Hello Gents,
I finally did get my Merkel 141E Double in 8x57 IRS
But now the question arises on what loads to use. It's regulated for 196 grain Norma Alaska, but since the barrels are adjustable I'm going to try other loads as well.
The main purpose for this gun is driven game, which includes fallowdeers, boars, roe and moose where I normally hunt.

So I'm very interested in what your experiences are with 8x57 for this kind of game (or other game). What kind of bullets are you using?

There seems to be a renewed interest in 8mm here in Sweden, probably since the boars are getting more common. But there's also a lot of high quality guns for sale really cheap. And the fact that we are seeing some new bullets and even a new WSM in 8 mm is also helping in the renewed interest.
It used to be that 8x57 was regarded as an "old mans cartridge" here in Sweden. It has always had an exellent reputation on moose but the youngsters wanted something a bit "cooler".
I has just stuck me that my interest in 8x57 might be a sign that I' getting older as well But I have decided to just say that I'm getting wiser and more experienced

Regards,

Henrik

A good friend of mine whom I spend many days a-field shoos a Krieghoff double in 8x57JRS almost exclusively in monterías.

He has tried a few of the loads available commercially and has settled on the RGS 12,1g TIG load.

I have seen him take a number of wild boars and red deer as well and, man, it works!

montero

I meant 12,7 grams

sorry

montero

Great choice for driven game - perhaps only bettered by cartridges like 9.3x62 etc, but the 8x57IRS will surely get the job done at driven game ranges. One of the advantages of this cartridge, is that velocity is moderate, which not only cuts down on meat loss, but also makes it a lot easier on bullets. I would personally just stick to the Norma Alaskans, if that is what the gun happens to be regulated with. If you see they represent a problem on game, you can always switch. I doubt there will be a problem, though. The TIGs menetioned by Montero are old favourites in Central Europe (RWS country ). Very accurate, but tend to shed quite a bit of their jacket material in the form of secondary projectiles - which may be a good thing, depending on how you look at it.
- mike

Thanks for the input so far!
I will reload for the gun anyway so the Norma Alaska will only be used as a reference... The thought of using factoryloaded cartridges borders on the unthinkable for me

Nowadays Norma Alaska has more or less been replaced by Norma Oryx here in Sweden and I will try Oryx in the sweet little double, but I need more choices.
My previous experience with doubles is that as long as you uses the same bullet weight as the gun is regulated with you should be able to find a good load (most of the times). And since this gun has the posibility to adjust the barrels I'm not to concerned about changing the load. It will be an interesting experience for sure...

In addition to the driven hunts I do a lot of tracking for wounded animals here in Sweden. There's a lot of traffic incidents with deers, mooses and sometimes boars involved so the lab and I get a lot of tracking training. When it's time to finish these tracking job you don't always get the shooting angles that you want. In order to put a injured animal out of it misery you sometimes have to shoot from a "less then perfect" angle.

Today I use my 9.3x62 whe I'm tracking but I would like to use the nimble little double gun for this work. Only time will tell if I get the kind of penetration that's needed for a bad angled shoot on a moose.

Have any of you gentlemen any experience with the CDP line of ammunition? It strucks me as an option when penetration is needed??

Best Regards,
Henrik

Henrik,

Great cartridge and great platform, as a soon to be new owner of an even older mans cartridge, I know one thing for sure - I bet neither of our wives will be aware of the new addition I won't say more than that

I see from the picture that a 141 is a side by side. I like that.

I have a 8-57 at the smiths in a Brno 22f almost ready. I would be interesting what bullet you select. It seems that you will be using only factory loads?

I may use the Nosler 180 Ballistic Tip for whitetails and black bear at woods ranges.

First of all, whatever happens in my gunvault is strictly between myself and the lab! There will be no unnecessary information to my wife about things that she's not interested in.

Regarding the Merkel 141, it's based on a 28 cal action instead of the usual 20 cal action (which is called 140). This means that it's a light in small package which is perfectly suited to the smaller chamberings such as 8x57 IRS. I have tried he same gun in 9.3x74R and in that chambering the muzzlejump is a bit to much for a fast second shot. (I got a leaflet on the gun as a PDF document for anyone who's interested.)

I will not be using factory loads once I get a good hand load. I only use factory loads to establish a reference, sort of a baseline for pressure, speed and accuracy so that I know what to excpect from the gun.

Since a double gun isn't meant for longrange sniping there's no real advantage in bullets with high bc's. Right now the main candidates are Norma Oryx, Woodleigh, RWS TIG, Accubonds and maybe CDP. They are all available in weights between 196-200 grains.

There's an other option and that's the 180 grain bullets. But if I go down that path I need to ensure that I can get Ballistic Tips and Barnes TSX to group together.

Anyway I look at this I see that there's a lot of questions that I need to answer and that was why I got this gun in the first place, I NEEDED A NEW PROJECT!

Regards,
Henrik

That's such a beautiful rifle. Your lucky to have one like that.

I just noticed that yours is the rimmed version? I do have a 8-57 JR in a drilling and it shoots the 170 Hornady sized to .3185" right on at 100 yds. I have not fired enough 196 gr. factory loads to know if the pop up sight is regulated or not.



Above is another pic of a 141 from the net.

Henrik

I had a 8x57 and used 196gr Oryx at 2500 fps. I used it on driven red stag in Austria, and also on driven Warthog in South Africa. It was sweet to shoot, low recoil and hit like the Hammer of Thor. Great choice.

It also dropped Zebra at 200 metres with no need for a second shot.

Thank you for your input gents!

Being a Swede I will probably go with Norma oryx at least as a starting point. I have just got the gun back from my gunsmith (he mounted the scope), so tomorrow I'll try some 196 grains Oryx at the shooting range. There is a very special feeling in taking a new gun to the range for the first time so today I'll just enjoy the feeling

Regards,
Henrik

quote:

Originally posted by Henrik:
It used to be that 8x57 was regarded as an "old mans cartridge" here in Sweden.

So how do people feel about the 8x54 KJ ? (I have such a rifle) A great-grandfather's cartridge ?
:-D

Carcano

Norma Oryx is a good choice IMO. I use them for driven hunts with my BAR 300 WM with very good results. I believe that the flat point gives a superior knock-down power. Only tried on few boars, but with great reults and a resonable meat damage. - Lorenzo

Hello Gentlemen,
I have used my 8x57 JRS for a couple of weeks now. I decided to start with Norma oryx 196 grain bullets, loaded to 750 m/s.
So far I have used them on a roe and a moose and so far everything seems ok. Even though I might want more penetration for those "less then perfect angles" that you sometimes get when you are tracking injured game. But the new double is really SWEEET!!

As a sidenote I should probably add that togethet with my lab I do some tracking on game that has been hit by cars(or was poorly hit by other hunters). That's why I get to "hunt" them all year around.

Best regards,
Henrik