Jethro, a small world it tis. I leave in snack town PA otherwise known as Hanover - go past Gettysburg every day on the way to work.

Yes I plan to reload for the new gun. I have been using my father-in-laws press to load up 87 gr. speer tnt's for the 25-06. Total annihilation for hogs but wears on the shoulder after awhile. It is also really load to use around the house (farm). I have scared the living #&*@ out of neighbors when it goes off. My brother-in-laws .223 is a lot more fun to shoot and somewhat quieter. I must have been a good boy this year as Santa left a RockChucker under the tree with most of the fixins. Need a few more goodies from Midway and off I go rolling my own.

As far as range that depends on how lazy I feel. Around here you can almost always close the distance. Plenty of trees and little hills to sneek around. So the range will pretty much be as far as I/we (read gun) can shoot - beyond that have to do a little sneaking. I figure 300 yards would be a long shoot and easily be able to get within 150 yards. However, it would be fun to take a 500 yard shoot which I could easily have the chance to if I wanted. That said I probably never shoot a hog beyond 150 yards but I don't have the most accurate reloads for the 25-06 either.

Never heard them called "ground grizzlies" before. I like it! Obviously I need another DGR for ground grizzlies. Thanks. - Dan

.223s often come with faster twists for heavy bullets now. Savage's .223s have a 1:9" twist. The .22-250 had a 1:12", which will handle up to 60 grains but no more. If you're handloading, there won't be much cost difference. If you're satisfied with the cheap Russian-made .223 62 gr. HPs, there's no sense reloading for a .223. The Savage 12BVSS .22-250, which I have, is a nice, accurate rifle. It's a bit heavy for walking around a lot with, though, about 10 lbs. I think.

I still dislike that AccuTrigger safety lever. Always will, I expect.

Hogsaw, welcome aboard.
What part of PA are you from? I grew up in SW PA and currently live just south of Gettysburg in MD, so I know the terrain you are talking about. Without knowing how much you are willing to spend and the max range you plan to shoot, I will assume the typical in all areas. The 223 is a great rig that you can shoot heavier bullets with, but you will need a faster twist barrel. Correct me if I'm wrong guys, but I think Savage offers one of the fastest twists for a strictly stock gun. The only downside will be range with the 223. On groundhogs, you're probably looking at 300-350yds with a 50-55gr bullet. The 22-250 will do the same thing with just a tad bit more recoil, but add about 150 yds to your effective range. I have found that with either one you can watch your bullet impacts if the scope isn't powered way up. I like higher powered scopes that I can dial down (6.5-20), that way they work well at the range and in the field. You'll get a ton of varying opinions on this I'm sure.
As for rifles, it sounds as if you will be walking a bit, so you probably don't want anything too heavy. I'm sure you'll get plenty of other opinions, but I think your best bet would be one of the Savages or Remingtons. They both have a large selection of varmint rifles that are quite accurate right out of the box and are not too heavy. Maybe you can get the new Savage Low Profile Series 12 and then give us report on it.

Do you plan on reloading for this rifle?

I recommend cosidering a CZ 527 varmint in .223. 24" heavy barrel and either a laminate or HS precision stock. For a heavy barreled rig, they are light enough for a carrying rifle. Set trigger is great. I've never heard anyone say they had an inaccurate one. The reports I've read users have had good results with light and heavy bullets. Try Whittaker guns, for about $580 plus $10 shipping you can get the kevlar stocked one to your FFL holder. I live in Franklin Co. and I sold my 22-250 savage BVSS and replaced it with a .223 CZ. The 22-250 was just too much for my comfort with all the homes going up around here. I've got a 17 ackley hornet that I use most of the time for that reason. I'm lusting after a 20 vartarg or 20 tactical right now to fill the void between the 17 AH and .223. Get the CZ, you won't be dissappointed!

We are up in Centre County PA, more wooded and smaller fields than your area, but still a good number of woodchucks. I am just now considering getting into a varmint gun - probably 22-250 - but for years, like you I have hunted them with my deer rifle - 7mm08, 2-7 Leupold vari x III, with 100 grain sierra hollowpoints. It keeps me sharper using the the same rifle, and they do die dramatically.

Too bloody sometimes, it seems, so we also often hunt them with a 22LR. Which is what we used from my youth in the 1960s. Some people will say it is too small a caliber, and wounds too many, but it was not a big concern for the farmers around us whether they died instantly or later, in their hole. Using a marlin 880 and, lately a CZ 452,(always hyper velocity ammo - stingers, Rem yellow jackets or vipers) my son and I have killed a large number with 22LR and not simply wounded one in years. Out to about 125 yards the little 22s knock them right over as long as you are in the vital zone defined by brain, and spine down to the heart - say about a 1" x 4" target. We just hold "center body" and hold high if they are further out. Especially with the CZ, we are both confident and competent on chucks out past 100 yards. If there is any wind, I go with the 7mm08. If you are patient, as you say it is usually possible to close the range, and some fun to crawl, wait, whistle a bit, wait some more and get a shot at another one. There is no quieter round for your neighbors. I agree completely with your plan of center fire 22, either one, but if you are a "sneaker" (maybe "spot and stalk" is a more prestigious tactical label)then the humble 22LR will also work. We have always eaten some of the nicest ones, and of course you can't do that once you use any deer rifle...

I would probably go with the 22-250 over the 223, because you can download to get a less powerful, noisy round, but you still have the capacity to reach way out if you wish.

I never use the russian steel case ammo in a good gun (just SKS) because it is too damaging. Also the comment about DPMS gun suggests a semi-auto, and of course we Pennsylvanians know you can't get seen hunting anything with a semi-auto rifle (plugged semi-auto shotgun ok for small game or waterfowl)or you are in big trouble with the Game Commission.

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