The 260Rem is finally operational. Almost a year in the making – most of that down to firearms licensing here in NI, and at least two years in the “thinking”.

I had been contemplating the “ultimate" UK and Ireland deer rifle for lowland hunting where the ranges rarely exceed 200m. Most of my stalking is Sika and Fallow, we don’t have Roe, so to be Sika capable in my opinion rules out the 243win. However, I wanted near 243 levels of noise and recoil, with near 270 killing power, the 260 Rem seemed on paper to fit the bill. I also wanted all this in a short, handy, moderated and weatherproof package – have you seen where Sika hang out in Ireland?

I was influenced a lot over the past two or three years by various internet forums, particularly the style of rifles favoured by some of the guys on 24hourcampfire, and the rifles used by “1894” on AR. To cut a lot of pondering short I came up with a McMillan marbled stock, a Sako 75 action with Sako trigger and bottom metal and a Lothar Walther barrel as the components.

After some telephone conversations, Chris Blackburn at UKgunworks was chosen to build the rifle. There were many phonecalls about barrel length – 22”, it can always be shortened in the future, chamber dimensions – saami minimum spec, and trigger pulls.

The rifle turned up last week, and load development commenced on my “home range”:



I want to shoot a bullet which will come close to the killing power of the classic 130gr in the 270, with similar SD and BC numbers. So, I initially played with H4831 and 120gr Sierra Prohunter’s and 129gr SST’s – this round does not need premium bullets for deer. Velocity was good but I could not get these load combo’s to group consistently. The only other suitable powder I had was Benchmark, a much faster powder. So I switched to that. The rifle immediately started to group at the 0.5” mark. I am pleasantly surprised by the velocity I am achieving. Hodgdon’s suggest 2950fps for a 120gr bullet with 40grs of Benchmark and a 24” test barrel, and we all know “book” velocities are optimistic. This rifle with a 22” barrel is clocking 2940 fps with 39grs and no pressure signs. I also noticed a lower level of report through the ASE Jet-Z with the lighter charge of faster powder.

The new rifle looks and handles great. I don’t know if I will ever love a synthetic and stainless rifle compared to walnut and blue steel, but it should resist our climate much more successfully than my Sauer.





I knocked up 20 rounds to this recipe to hunt with next weekend, but I know it will do better once I start tweaking OAL:

Lovely rifle Brian but have they not put the bolt handle on the wrong side? :-)

Seriously though congrats on the new arrival and I hope you will get to put it into action at the weekend. Hopefully you will be posting a hunting report on Monday with info about the terminal performance on sika.

Mervyn Young turned up some heads for me at the end of last week so I now have both powder and bullets.

quote:

Lovely rifle Brian but have they not put the bolt handle on the wrong side?

the bench appears lop-sided also. I think he's got the negative reversed?



Nice looking Boomer, Brian.....those photos really taken in Ireland? I've only ever been to Ireland when it's drizzling and grey, never seen the sunshine so you've apparently wasted all the $$$ on the weather-proofing.....global warming and all that, you know.

Good Luck with your load work-up, I hope to see it personally in February.

Very nice mate, we shall have to see you sooner rather than later now!

Looks a great package. I too have moved to the ASE compact - so good! I would have thought H4831 a tiny bit too slow for that bullet weight, perhaps H4350 or RL19? Sounds like you have a great load with Benchmark however.

Photos can be deceiving - I am assuming the range set up is safer than it first appears with the back stop more substantial than a hedge onto dropping away fields and that the firing point allows line of sight considerably above the fence? Sorry to be a bore but at first sight it looks a little concerning...

You cack handed boys are hiliarious...

Adam, the photo may be deceiving, but there is a 4 foot high earth bank behind the target, the hedge is growing on top of the ditch. The firing point is about 25 feet higher than the target. The field behind the target drops slightly then rises again, effectively I am shooting into the floor of a shallow valley.

I know I should get better results with a powder in the RL19 - 4350 range, just have not laid hands on any. I just wanted to get the beast functional over the weekend. The benchmark is noticeably quieter than the 4831 through the can.

This rifle is not yet the finished article I may get it bead or vapour blasted and swap the can for a T12 Scout. I will live with it as it is for this season and revise as I think necessary in the spring.

Brian

Wait till you get your hands on Reloader 17x

I loaded some for 308 and boy oh boy 200 fps appears from nowhere.

Please don't ask where I got it from.

260 uses the same mother casing so I hope you will see the same gain.

That will bring your new rig over the magically 3000 mark without upping the presure.

A WIN WIN situation.

On paper you new rig will surpass a .270

Time to ponder if you really need both

As a result I have since ordered quite a few tubs from AFTAB.

BTW

Lovely looking rifle

I thought as much.

Your ASE is about half the noise of a T12 scout. Truly nothing else as quiet on the market.

Very nice Brian looks like it was worth waiting for!
I'm running my 6.5 on 120gr Nosler Ballistic tips and VIT n160 and am very happy with them. it also goes well with 120gr Serria pro hunters and 140gr game kings. I have some hornaday 129gr SST and soft points and VIT N540 I'm not using if they are any use to you? what scope did you go for in the end?

Aaron, where are you getting the BT's? I have tried the usual suspects, they seem to have everything accept BT's.

I should be happy using Benchmark, but it only fills the case about 60-70% and I am not comfortable with that.

The scope is a swaro 8x50 that I have had for a while, I was on my 222rem for most of it's life.

I wouldn't mind trying a few 129 interlocks and 120 BT's if you have any.

Nice looking rig
Will it be available at the AR stalking in February to drool over

Congrats Brian.
Always nice to have a new toy

Brian, I bought the Nosler In was in Canada.
Mervyn had a few boxes the last time I was there, give me a shout some time if want the interlocks.

Hey Brian,

Looks like she's a shooter mate.

now all you need to do is scratch it so the evil eye doesn't take and all will be well.

I supppose we're due some stalking time soon?

FB

ya man, it's not really yours till you put a few dings on it

Good stuff Brian, R17 should do some interesting things for sure?

Chris also built my 6mmbr a good smith and a good bloke to pass the time of day with as well!

Regards NW

Just heard today there is a shipment of 17x landing in the UK at the end of this month.

CD,
you should be looking at 140gn Lapua Scenar's.
Deadly accurate and devastating on deer!
Fantstic BC and SD, and dirt cheap as opposed to NBT'S..

regards
griff

I thought Scenars are FMJ??

Griff, I had been thinking of trying 123gr Scenar's, but I was concerned about how they might perform on deer. They are about £30/100 here.

I know they are hollow point, will they open up reliably?

quote:

and dirt cheap as opposed to NBT'S..

Hey Griff.....

All the Scandinavia components are pretty spendy here The Fatherland but sounds like a good deal to me; especially since the Scenar bullets (Lapua in general) have a reputation as a very accurate bullet.

As an aside; at least here in Germany, it appears in the local marketplace that the orders the European/German Distributors made prior to the component crunch in the States coupled with the Dollar/Euro exchange rate have resulted in bullet prices that (although higher than North American previous sourcing) in the past have remained quite reasonable. At least for Nosler, Hornady, Sierra & Remchester (except for Barnes). The Norma, Lapua, VV & RWS and vast majority of the European sourced componets remain expensive IMO.

quote:

Originally posted by Claret_Dabbler:
Griff, I had been thinking of trying 123gr Scenar's, but I was concerned about how they might perform on deer. They are about £30/100 here.

I know they are hollow point, will they open up reliably?

Brian Scenars are slightly unpredictable in there expansion, or rather according to the accounts that I have heard it´s linear to the amount of resistance met,

ie shoulder shot, the nearly blow up, rib shot, the might pencil through.

Still the US based crowd at a different fora has posted some great reports with scenar on game so in my mind it boils down to how much meat damage one can accept.

Best regards Chris

Just an input as I shoot 6,5x55. The Sierras both 140grains game kings and 120 grains pro hunters are very accurate in my riffle propellet by N-560 and N-160. Now I have loaded 130grains nosler accubonds, and 100grains lapua scenar but I have not shot them yet. To busy shooting goose.

Brian,
Never had a problem with Scenar's.! They are devastatingly accurate and have killed every deer I have shot with them.
Never recovered a bullet, damage was acceptable and certainly no more or less than the run of the mill favourites.
Quite ironic really that there were those that chose to decry the use of these match grade bullets, and now we find that the top manufacturers actually listing them for game..

I do remember the the most contentious issue ever discussed on AR "sierra matchkings", there were those that refused to accept what was being said,I was one of them.
Until that is, I tried them for myself.



regards
griff

I thought the wording for the bullets we use was something like (Bullets designed to expand on impact) its not a problem for me as i have a healthy supply of BT`s.

"designed to expand in a predictable manner"

griff
Ive just looked at my FAC and it says "Expanding ammunition".Are match bullets "expanding"? I thought (probably wrong) that they were FMJ but alot tighter tolerances?

I think we are mixing up English and Scottish rules.

N Ireland rules are based largely on the Scottish version, we have the 100gr minimum bullet weight and exactly as Griff states "bullet designed to expand in a predictable manner".

English rules may be slightly different.

Most match bullets are hollow point - Scenars, Bergers, Matchkings etc. The A-max is a nylon tip.

Anyway how predictable is bullet expansion??

quote:

Anyway how predictable is bullet expansion

More predictable with "hunting bullets".
The only reason I`m questioning this is something simular happened years ago when i did my DSC1.When we got to the range 1 of the blokes pulls out his 6ppc with HUGGGGGE scope on it,turns out its his bench rest rig but he also uses it from a seat,he says that he loads 95gNBT`s with it,when somebody else points out that it doesnt make minimum requirements (lb`s)it all kicks off!to cut a long and noisy story short, he ends up using my rifle as the instructors wouldnt allow him to use his.(he also said that he used some match bullet as well and they went POTTY). They also nearly chucked him of the course!.Turns out the rifle shot into .3 with my handloads (happy days).

No flames but makes food for thought

Now Griff you know i love my matchkings - just a bit more than A-maxs'

Griff shot his from a 264win mag so they were going some.

Berger now list their VLDs as hunting and enough have used them that they seem dependable.

Matchkings might be popular but I know of one person who used the 107? 6.5 from a 6.5x57R and had it pencil through a roe to the extent it had to be finished when finally caught up with.

Hornady list the A max as suitable for medium game.

Does the BC outway the potential for terminal inconsistancy. Not for me it doesn't.

Adam, you are no doubt correct, there is no need for the BC characterists of VLD type bullets for the average hobby stalker like me.

For a man of Griff's talents/needs, things are different I am sure.

I did not indend this to be a debate on "match bullets for deer", I think this has been done to death already.

Brian

Have you used it on anything yet?

could somebody get a link so i can look at the match bullet for hunting debate please

If Berger are marketing the VLD as a hunting bullet then I`m sold.

1894 is correct I was shooting Lapua Scenar's out of my 264 winnie, although capable of 3100fps + I loaded to 2800fps, I don't know if a 6.5x55 is capable of those figures, if not then I would have reservations in using them.

Berger bullets link:
http://www.bergerbullets.com/P...nting%20Bullets.html

regards
griff

Hi guys

I was using the first batch of Bergers given to me by Reloading Solutions last year in Baldock. If you guys were there remember I made that long shot just at the boundary of the field ?

6.5 x 55 140 VLD with 43.5 grain of H4350 I was getting 2600 fps or thereabout.

However acccuracy is amazing and I would say the external ballsitics was so different than A MAX. I would condidently say I had an extra 100 yards gain using bergers. However terminal performance is definitely different from Ballistic trip or A max. It just fragments into very small pieces.

I chickened out when I went to SCotland and changed over to Amax but will use Berger anything south of the border to buy the distance.

Look VERY carefully at the promotional video on Berger site. They are actually all spine shots !

quote:

Originally posted by griff:
1894 is correct I was shooting Lapua Scenar's out of my 264 winnie, although capable of 3100fps + I loaded to 2800fps, I don't know if a 6.5x55 is capable of those figures, if not then I would have reservations in using them.
griff

Griff,
I would imagine the cases will last nearly for ever loading them like that!!

I'm getting 2800 fps average velocity out of my .260 Rem with 123 grn Lapua Scenars and as you say the accuracy is spot on...

With regards the legality of using Scenars on deer, I suspect it will take a court case and several appeals to get a definative ruling as the Law is pretty badly worded.

And the other point is that if they are deer legal, gunshops ect shouldn't be selling them through the normal post without seeing your FAC first...Whole thing is a minefield due to the stupidity of the law makers in this country..

Regards,

Peter