Hi guys,

I also posted this on the Shotgunning forum, but thought I'd put it here as it might be of interest to some that don't look aver there.

I was out playing with this gun on Saturday trying to shoot a few pigeons, but the pigeons didn't cooperate. We'll be trying again on Sunday.












Rgds,
FB

FB- How old is she?

And tell us how does she swing.

Lovely piece.

/Chris

Born in 1880. shoots like a 410

Sadly the gun looks like it has just sold so it will not be coming home with me...
Dig Kindly gave me first refusal but I can't compete with the American bid.

FB

sweet! It must be a little odd holding a gun thats four genrations older than you! i'd wonder who had owned it down the years...

Amir

Lovely looking piece - can't understand you playing with it and then letting it go!



A question on hammer gun usage - assume no safety and no half cock position.

Is it acceptable when walking up game, to have the hammers cocked and the gun broken? Then, upon kicking out a bird, close by raising the butt (barrels stay in a safe direction), before shouldering and shooting as with any other double?

Rgds

Ian

outstanding gun fb, im with ian here how could you let it go.
not that many of the 20g floating around these days, at what price did it go ?.
i have a thing for the old brits.
ian use pointers on the walk up, if not i use closed action and hammers down, it is amasing how fast you can thumb those hammers back.


best regards

peter

Ian,

It was very close, but I have decided to pass for a couple of reasons. I will be shooting it on Sunday though so I'm likely to kick myself!!

As for your question I would rather close the gun and cock the hammers as a flush was imminent, the same way you would push a safety off as you mount the gun. You can do it your way if you like, but bringing barrels up on a cocked gun means you will be browning someone or something as you close it and mount. also it is a trick maneuver when dealing with underlevers.

Personally I don't see why you would need that particular bit of kit and I would be more than happy to look after it for you long term!!

Rgds,
K

FB

As ever, your generosity astounds me. That you would go out of your way to allow me more space in my gun cabinet!

Having said that, there are a couple of points that would affect such a transfer.

A) It originated from Artemis's father - so she would be knocking on your door in the near future. Doubtless, bearing the very cleaver she had just employed to separate my dashing good looks from my torso! The fact that she has fallen in love with it, does not bode well for your chances.

B) It is only a Westley Richards - and I know how you like to maintain your standards. It is a 20 bore extractor and does not benefit from assisted opening. Accordingly, I wouldn't wish you to strain your mighty physique and surgeons hands!





Seriously, thanks for the thoughts on usage of a hammer gun. With no 'half cock' on the WR, the thought of fumbling a hammer under pressure is a concern. Noted the chances of barrels coming up in a dangerous manner - I always lift the toe of the stock to avoid this.

Rgds Ian

Is it acceptable when walking up game, to have the hammers cocked and the gun broken? Then, upon kicking out a bird, close by raising the butt (barrels stay in a safe direction), before shouldering and shooting as with any other double?

I think the question starts with a wrong assumption.

It is in fact, IMHO, dangerous when walking up game to walk with the a break barrel shot gun broken in the crook of the arm. There lies the risk of mud entering the muzzles.

It is also extremely bad manners towards one's host in front of others as it implies that the gun believes there is no need to carry his weapon ready at "high port" (or cocked) as the host has no game to shoot!

Correctly when walking up game the gun should be loaded and closed and at "high port" with the hammers cocked and the safety, if any applied.

For that is exactly how one should conduct oneself with a modern hammerless gun. The hammers there, although concealed in the action, being of course cocked.

To unload the hammers should be left cocked and the gun opened. The hammers can then be let down. Indeed if the hammers are let down whilst the gun is still closed with a hammer ejector the cartridges will be ejected when the gun is opened!

PeterDK

With the warning often given by a pointer, I can see that. What about on a driven shoot while waiting for a bird to appear - possibly anticipating a snap shot across a ride?

ES

Fair comments all.

I suppose that we have fallen into the habit of assuming that a shotgun is only 'safe' when the hammers are cocked and a safety applied.

My situation is that with NO safety on this particular gun I am trying to establish what would have been the protocol for usage - for both walked up and driven shooting.

From your comments it seems you would advocate cocked and ready - safety coming from only muzzle awareness. Whilst agreeing with you, I'm not sure if this is still acceptable when shooting in company.

Rgds Ian

ian

on a driven shoot, as soon as you are on your post and it is allowed(according to the day rules) you load and cock the hammers, as long as you dont stand around playing with the triggers it will serve you well without misshaps.
safety is good but dont wear a hard hat in the forest on the odd chance of a acorn falling.

best regards

peter

PeterDK,

I think the gun went for £5.5k in the end, although I still think it could have gone for more. The cheapest sold in the last 3 years was 6,800 + 20% buyers premium.

ES,

There is nothing dangerous about a gun broken in the crook of the arm. Muzzle awareness it the most imortant skill when handling any firearm, and so this should be no different. Unless I'm standing either on a drive or as a stationary gun on a walked up day I will almost always have my gun broken. I tend to close the gun as I can see my dog is about to flush something. This is the case if I am alone or otherwise, and I shoot a larger proportion of the game shot on our shoot than pretty much any of the others.

Walking with a closed gun is the most dangerous option while rough shoting as al it takes is a slip on the wet ground or a stumble and the gun can fall and go off. All the safety does is disengage the triggers. It really doesn't make the gun safe at all. Don't forget though that none of these old english hammer guns had safetey catches.

I do agree with you on how to break the gun by letting the hammers dwn after it is broken.

As for the manners, I have found that most people question my method purely because they think it is a slow option. Once we have had a couple of flushes and I've killed birds they tent to like the peace of mind it gives them walking in the line.

Ian,

something to be aware of is whether or not you have rebounding locks on the gun. If not then you will need to cock the hammers prior to closing the gun. That will stop the barrels closing on the fireing pins and damaging them. You will also need to cock the hammers prior to opening the gun after firing to avoid the same damage. You can tll by looking at the Hammers in the fired position and if the face of the hammer does not touch the back odf the firing pin, and you can pust the firing pin back through its hole in the breech face, then it is a rebounding lock

rgds,
FB