accross has booked again,
so yes there maybe stories flying around and yes Mr Carr has had a bad patch a few years ago BUT hes still here and stil operating,must be doing something right
Oh and he had nothing to do with Stags being shot ilegally in Ireland
hers the gold medal Elan Bull I took

and a bit of field dressing on a Giraffe one of the team took

a nice big pig I took at a water hole on evening

and to break the trip up a bit of Tiger fishing

Amir, hope all goes well

A

amazing really no one else on the trip had a problem with any trophies,remember Iam still waiting for mine to arrive as well,
anyway Jo if I remember correctly you persoanlly had a superb time and took trophies of a life time,something you will never do again,so I do think credit were credit is due for a great trip at a really good price and to be able to shoot trophy animals at no extra cost (only extra if you wanted the head of course)

Pete,

You are absolutely spot on. I did have a fantastic time... And as you said 'credit where credit's due ' - from what I saw, it was all down to your planning and Johans guiding. And for that I am extremely greatful. thank you

Thanks mate for a moment I thought you wasnt happy,given the fact yourself or Ian hasnt once posted a hunt report of what was a hunt of a lifetime being able to take animals some people only dream about,strange how a weekend on the fallow with members off this site created a better subject
also thanks to Mr Carr for the package and the cheap price 2K for 10 days hunting,lets not forget that a theres no place on earth you get the chance to shoot what we did for the price we paid,Girrafe,Kudo Bulls,Eland Bulls,Hogs ,Cheata (tracks were seen everyday)Dika,and dont forget the snake you clobbered
what exactly did you end up with beside the 2 trophy Kudu Bulls

Thank you Foxshooter and Artemis.

Peter has been efficient and was recommended by a friend at my rifle club. Having spoken to him, I am confident he will deliver the goods and provide a very enjoyable hunt for reasonable money; in any event i'm an excellent litigator

Foxshooter, by all means tell me to pull my big nose out it, but on balance I'm not sure going into the financial minutae of Artemis' hunt on a public forum would be very productive for any of the parties

Sam suggestion of pm, for what could be considered to be confidential terms of business, seems to be particularly sensible just at the moment

All the best,

Amir

with respect I mentioned the cost to give credit were credit is due,No one in the UK or anywhere else for that matter could beat or even match the price of African hunting Mr Carr can offer,
the entire party apart from Ian and Jo have booked again (so that must say something) and I think I will also be joining them
unfortunatly Jo had a lets just say misunderstanding on the ethics of paying for trophy fees,nothing that hasnt been sorted but a shame she feels there is an issue (a difficult situation seeing there both my freinds)
anyway where abouts are you going ?? I may even be there as well

quote:

Originally posted by Foxshooter:
with respect I mentioned the cost to give credit were credit is due,No one in the UK or anywhere else for that matter could beat or even match the price of African hunting Mr Carr can offer,
the entire party apart from Ian and Jo have booked again (so that must say something) and I think I will also be joining them
unfortunatly Jo had a lets just say misunderstanding on the ethics of paying for trophy fees,nothing that hasnt been sorted but a shame she feels there is an issue (a difficult situation seeing there both my freinds)
anyway where abouts are you going ?? I may even be there as well

My point exactly, we are all friends

My point is that it is quite possible that neither Peter nor Jo would the precise details of the arrangement discussed in public, until a mutually agreed conclusion has been reached. Most business relationships proceed along this basis in any event.

I say this because Peter has been very helpful and absolutely straight with me and the chap who recommended him speaks highly of him; I therefore have no doubts with regards to his business. I also know Jo well and also therefore have no doubts about her integrity, in fact I would go so far as to consider this last non-negotiable.

In the manner of friends i'm going to remember that discretion is the better part of valour and therefore more on this particular subject anon

I'm going to Germany, Count Erbach's estate no less for the reasonable sum ( if anyone would like to know precisely how much I can do no better than to refer you Peter himself at his whitehuntersafari web page ) between the 23rd and 26th January. Are you on the same trip? I booked the trip last minute on an impulse, got made redundant the next day, cancelled, changed my mind and booked again! A bit of a circuitous route so I appreciated Peter’s patience and help!

Regards,

Amir

I am not pleased with the way Peter Carr operates for the following reason.
In February this year I was booked to shoot wild Boar with him in October, full details were to be supplied on receipt of the deposit.
I paid my deposit but when I found out it was shooting surplus Boar from the Wild Life Park at Carminnows I cancelled within a fortnight.
I was told I could not have my deposit back but he would credit it against another trip in Germany around January, details were to follow.
I have e mailed him and left messages on his voice mail but heard nothing since.
I would have thought with the notice I gave him it would have been easier to refund my deposit.

I have beeen using Roger Buss and a number of other UK stalkers for about 20 years.

Using Roger has not been completely without its problems but to be totally honest I've not had the bad experiences that others seem to have had.

I have had something like 30 outings with Roger over seven pieces of ground currently or at one time leased by him and only on one occasion have I not seen deer. That was at Great Tew in the Cotswolds on a piece of ground that was supposed to have fallow, roe, and muntjac and I saw absolutely nothing and very little sign of anything apart from fallow.

To give a balanced view here are a few bad experiences with him mostly around the question of charges and money.

I usually stalk "unaccompanied" and Roger lets me do this on the basis of our long association whereas he requires DSC1 from anyone else. On one occasion I had shot a deer that I didn't want to take and he came over from another piece of ground a few miles away to collect it, I then gralloched one that he had in the vehicle as I "had my hands dirty" and instead of £40 he tried to charge me £60 for an accompanied stalk as he had to come over to get the deer!

I got caught by using his overnight accommodation and was charged £30 for sleeping in a "doss house" on Hayling Island, I learnt my lesson and just refused that option and used a Travelodge thereafter.

He used to overshoot some ground, the Hyde Estate at Handcross was one. To be fair this estate has some excellent deer, a big head of top quality fallow with some medal bucks, some good roe, a few muntjac and the odd sika. A one point it seemed that we were always on the Hyde and it got to the stage where, although we would always see deer, they were getting a little spooky and hard to approach. I then just requested not to go to the Hyde when booking with him unless in the fallow rut.

He occasionally used to ask well above market rate for venison if you wanted it, I just called his bluff and said that I didn't want the carcass at that price and he should come and get it from the farm and that usually prompted an instant discount.

On the good side I changed to a system where I paid him an annual fee of £140 plus £35 per outing but that got rid of all trophy fees. If for any reason I didn't take many outings he discounted the annual fee in the next year.

This paid off for me as I shot two near bronze medal roe bucks in two outings which cost me nothing extra. I had booked a morning stalk near Winchester and wanted to go and recce the ground the previous evening. Roger said take the rifle in case you see something. I got a buck and phoned Roger to tell him and say there was not much point in going back there the next morning. He then directed me to another nearby estate where I got another good buck. Trophy fees - nil!

I have never paid a trophy fee to Roger and have had the opportunity to take a deer on the majority of my outings with him. I couldn't honestly say that, apart from Great Tew (and I know that there are deer in the area), I have ever been on any ground of Roger's that had few or no deer on it but maybe I've been lucky.

I do think that Roger would take you for a few quid if he could as it is difficult to make a good living out of stalking but it is a case of being aware of the issues and managing him and being clear about what is going to be charged ahead of going out and, unless things have changed recently, his ground is as good as anyone else's.

The best and most honest stalker that I have been with has sadly quit his business and taken a proper job. Meyrick Griffith-Jones had roe in Dorset, fallow and muntjac in Herts., and reds in Devon charged a modest outing fee, reasonable trophy fees and if you had a bad outing in terms of seeing no deer was likely to give you a free one to make up for it. He is also as nice a guy as you could wish to meet.

quote:

I can't quite plug into the thrill (if there is one) of stalking up to a flock of sheep to nail one.

(post edited)

Amir

Amir

You are going straight to Hell you know!

rgds Ian

quote:

(post edited)

Chicken....



FB