I am think of having one of my douglas-barreled 8x57s pushed out to 8x60S. Not too common on in the states (I think I'd have the third one over here). Tell what you know about it, and your impressions. TIA.

9.3x62

I have tired a friends rifle, the impression is a "slightly" soaped up 8X57IS and not really worth the extra trouble with brass etc.

If you want a bit more performance look at the 8X64S. One of the hotest 8mm is the 8X68S.

Cheers
/JOHAN

I am also interested in any experiences. a few months ago I bought a sporterized VZ24 in this caliber. I haven't got around to ordering dies and brass yet but will shortly.
Jason

Here is a source for RWS brass stateside:

http://www.huntingtons.com/CasesRWS.html

Pricey, but it is good stuff (at least in the other calibers I've used it in), so a few will last quiet a while.

Yes, I have been considering teh 8x64 as well, trouble is the barrel I would rechamber is only 21", so I think the extra power may not be realized, hence the 8x60S thought...

9.3,
Yeah I saw that Huntingtons had the brass. Is RWS brass as good as they claim it is? I will probably go with CH-4D dies as I need a set of 557-450 and 310 Cadet as well. We bought dies from them in .357-44 B&D, 470 Capstick, and 440 Corbon not too long ago. The B&D dies worked well, the Capsticks are waiting for the rifle to be built and I'll have to see if Jerry has used the 440s. Do you think the Nosler 200gr Partition would be a good all around bullet for 8X60S?
Jason

I've had good luck with it in 6.5x57, 8x57, and 9.3x62 though the rims can be a bit thick sometimes. I don't use it anymore in these rounds just because it is expensive and other good brass is easily made or bought for less. Though for the 8x60S I'd go with RWS - I prefer to have a headstamp if possible.

As for dies, this may sound cheap, but I am going to use 8x57 dies, and just neck size. The seater die will do the job, though crimping may be a problem (though not for me as I don't crimp very often). I've been doing these die swapping tricks for quite some time, and they work our very well. I currently load all my 6.5x57 ammo with a set of Lee 6.5x55 RGB dies. My 6mm-3000 I load with a 6mm BR die (I have a universal decapping die), and so on...

I am thinking the 180 Nosler BT for whitetails and black bears, and the 200 Nosler for elk.

Good luck with your project...

Thanks, if I could figure out how to post decent size pics (mine always come out huge) I would post photos of the rifle here. I am really happy with it for $400, spoon bolt, double triggers, ect. The only negative is the previous owner had it set up with see through rings (I think they are mandatory here in NC ) and I think a bushnell scope, the rings may hve been to get around the original wing safety, which I prefer anyhow.
Jason

I don't know how much extra velocity you would get from the conversion, I believe the cartridge was created to use guns chambered for the banned 8x57 military caliber...I think that Fin Agaard(sp?) used it extensively in Kenya, my uncle has used a Parker-Hale 8x60 with great success in Ethiopia on leopards etc. Sounds like a fairly useful piece!

John Dawkins the Australian ivory hunter also used a bolt action in 8x60mmS for plains game as well as a bevy of doubles.

Well,
I got a 8x60S Brno 21 cheap some years ago, loaded up 200 grs old Sako Hammerheads to 2670 fps with Vihtavuori N140 53 grs, and Woodleigh 250 grs to 2390 fps with Vihtavuori N 150 49 grs - a bullet with very pleasing sectional density. The second load is point of aim with open sights at 75 m and the first 10 cm over. I am very satisfied with the round and the handy Brno.

The first game I got with it was a big (scand moose) bull with short but thick 9 point antlers.
Almost everything went wrong, save the first shot.

I had figured out a perfect place to find the game, a field not used for many years, overgrown with birch, called "the black chamber" for a reason not yet disclosed to myself. I didn�t use the old road there because of the wind, and had to go through a very dense piece of young forrest. My friend told me as I started " you will not find the place, stupid, you�ll get lost". "Me? Never." After a short I was - lost. I worked my way through the thicket trying to be as quiet as possible, with little success, and finally came to a ditch - instantly I saw the moose between birchtrunks maybe 75 m off, three, four animals and the only one I could make out was a cow. I froze, the cow had of course heard my not very silent approach, but she could not make me out. After a while, standing still, I realized that I had actually found my place of destination. Me and the cow watched each other for some time. Then my hunting buddies made some commotion further away, the moose moved some, and I saw the bull, big and black. All right, I thought," I am the man". The cautious cow and her calves took off in the opposite direction from myself, and my hopes fell for a second, when suddenly the bull slowly made his escape towards me and the ditch. He came slowly, head low, and was certain to stop before jumping the ditch. Up came the Brno and the Sako 200 grs hammered into his neck 30 m off when he stopped for a sec and he fell just on the edge of the ditch. Oh yes, I am the man, I thought, when the bull started to twitch - I ran over and decided that it would be a good thing to give him one behind the ear before he slides down into the ditch. So I did. As an immediate result the bull kicked with the hind legs � and got good support from a birch close by, turned over, down the ditch, antlers down deep into the bottom mud, belly and legs up like a dog that wants to be scratched. I tell you, it was like a cartoon; the muddy water almost covered his belly; you could only see belly and legs. This isn�t happening, I thought.
Minutes later someone else shot another moose somwhere, and I could�nt get any help for hours.

With ropes we finally got the carcass just up on the edge of the ditch, and I stood belly deep in the mud gutting it. Got a splitting headache. It started raining.

The tractor finally came along and got stuck on the old field. The back wheels suddenly went smack down into the soil.

"Don`t you know why it�s called the black chamber?" an old hunting buddy asked when we walked behind the finally salvaged tractor going home. "Horses sink, combines, you name it; nothing ever goes right there. That�s why it�s called the Black Chamber. You�ll remember it, I think" .

Underground springs.

But the 8x60S worked great.

Boha

I'd go with the 8x64 or 8mm-06.

9,3x62,

I have got a Mannlicher-Sch�nauer 1950 in 8x60S, and have had a Sako M98 in the obsolete 8x60 (.318").

It is a nice cartridge, but I can�t see any real advantages in comparision to the common 8mm Mauser or a .30-06 with a 200 or 220 grs bullet. Cases are harder to get, and there are few reloading data available. My reason for choosing this cartridge has been the rifles, not the cartridge as such. (In fact I do not care much about cartridges per se - but I expect them to deliver a bullet with enough mass, enough velocity and enough accuracy to the target. The rest of the cartridge stuff is just superstition.)

Reloading the cartridge is simple. You can use data for the 8 mm Mauser (8x57IS) and perhaps put some grains more in the case. In my experience 52 grs Norma 203-B with a 200 grains bullet has been fine, but any 4350 powder will be quite appropriate.

By some reason the German called the 8x60 a Magnum. In the thirties there was a german load called the "Magnum-Bombe" with a 180 grains H-jacket bullet at 2850 fps. They used to compare it with the .300 H&H... In fact my own Mannlicher is stamped "8x60S Magnum". But "Magnum" in german vocabulary in those days was just a cartridge with a strong case and a harder load - as "P+" today.

If you like to get a cartridge, which nobody else has got, the 8x60s is a good choice. In fact you get a .30-06 with your own dimesions, but the same prestanda with proper choice of bullet. That�s not bad at all.

Best regards,

Fritz

P.S. I have some e-mails from friends regarding this cartridge. If I still have them, I�ll send them to you.

An exellent story boha !!

Agreed - great story. I have stopped hunting near tarpits myself...

.

Perhaps the story of the 8x60 cartridge is worth telling briefly. After the W.W.I, the Peace of Versailles forbid the Germans the use of military weapons and cartridges. As there was a lot of sporting guns and military rifles in the German army calibre 8x57, german gunsmiths simply made the chamber 3 mm longer to make these guns legal.

Thus the 8x60 is not created out of some ballistic demands, but only to make these guns legal. The 50-100 fps gained were just a plus point beside the main issue.

Fritz

.

It was my understanding that the 8x57 was banned after WWI (and perhaps after WWII as well), which is why the 8x60 sprung up in 1919-1920.



On another note, what is the difference between the 8x60 and 8x60S and 8x60 magnum. I gather the last pair are the same modulo some pressure, but I guess I haven't heard the story behind the 8x60 versus the 8x60S, where the S stands for "short", no?



Also, where did you get that 8x60S ammo?



Thanks.

The 8x60 refers to rifles that have the older .318" bore. The 8x60S refers to the current .323" bore. The magnum logo simply refers to hot loads that approach .300 H&H ballistics.



I have always been led to believe that the 8x60S was a Mauser creation to allow them to commercially sell 8mm rifles in Germany after the post WWI treaty. They obviously had a large stockpile of .323" barrels.



Gunsmiths quickly caught on and began rechambering privately owned rifles, to avoid the scrap heap. This included a lot of older .318" rifles.



Over the years, shooters and hunters realized the benefits of the 8x60S, and other companies such as Mannlicher, Brno and Sako made commercial rifles in this chambering thru the 1950's, when the magnum fad started.

Here are 250 gr. Woodlieghs being loaded into a 1938 Brno model A in 8x60S.

This a 1954 Brno 21H in 8x60S.

.

The 8x60s also has the advantage of being able to be used in France.