I agree with your buddy Steve,handloading/load testing is like pulling a thread out of a sweater,it seems to never end.

I am glad to here about someone on this forum having a .204 rifle that shoots 40g bullets well.I was beginning to think NONE of them did!!

Varmintguy,your new rifle is obviously accurate right out of the box.I would like to see some Chrono data!I really think that 40g bullet if it can shoot 3,800+ would be a very good coyote load out to 400yards.The velocities reported by the American Rifleman leave a bit to be desired,though..

One last thing..was your Ruger m77VT .204 as accurate out of the box at the new Remington???

Sharpsman: To answer your question quickly and directly (with a major dose of self deprecating honesty thrown in!) - yes the Ruger was real accurate right out of the box - I think on a par with the Remington! I was pleased and a tad surprised myself about that.

Let me explain in a bit more detail - I took my Ruger 77 V/T to the range on 2 different dates with factory ammo shot on those dates only. And on another date shortly thereafter I shot my handloads only. I made a posting somewhere about the Rifle shooting pretty well but EVERY 5 shot group was "double grouping". I had previously broken in the barrel with a shooting and cleaning regimen and then fired two 5 shot groups (that were the double groups using factory ammo) on two different dates for a total of 4 measured groups with the factory ammo! These groups measured (5 shots at 100 yards) .612", .841" and the next date .530" and .788". Then on another day I tried ten handloads. They double grouped also and gave these 5 shot group measurements .933" (with 3 shots in .046"!) and 1.246" (with 3 shots in .303"!). On that last shoots date I took the Rifle home and tried to figure out why it was shooting two in one hole and three in the nearby other hole! It did not take long to figure out. "I" had only tightened the Ruger rings screw that holds the integral rings to the action little more than finger tight! I did not have a thick enough screwdriver to do a good job on them or my arthritic fingers just did not get the job done on the day I was putting the Rifle together! Anyway I tightened the screws up and it was time for more handloads.

The first and so far only handload I have tried in the Ruger shot really well that day and I have settled on it and shot a few Varmints with it so far. The two five shot 100 yard groups with the Berger 35 grainers measured .374" and .595" respectively on a day described in my shooting log as "fair" conditions. Compare that to my performance today with the Remington with the Berger bullets - those groups were .398" and .480" in "good" range conditions!

So they are comparable in their easily obtained "real good" accuracy I think.

The Ruger has the factory stock trigger that is very nice and was factory set at just under 4 pounds (as I recall - I measured it two months ago) and its fitted with a Sightron 6x24 variable scope. So they are comparably equipped sight power wise.

The Rugers bolt is a bit sticky and that is the only minor complaint I have with it. It is a good looking and fine functioning Rifle. My Remington looks pretty well also and I think its magazine well allows a tad longer handloads to fit in it! I think my Ruger may only be a "two shooter" as I am loading it now! One in the chamber and only one cartridge fits down in the top of the magazine well.

Both Rifles load from the breech with a dropped in cartridge with surprising ease and reliability!

I like them both!

Any other questions I would be glad to answer them for ya!

Hold into the wind

VarmintGuy

I just returned from the range and the second session with my new Remington 700 VLS in caliber 204 Ruger!
Again another mid-day lull in the high plains wind prompted me to shoot mid-day as opposed to just before sundown as has been my regimen the last several months.
Well I put together some (11) carefully crafted handloads for the brand new Remington using my just acquired yesterday once fired brass. If you recall my barrel break in and short accuracy testing yesterday yielded two 3 shot groups at 100 yards measuring .330" and .336" using the factory Hornady 40 gr. loading. I was very pleased with this and was excited to use the acquired brass for some handloads using the 35 gr. Berger bullets.
Last night I used my Sinclair bullet depth seating tool to ascertain proper bullet depth to get my handloads seated just off of the lands. I was hoping for a "jump" to the lands of way less than .01".
Well that was not to be!
The shortest jump to the lands with this 35 gr. Berger would still be a long jump at .058"! This was with the shortest seating depth in the case that I dared to use. The flat base Bergers are only seated in the case neck down .20"!
Then I took my "prized" handloads over to my NECO bullet concentricity gauge and the 11 rounds of carefully crafted munitions showed a runout on the seated bullet of .005" average for the 11! Disappointing to say the least! Normally I am happy with runout at or under .003"!
So I had handloads for today that I was way less than confident in but I had to start somewhere so when the wind slowed I headed for the range!
I used the 11th round I had made to make sure I would be "on paper somewhere" for the two 5 shot groups that would soon follow. Luckily it was on paper and the formerly clean barrel was now somewhat fouled.
Well I was very surprised with what followed. the first 5 shot group in nearly calm winds measured .398" and after thoroughly cooling the barrel in some shade I fired another very good (in my mind) group measuring .480"!
Crooked bullets making a relatively long jump to the leades of the rifling and I still got very acceptable accuracy (to me!).
I may just settle for this loading as it is using the exact same components and powder charge as the load for my Ruger 77 V/T.
And I now know for sure the Remington is very long throated just like my Ruger Rifle!
I am going to measure a factory loaded 40 grainer and see just how far that bullet is jumping to the lands! That factory loading has the 40 gr. bullet seated way way deep in the case and it is making a much longer "jump" to the lands than the handloaded Bergers!
Anyway I am surprised and happy at the same time that the Rifle is performing so well with the quality of handloads I came up with.
By the way the full recipe for the 204 loading is as follows: Hornady brass with Federal 205M primers, Berger 35 gr. H.P. bullets (non-MEF) and 28.0 grs. of H4895.
This is in my 26" barrelled Remington scoped with an 8.5x25 Leupold variable.
Like my old friend Steve often says "handloading causes questions"!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Thanks for the comparisons of the two rifles.Very informative..

But...

I still need some "real world" velocities for those 1/2 MOA accurate 40g loads!!!!!!!!!

VG,
I am real interested in the velocites of those 40g loads! The data I have seen from Hodgdon looked pretty weak- only around 3,700FPS in a 24" tube.

I would think that like most small bores that the .204 is a bit touchy as to barrel length,bore smoothness and chamber dimensions with regards to getting top velocity.

If Hodgdon used a m77 MII Ruger Sporter with a factory barrel, all three factors could have been a problem in their particular gun.Who knows..

Do you have a chronograph? And if so what kind is it? I have been going to buy one for years but don't know enough to make a good purchase. I don't want to waste money on a cheap one only to buy something better later, but I also don�t want to kill it with my rifle. I interested in one with a print-out capability but would be nice to be able to add it at a later date.

Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Please don�t use anagrams for names since I know nearly nothing about them it will only confuse me more.

Swede44mag: I have had an Oehler chronograph for about 15 years and am very happy with it. Mine is not printer compatible as that was not an option back then. I make do.
I highly recommend the Oehler line. The new models can be used without the printer and you can buy it later and just plug it in. I have had a lot to do with a lot of different makes and Oehlers the best in my opinion. The Oehler "works" is back on your shooting bench with you and you can only shoot a skyscreen (bullet detector) and those are easily replaceable. Some units are sitting out there in front of the muzzle and are sucseptible to bullet impact.
Good luck with whichever you choose.
It may be some time before I get to chronograph the 204 as I am nearing Antelope and Elk scouting time!
More later
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

VG,



Yes I have seen the Hornady ballistics for the 40g .204 slug.The problem is they may be "pie in the sky" in most real world rifles.Actually,with a 26" tube and the right power/rifle combo it may come close enough for me.



As to the Mini Mark X action -yes, it is the same as the newly imported Charles Daly's.Interarms went "belly up" after the Yugo gun imports were shut off in the early 1990's,so CD picked them up after the war ended a few years ago when the U.S. started trading with the Serbs again.



One of the MOST accurate out of the box .223s I have EVER owned was a little Mini Mark X Sporter I owned in the early 90's.I floated the barrel and "skim bedded" the action.Just about EVERY factory load would shot 1/2" or under for 3 shot

groups!!

Needless to say it is on my permanent list of "guns I sold but should have kept"!!!



In terms of actual ACCURACY and FUNCTION,the CD Mini Mauser has NOTHING on a good m700 short action.However,the CD Mini Mauser is a SAKO VIXEN sized action ,about like the CZ 527 with a better safety and a drop floorplate magazine.



You can see the action here:

http://www.charlesdaly.com/HTML/products/firearms/rifles/barreledActions/mauserBarreled.asp



I want to build a svelt little "walk about".204 that can still handle a 400 yard shot at a 'yote in a pinch!!Sounds like a worthy goal doesn't it???