I am offered a the above gun with rings, 340 rounds of factory ammo and reloading dies for $1000.
Condition of the gun is very good and was purchased new by the owner in 1963 - which also happens to be my year of manufacture.

Gun is mounted with a Lyman 6x alaskan scope with cracked ocular lens and post and cross hair reticle.

Condition of the gun is very nice - save for where the arms of his trucks gun rack wore through the finish to bare wood at top of pistol grip and wore a 3/4" long patch of white metal on top of the barrel.
I have no idea how many round have been fired through it. I'd say anywhere from 500 - 1000.

My questions:
Any guesses as to how this full length stocked gun might shoot? My friend was never one to shoot for groups so he can't advise.
Should the scope be trashed or repaired?
Is $1000 a desireable deal on this one?

Wow! What a fantastic rifle!!

1. Sako Mannlicher stocks are two piece. The pieces join under the front sling band. I would expect the rifle will shoot MOA.

2. I would probably repair the scope if not cost too much, but, I would put a higher varible power scope on the rifle.

3. Yes, $1,000 is a definite buy.

I talked with the old guy again tonight and asked him if it had been shot much.
He hasn't shot it since 1967, and that's also when he handloaded the ammo.
So I'll have to pull the bolt and make sure the bore is shiny - but rusting isn't much of a problem here in Utah.
I was wrong about the scope lense being cracked but I want a Leupy 4 x 14 on here so will get to see how much this 6x Alaskan will bring on gunbroker.
He's also got a Sako 308 (not mannlicher) that he bought the same year as the Vixen. It's got more dings to it than the .222 as he hunted with it for decades, with the same gunrack wear to barrel and top of pistol grip. I've been wanting a Kimber 84m in 7mm-08 but have to think an old Sako would be a better piece.

I'm thinking I'll buy both guns from him.

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, buy both. You have found a rare pair. The .222 is the darling of ALL small cartridges and the .308 is one of the most successful cartridges in history.

Well, sonny, with a 1963 DOB you're too young to deserve a fine piece like a pre-Garcia Mannnlicher!

Being of an adequately advanced age to merit owning such finery, I have both a Sako .222 Mannlicher and a Sako .308 Mannlicher. I was surprised that each of them shoots as accurately as the typical Sako sporter, which is to say very accurately.

If I remember correctly, the Lyman Alaskan has a 7/8" tube, so you'll have to change the rings for another scope. I would strongly urge you not to put an outsized scope on the handsomely delicate little Mannlicher. Look at a Leupold 3-9 Ultralight or something similar. It will give you all the magnification you need for a sporting .222 and won't ruin the trim lines of the little beauty.

I would leave the .222 like it is. Putting a contemporary scope on it would be like selling advertizing space on the Washington monument. IMO. Considering how mild the .222 is, even if the bore is a bit dark, it may just need a good cleaning. I bought an old, beater 788 in .223 that had a "shot out barrel" according to the owner. Long story short, I cleaned and shot that rifle for about two weeks. Every time I'd scour the barrel out, I'd get a couple of pounds of copper and carbon and it'd shoot tighter. After about a bottle of Sweets, it was shooting under an inch as often as I could hold it under an inch.

Another vote for living with the scope. Putting a big new scope on that rifle would be the same as driving around in a pristine '63 Corvette with 22" chrome spinners.

The Alaskan is a good scope and would serve him well, but I disagree that putting a current model scope on the gun would be inappropriate. The Sako may be 40+ years old, but it is as modern as any gun/action on the market today. So long as the scope is sized to fit the small gun, I don't see anything incompatable in a current model variable.

Now, if you're talking some outsized, high magnification scope with side focus, AO, 30mm tube, lighted reticle, and windshield wipers, well, no, I don't think that should go on his Mannlicher.

My personal, prejudiced view is, that Sako L-461 rifle in 222 Rem is THE most desireable rifle ever made in that chambering.
I've been drooling over those excellent rifles for nigh on to 50 years.
So, I'll say here, Kudos on a Fine rifle Sako.

Ok fellas......don't get me started....again.

That little mannlicher is sweet!!

Kevin

I'm afraid I'm not the purist you guys are. My thoughts at this point are to pull the scope and (fugly to me) Sako rings and mount a Leupy VX-III 4.5 x 14 x 40 on there in Warne rings.

The owner won't be back from vacation for a month so it will be that long before I can take ownership of it and the .308

BTW, saw a very nice .308 Forester today at the Big Gun Show in Reno. It was an easy 95%. I didn't know if the $900 asking price constituted a bargain so I passed on it. Kind of wondering if I shoulda nabbed it.

For my use this one will wear a Leupy VX-III 4.5 x 14 x 40 in Warne rings. I'll keep the 6x Alaskan in the Sako rings around to keep it together as a period package.

The owner isn't back in town 'til mid september so the earth won't be tilting off it's axis until he returns and sells the gun to me.

BTW: I saw a really nice Forester in 308 with factory peep mounted for $900 today at the Big Gun Show in Reno. I didn't know if that constituted a bargain so passed on it. It was easily a 95% gun and much cleaner than the one my friend has for sale.
Everything was so overpriced at the show I was kind of in a rejection state of mind. But I'm kind of wondering if I should have grabbed that one.

Well, I think the 95%+ Forester in .308 Winchester with factory aperature sight was a definite buy at the $900 buck sticker price.

I picked up the gun Friday and got it to the range today. We had a good stout tail wind of 20+ mph but it wasn't much of a bother since I'd already decided to just group the gun from 50 yards.
Some thoughts:

- I've got to disassemble and degunk the trigger group. The trigger pull is inconsistent and the safety feels like it's got tar in it.
- Initial accuracy was very poor. When I slid the forward rest right up behind the front swivel I started getting decent groups.
-I've included a closeup of the tape-label of the ammo I was shooting today. Loaded in '68, with Ball C powder.
- The Lyman scope is a 1" tube and amazingly clear. The adjustment knobs were very stiff, but POI did respond with consistency to adjustments made.
-See the bare metal and wood in the close ups? this was a gunrack gun and the old timer I bought it from was a forest ranger then lumber surveyor.

- Finally - what a beautiful little gun! At this point I think I'll leave the 6x lyman on it. With the post and crosshair reticle it's a sure winner for a walk around jackrabbit gun.

Whoops, I see from the pics my scope is an all american. I'm not to familiar with the lyman scopes I guess. No cracked lens on this one, I had it mixed up with the scope on the seller's .308.

Your little carbine looks in amazingly good shape for a "truck gun". Outside of the rack marks, it is very nice. Like you, I think I would leave it just as it is with the Lyman scope in place. I don't think it would hurt its value to touch up the bluing and the rubbed place on the stock.

Touch nothing on that rifle!! Do your best to finish the task of shooting that barrel out!!! Add wood dings and do no other harm.

Well, I convinced a pawn shop guy to pull a 2 x 8 x 32 Balvar off of one of his guns for $60 and must say I really like it on my 461. This was an extremely high quality glass in it's day as most of you prolly know.
The Lyman 6x was just too long for the petite little action IMO.
While not period correct, the B&L is old enough to make me happy with the combo, and much nicer for grouping from the bench.
Oh, and I also yanked those gawd-awful white spacers out from under the grip cap and butt plate. Sako should have chosen class over fad and I simply righted a wrong.

Truly classic rifle Amigo , ya done good!!!
I wonder if a guy couldn't touch up that owwie on the stock without mung-fungling the original finish too much?
Cursed rifle racks anyway, I hated em back then and hate em worse now .

The missing blue and wood finish don't bother me much. The Lyman scope was rough cosmetically, with much of the anodizing worn or UV faded and really dragged down the appearance of the rifle, as well as dwarfing the diminutive action.
The bit of wear that kind of amuses me is a patch of checkering on the grip worn smooth from the brass keeper on that leather sling. Sling hung in one place and rubbed rubbed rubbed over all those dirt road miles.

It's a neat gun with few rounds through it and one I hope I'm never tempted to part with.

Nomo... If you do not already know... when disassembling the rifle it is a two piece stock. Under that barrel band/swievel is the split, and connective piece. To access the trigger assembly remove this barrel band before trying to pull the action. The saftey has an adjustable tension screw on the left side of the trigger housing, little spring and ball bearing. Hose it out and put a tiny smear of moly grease in there. Enjoy one of the finest rifles ever "mass" produced.

Kinda funny - one can't remove the bbl band without driving out the front sight blade.
I devarnished the trigger parts and replaced the missing overtravel screw which yielded a very fine 1 lb trigger pull.
The front bottom of the action isn't in contact with the stock inletting - only on the bottom of the recoil lug. Because the front action screw goes into this lug I'm assuming the action isn't tweaked so prolly won't bother with any accra glass.

I'll clean up the checkering with an acetone wipedown then delicately apply a bit of Waterlox with a badger bristle brush to remove that raw wood look. Can't wait to take it out after jacks this winter.

quote:

Originally posted by 308Sako:
Nomo... If you do not already know... when disassembling the rifle it is a two piece stock. Under that barrel band/swievel is the split, and connective piece. To access the trigger assembly remove this barrel band before trying to pull the action. The saftey has an adjustable tension screw on the left side of the trigger housing, little spring and ball bearing. Hose it out and put a tiny smear of moly grease in there. Enjoy one of the finest rifles ever "mass" produced.

Kudos on the work you're doing on the Vixen.
Been shooting a 222 Rem working up loads for the last three weeks. Talk about FUN!! It's been a blast!!!

Great rifle; great deal. Just take it out and shoot it as is. If you're going to put a new scope on it, why don't you have refinished. Lou

Thank short action Sako L-461 will do nothing but go up in value over the years and the 222 wins hands down in the accuracy department other than several wildcat benchrest cartridges. 222 barrels have an accuracy life of at least 10,000 rounds and some claim many more.

Bargain. Grab it.

F. Prefect

I was able to shoot the Vixen for the first time today since de-varnishing the trigger and bolt internals.
Here's another group shot with some of those handloads my friend loaded up in 1967, at 100 yards this time. This was the first and only group I shot. The B & L scope was cranked to all of it's 8 power and there was boucoups dirt in the air from a 10 - 25mph tail wind.

Good group!!

What Gun Club were you shooting at? Holiday?

Don

Holiday was swallowed up by expansion of the gravel pit from the west and mansion development from the east on 1/1/09. I shoot at the bountiful lion's club range, which is pretty nice.
BTW, that group is only 4 shots. 2 in the center hole and one above not shown was a scope sighter.

a doctor friend of mine passed away back in 2004, and his wife wanted me to have his favorite rifle, which was a Sako just like that in 222...

I had shot it many times... great rifle...
in fact it was too much class with it, I thought it should stay in his family... so urged his wife to give it to his nephew instead...

He had worked at a gunshop in San Francisco in the late 1950s, and bought it before going to Australia to work on a sheep station for two years in 1960..

He became friends with an old Aussie WW One vet, who had one just like it...who reloaded for it..

the funny story is how the old Aussie would reload for it...

he'd pour a pile of 4895 powder on the table..
then scoop the case in it to full... tap a little bit out and seat a bullet...

the outback old guy was the best shot on the sheep station with that Sako in 222...and his low tech handloads...

the Sako I was offered was certainly a beautiful rifle...

quote:

he'd pour a pile of 4895 powder on the table..
then scoop the case in it to full... tap a little bit out and seat a bullet...

I used to load a .257 Roberts with a 90 grain bullet and surplus 4831 that way. Velocities were extremely consistent and accuracy was equal to more conventionally measured powder charges.

quote:

Originally posted by Nomo4me:
Holiday was swallowed up by expansion of the gravel pit from the west and mansion development from the east on 1/1/09. I shoot at the bountiful lion's club range, which is pretty nice.
BTW, that group is only 4 shots. 2 in the center hole and one above not shown was a scope sighter.

I lived in Bountiful.. Beautiful place.
But, I drove all the way to Holiday to shoot. Sorry to hear about it disappearing.. Used to take a pair of binox to the range and watch Mule Deer way up high in the mountain there..

Don

You did very well on the Vixen. Those are beautiful rifles with a lotta class.

I had an old friend that used to load for his .222 the same way...he'd pour 4895 in a bowl and scoop the case full - then cap it with a bullet.
Then go forth and kill stuff. He didn't know he was "low tech"..

I always wanted a SAKO Mannlicher and finally found one in .243. I had it rebored to .358 and it's now my dedicated elk rifle.

I also have a Forester rifle in .243. Both are very close to the serial # on your rifle.

Here's the .358 on the job:

With my trigger job and removal of the white line spacers my vixen is a honey. I've got some sub moa groups from it with the 1967 55gr soft point reloads that came with the gun.
I think my loads will use a 50gr bullet.

The old boy I bought it from also has a .308 Sako he bought 6 months after the vixen back in '63.
I've asked him to price it for me and he hasn't yet - I don't think he wants to let go of what was his primary hunting gun for all those years. It's missing the sight hood and has some hunting dings so I want it for around $600 and I don't think he's going to play ball at that price.

Well this board is slow so I'll update on this fun little gun.
Here's a couple of 100 yd groups from some loads tested with the Hdy 50gr V-max. The "flier" on the right target is actually a 6.5mm sighter from another rifle.

I'm pleasantly surprised at the accuracy this little mannlicher is producing with the B&L 2x8 scope.

You mean you had second thoughts about that lovely rifle?
Glad that you got it,it looks sweet!