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Hello all European gun owners and hunters! I have a question. Im wondering how gun ownership in Europe compares to what we have here in the U.S. Im not planning a trip or anything im just curious. I hear of bans and confiscations and just wonder what countries stand where. I thank our founding fathers for our 2nd ammendment as well as the NRA and other orgs and conservative politicians that has protected us from gun grabbers here. My thanks for any answers! | ||
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Sweetooth. I guess it's natural to look to the other side of the fence and wonder how the grass tastes. Here in the UK, we are not allowed handguns with an overall length less than 24" - so, just long barrel handarms for target use .. held on certificate (FAC). Unlimited shotguns subject to a certificate that is a 'must issue' unless you are found to have an unsuitable character/history. Generally, 'I want' means you can get a certificate and start collecting and shooting. Rifles are limited to bolt action only over .22 - semi allowed in that calibre...but NOT in .17! Go figure! Rifles are issued on certificate and 'good reason' for each has to be accepted by the local police authority. All serial numbers are registered, ammunition is subject to agreed amounts based on need and also requires entry on your certificate. Edited: We are also encouraged to use moderators (silencers) on rifles - these are included on your FAC. That's pretty much the ownership situation in a nutshell - BUT we do have some attractions over here that go some way to compensating for the restrictions! Believe it or not - although a very intensively farmed and settled little island - we have a rapidly increasing deer population and low hunter numbers. Six species of deer, with differing seasons, mean year around shooting is available. No tags or limits - as well as the ability to sell the carcasses to commercial dealers, means that many shooters take the sort of deer numbers in a year that other folks manage in a lifetime. So, some good - some bad. Depends whether your priority is collecting firearms - or actually using them for hunting!  Keep well. Rgds Ian Just taking my rifle for a walk!........ | |||
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here in norway we have to apply to the police for every gun. so you have to think before you buy a rifle, if you have a .30-06 for moosehunting, you probably wont get a .300 win mag for hunting purposes. this is why im buying myself a Sauer 202 in june, since its much easier to buy a new barrel than a new rifle | |||
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Here in denmark one too must apply for every huntingrifle...no limitation in how many one must own(like sweden) 50 BMG is the "vogue" for the moment  DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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I posted this about the situation in Switzerland a few years back. It is by and large still correct. (Yet) another version of the Federal Firearms Law will be put into effect in a short while. Fortunately, there were not too many restrictions added. Private sales must now be advertized in a way that make the seller trackable. Military arms can still be kept at home - an issue which has otherwise been the thin end of the wedge for the do-gooders.
********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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Mike, I wish you all the best, the rest of Europe who is suffering from an increasingly almighty do-gooder-state needs you as a beacon of liberty. In this regard, is it true that in Switzerland one cannot use correctional collars for dog training? | |||
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HI you can have a short barrel handgun as a humane killer in the UK. | |||
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Perfectly legal to own a handgun in certain areas in the UK.... Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they are not out to get you.... | |||
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Laws in here are pretty much the same as in nordic countries, i believe. We have to apply to police for every gun, though once you have passed your test and have the permit, it is really easy and there are few limitations. I can't remember everything exactly but i believe you can own up to 8 guns without the need for a special "safe-room". What you cannot own are firearms that look like other objects (a rifle disguised as an umbrella for an example), weapons that can be fired dismantled, and chamberings of "special highly powerful military" cartridges. Plus under the current law you cannot lend your gun to anyone exept in firing ranges, even under your own supervision. A new gun law due to take effect in a year or so will make these things easier. | |||
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Here in Iceland, handguns are not allowed except for competions. First you get a licence for .22 rimfire and shootgun (there is a course and a test), then after 2 years you can get centerfire riffle up to 8mm and semi auto shootgun. If you want a bigger caliber you need to get a special permision from the police. I think you can own as many guns as you want. You also have to register barrels like on Sauer 202. If you have 3 guns or more you have to have a gunsafe. Sauer and Zeiss, perfect match. Sherpi | |||
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Thanks for all the responses so far. Boy, all I can say is I truly feel sorry for yall. I really cant fathom these things being the case where I live. I can own as many guns as I want including pistols and 50 cals. I can go in a gun shop here in TN by a pistol and walk out the same hour with it provided I pass a background check. And if I have a carry permit (we have a SHALL issue law here) I can carry my pistol in the OPEN in public like the old west if I want Tho I would rather carry concealed. I have several guns and the components for thousands of rounds of ammo and the law doesnt have to know anything about it, which is the way it should be. We can own fully auto guns and silencers in TN with the proper paperwork and approval of local police. This is the only thing I would have to consult the local police over as far as I know.I hope these UN gun banners never get a foothold here and try to destroy our 2nd ammendment. God help us if Hillary gets elected with liberal Dems in charge of congress as well. And even with his short comings God bless Bush for my part, he would get my vote again given the same choice. He's one of the best friends we as gun owners could have in office. The anti's have been suffering much defeat over here lately thank God and the big one that will unfold here next is the repeal of the D.C. gun ban which was ruled unconstitutional recently. The second ammendment DOES give the INDIVIDUAL the right to have guns after all. Maybe Fred Thompson will run and win, that would be excelent! Good luck to you all. | |||
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I agree, your system is so easy and quick from sportsman/hunter point of view. But i feel much safer knowing that all gun owners have to pass a test and get a medical certificate proving they are sane. I wouldn't want to insult anyone, but not all people are responsible enough to own, carry and use guns. That said, the last thing i want is to hijack the thread with a long and boring political discussion. | |||
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Here in Finland we can own pretty much any guns, you just need to have a good reason for every spesific gun to convince the official handing out the permits. Silencers don't need any license and .50 BMG is quite OK if you have a positive-minded official in charge of your licence area. As in Estonia, guns that look like umbrella or pen etc. are prohibited. But every gun must be applied a permit for, except if you are a licenced gun collector, which makes things a lot easier and makes full-auto guns available too, if they are included in your collector's plan. All in all, I think our system is quite OK. I've had all the guns that I've ever applied for and everything has worked smoothly. No inquisition mentality, just filling up a form and that's pretty much it. Only minor hassle occurred when I was buying a gun from Germany and the officials wanted me to buy one needless extra document for importing the gun, but as I cleared it out to them that it wasn't necessary, they gave it up. That was most probably just a uncommon procedure for them also, so they didn't know what paperwork was needed after all. The biggest difference to USA is probably the idea of the "owning a gun" concept. Here we don't see guns as tools for protecting ourselves or our family, but more as tools for hunting and sport shooting. In fact, only "guns" that are possible to have for self-protecting purposes are pepper- and OC-sprays. Of course when you have weapons for hunting or any other purpose, they serve for self-protection too, but that is not a valid reason for buying them and also rarely in anyones mind either. That said, we have likely the largest number of guns per capita in the whole Europe, so I don't know how things regarding public safety were if we didn't have those guns around. BTW. The most common tool of homicide here is knife. About 140 people are killed violently in Finland every year and I think around 20 of them with firearms. Large part of these with illegal guns. | |||
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In TN we do have to pass a background check for firearms, but we dont have to tell big brother about it or ask for permission. Also to get a hunting licence we have to pass a hunter edjucation program. To me thats really optimum requirements. | |||
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sweetooth: In TN we do have to pass a background check for firearms, but we dont have to tell big brother about it or ask for permission.[QUOTE] Well if that's the way you want to put it  But if your background check doesn't prove to be what the "big brother" wants it to be, I think you won't get the gun, am I correct? So it is the same " big brother" who controls your gun ownership as in everywhere else, isn't it? Don't get me wrong, I don't want to be a smart ass or anything. It is just that I don't see where the big difference between Tennessee's control system and our control system is, because there is control in both places. In my wiew the biggest difference is that in our system the mentally disturbed can't get their hands on guns as easily - which I really don't regard such a bad thing after all. To put it another way: you have to pass an exam to become a hunter (says big brother), you have to pass an exam to have a drivers' licence (says big brother), you have to have a background check made (Tennessee)/fill an application for gun permit (Finland) and qualify to buy a gun (says big brother), so where is the huge difference? This all said in constructive manner, I'm not saying that your system is wrong/inferior or anything. | |||
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Congratulations, you live not only in a very beautifull but civilized country, as well. 140 violent deaths for a whole nation is really something. I think in cities like Sao Paulo the rate is like 4000 a year... N. American cities I really do not know. I lived in the US and really appreciated the liberal gun laws. I even had a CCW license, just for fun. OTOH, here in Germany I have all the long and handguns I want plus all the reloading supplies and ammo I need. Even semi-auto military rifles or MP5s can be purchased now. At the same time, our crime rate is very low, my children can go downtown to the mall without the risk of being mugged or shot. Like always, both worlds I guess have pro's and con's, unfortunately our nation is not very similar to Finnland or Switzerland, either, so I guess the system we currently have is not too inconvenient. My cars are registered and known to the state, too, after all... | |||
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Well thank you DUK, that must be the first time I've had credit as a Finn for being a member of a very civilized nation  Mostly we're known as heavy drinkers etc., which might often be the case too...I had a second look at the statistics and it turns out that lethal violence in Finland 2002-2005 looked like this: 86 % being committed by family members, relatives, friends and other people known to the victim. 39 % were committed by knife 16 % by firearms, of those - 65 % of handguns were illegal, 55 % of other firearms were illegal 15 % were committed without any weapon, by beating or kicking 82 % of killers and 82 % of victims were drunk 71 % of homicides were committed in private properties, 29 % in public places. 67 % of male victims and killers were considered suffering from alcohol or drug abuse. The average number of homicides per year in Finland 2000-2005 was unfortunately a bit higher than I remembered, it was about 160/year. That means about 3,1/100 000 people, which -surprisingly- is actually higher than in Germany, where this number is about 1/100 000 according to my source (Government Statistics). There are only around 5 000 000 people living in here, you know. But it is still quite safe here compared with Brasil, which had about 20 000 people killed last year, if I remember correct. | |||
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JTH, In Italy as well we commonly believe that Scandinavians (and Swiss) are very civilized, serious and polite people, who highly respect laws and where crime is almost nil. | |||
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Well thank you Wildboar. You always learn something new I got interested in the statistics and it turned out that the number of homicides is somewhat going downhill here. The average 2002-2005 was close to 160, but 2005 the number was 114 and 2006 it was 113. Regarding the public safety issues, the thing that most often rises in the public discussion as a worrying feature isn't guns, but alcohol and it's consumption in public. Actually our biggest threat as hunters and shooters in this country isn't the anti-gun movement, but the closing down of shooting ranges and bureaucracy concerning their maintenance. 1/5 of our population lives in and around Helsinki, the capital and in a couple of years you'll have to drive close to 100 km from there to go shooting with a rifle or a shotgun. Noise and pollution regulations are purposely used as an excuse for closing down shooting ranges all over. The real reasons are often connected with communal construction business or something alike. These things are in much better care for example in Norway and Germany. | |||
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Hey sweettooth,,I dont cooperate with the govt. in any way if I can help it.I buy guns from individuals,,I may have to pay a little more or drive a bit,,but no backround checks.I you dont ask,,they CANT say no.My local shop makes much more off my little item buys anyway,,,so he doesn't mind me by-passing him on gun purchses,,,he even gives me a heads up on avail. guns from private sales  PROST!!!!!!!!a good horse,a churchill sized Maduro,a true rifle,and 50 year old brandy.................. | |||
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Hey JTH. I know your not being smart and I hope you didnt take me that way either. I surely didnt mean what I posted in any smart way what so ever. Your laws dont sound too bad, there are much worse in Europe. We actually posted at almost the same time last night and I didnt even see your post before I posted mine  I wasnt directing that at any specific person so no hard feelings brother.Hey Big. I have a few guns obtained through trade with friends and at gun shows with no checks as well. Is there a such thing as gun shows in Europe guys? Can you trade among yourselves without the gov being involved? | |||
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No offence taken Yes, we have gunshows and here in Finland the procedure is the same, whether you buy from a shop or a private person.How is the situation with shooting ranges in Tennessee, by the way? I wrote previously that the bureaucracy and intentionally strict environmental standards make it hard to keep them operating in here, and that is actually much more bigger nuisance than gun laws at the moment. On the other hand, you can shoot on your own land pretty much without any restrictions, if you're not causing immediate danger to anyone. But if you're having a shooting range next to a motorway and an airport, it's the noise of gunshots that is regarded so disturbing that the range needs to be closed  Of course this is often connected with getting the shooting range land into some financially more valuable use, but the result is poor for shooters in many places. | |||
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I do not see a contradicton here, I dare say there's rather a correlation...
I am very sure these statements apply to a similar degree in most places. If people decide that they want to kill each other, you just can't keep them from doing it, much less in an emotionally excited state. If there's no gun at hand, they grab the kitchen knife or a hammer. What we all should probably put more emphasis into is to teach our children not to play with drugs and to learn to drink responsively. Honestly, I wonder why we still allow public advertisements for alcohol, especially for hard liquor. | |||
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i hate my country`s gun law i doesnt get more dangerous if i buy more guns, since i just can fire one at a time one day i`ll settle down on a ranch in texas, drive a pick-up as big as house, and have 2784 guns | |||
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I have not ever had a problem getting permits to bring my guns into any Europion country that I have hunted in. It has always only been a matter of jumping through a couple of hoops that in most cases was taken care of for me in advance and the permits were waiting at the customs office at the airport. In England the permit had to be mailed ahead but still no problem once I had the permit it was smooth sailing even when the airline lost my double rifle. Now that I said all that I do love the freedom we have here in Alaska. We have no laws outside of the federal law's we can carry CCW without a permit and the state will give us a CCW permit even though we don't need them so that we can carry in other states and bypass the nics check. DRSS NRA life AK Master Guide 124 | |||
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Steffen-9.3 I think in Texas they call 2784 guns a good start You'll need a big trailor for that truck to put your gun safe on but it isn't required there to have one like it is in your country. DRSS NRA life AK Master Guide 124 | |||
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Don´t cry, European gun owners. In the next years, we get a European gun law, made by specialists. Then it will be better.  At the moment, there´re four classifications for guns. In the future only two, legal guns, and the illegal guns. Then all the weapons your can buy now without a permit, like soft air, air rifles or bow´s you need in the future a permit. Ammunition must have a mark for indentivication ( Who made the round, who bought it).  There´re many, many other new ideas for regulation. Above all this, is the statement: "No weapons in hands of citizens!" The EU has found the "Weapons of Mass Destruction", the handguns and rifles of the marksmen and hunters. We have a small gunstore. And we see, we will make the big buisness in the future. Martin | |||
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Martin, that´s another reason for us Norwegians to stay out of the EU  As we are not allowed to use lethal force to defend ourself ( ie use firearms ) against criminals and villains, the question of gun ownership boils down to competition shooters and hunters. As a hunter I have the rifles and shotguns I want and need, I do as much handloading I want and need, I can freely travel with my arms within Norway when hunting. Leaving Norway and coming back home with arms from international hunting trips, is just a very simple procedure at the custom desk at the port of call, usually no hassle at all. As long as we don´t have the same gun culture as in USA ( right to carry / open / concealed ) with the idee behind it to be legal self defence, I´m quite comfortable the way things are. What the future have up the sleve, nobody knows Arild Iversen. | |||
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