Late last Thursday night I got a call from an old Gun Trading Buddy. He and several more of my west coast buddies that I do not get to see much anymore were heading east to do the Spokane Gunshow. Spokane is about halfway between where they live and where I live in SW Montana. They wanted me to bring my latest Hunting, Fishing and Varminting pictures over and join them. I decide to put together quickly some loose Gun stuff and head over and join them for the long weekend!

In addition to getting to see my buds I would get to do the Gunshow and do all the Gun stores between here and there to shop for a 204 Ruger! Well at 0600 the next morning (Friday June 11th) I was all packed up and headed west. I did all the Gunshops again in the Missoula area and then in the Spokane/Cour'deLane area. Finally at the last shop I could do before meeting my friends to do show set up I get kind of lucky. This was at the second White Elephant store (the one in downtown Spokane). They had just got in and had not even opened up yet a Ruger #1 Varminter in stainless with laminated stock in 204 Ruger. Before the guy even opened it up I asked how much it would cost! This counterman was good! He first looked in the cost book and stated $680.00! I tried to contain my interest as I was hoping he would maybe throw in a box or two of ammo! Then when he noticed the intensity with which I was perusing said Rifle he went back to his cost index and came up with a new price! $695.00! Hmm... I thought the Rifle is very pleasingly finished and even though I would rather have a Ruger 77V in this caliber (and much rather have a Remington 700 VLS!) I continued to look it over. This, beleive it or not apparently tipped the counterman over his decent conduct edge and for the third time he went back to his index and stated "oh it will really be $709.00"! I said forget it and left.

After all I had the whole rest of the weekend to find something I liked in 204.

The Gunshow went for naught in the way of my desires though. Not ONE 204 Ruger there.

I will say this though - Leupold scopes literally stole that show! They were THE hot item there. It was amazing. I was looking for another Varmint scope and followed the whole show from start to finish and looked at EVERY Leupold scope there! They sold amazingly well when their bretherin of other makes just SAT! I saw 3 Leupold 6.5x20x40's leave their respective tables post haste! And a Leupold 6.5x20x50mm sold! Many other Leupold variables moved during the weekend also. Other brands of scopes remained sitting! My friends had many Leupolds for sale and did well with them. Some were new in the box and others used. None were the higher powered variables though. The other brands they had for sale did not move and much less interest in even folks evaluating them, was apparent! Lesson here. Money spent on Leupolds is much easier to recoup and at a higher percentage of initial investment also!

I then began looking for a deal on a short action Remington 700 to take to my Riflesmith to have made into a 204 Ruger. The short action Remingtons were VERY strongly priced, as usual, and I could banter no bargains! Even the doggy Rifles were in the $425.00+ price range!

The Gunshow was just a blast though, from start to finish, with many Hunting and trading buddies showing up to visit and commiserate with. The food and lodging were wonderful. Weather was also pleasant!

Another disappointment occurred for me trading wise. I had been bargaining all weekend, from early Friday afternoon on, on a custom stocked Sako L-46 Rifle in caliber 222 Remington Magnum. Two older brothers were selling it from a relatives estate. It had a factory heavy barrel and appeared to have been fired VERY little. The custom stock (Varmint style) fit me well enough. It had a minty Redfield 6x scope with thin crosshairs and small dot reticle in Sako rings on it. Then I made the faux pas of asking one of the brothers what the price was. He said $500.00! I reached for my wallet that was chuck full of $100.00 bills and he renigged! He said "I better make sure of the price before I actually sell it". I visualized a $100.00 bump with this chickenshit move but what can you do? The cretin actually had the balls to come over to my table and offer the Rifle to me for $750.00 late the next day. I told him politely to screw himself!

Back to my 204 dilemma. I felt bummed driving home (400 miles) with no 204, no Sako 222 Magnum and no short action Remington 700 to build on! Oh well I thought the Remington Varminters in 204 will be out maybe later this year.

Well cheer me up! Bright and early this morning (Monday June 14th) I drive into town to peruse my local pawn/sport shop and what had been taken in but a Remington 700 Varmint Special in caliber 223 Remington. The Rifle was in excellent condition with Leupold one piece base and Leupold rings holding a Tasco 3x9 Pronghorn scope. The former 24" heavy barrel had been bobbed to 20" (in the style of Montana road Hunters). Other than the barrel bob it was in 98% condition. I began thinking.

It had not even been priced yet and I put the easy arm on the shop owner for a friendly price. He mentioned $250.00 for the whole rig and we soon came to a deal! I danced all the way home! I cleaned the barrel and gave it a very thorough inspection with my Siebert bore inspection tool. The bolt face and barrel were like new!

I mounted a Sightron 6x24x42mm variable scope on it after lapping the rings in. I bore sighted the scope and got some handloads and Federal factory ammo ready for a trip to the range tomorrow. If it shoots well enough to keep as is I might leave it alone and just use it for calling and mid rnage stuff.

But I really want a 204 Ruger!

I found some Hornady loaded 32 gr. ammo in east Spokane for $12.99 per box. That is the cheapest I have seen anywhere! I bought the last two boxes they had.

But I need help in deciding. I would love to have a 204 by the end of July at the latest. I have a Riflesmith that may be able to do it by then for me! It would probably cost me $275.00 for the barrel and another $125.00 for the chamber and action work! So $400.00 more and I would be shooting my 204 in a month or two hopefully!

Or option #2 I can keep shopping for a Ruger 77VT in 204 and pay about $600.00 for it! I have already done a trigger job on this new Remington 700 223 and it is REALLY nice!

I have it all for the 204 - whichever way I go - factory ammo, RCBS dies, Sightron 6x24 variable, bullets, powder everything but the Rifle!

Any advice from you Varmint board buddies! Help me decide, I am in kind of a quandry! Customize this Remington 700, buy a Ruger 77VT when I find one or wait for the factory Remington 700 VLS?

Hold into the wind

VarmintGuy

Dale, can I offer you some advice mate?
I am afflicted by the proverbial hole in the pocket syndrome, it(money) just won't stay there. At times I get so frustrated about this that I start looking at small differences you are talking about and pass on things I later regret.
I have found that sometimes it's better to just turn a blind eye to the fact that you may be paying a little more far something than it's commercialy worth.
Of course, I have to be a little bit more philosofical about it, if you take into account that absolutly anything firearms related cost about 300% more here compared to the states.

Example:
Remington VLS .22-250 - 1086EU = $1,309USD
Remington 700 Titanium 7mm-08 - 2000EU = $2,411USD
Sako Varmint Laminated - 1,960EU = $2362USD

It makes me green with envy that you could pay less than half that for such a rifle, so I can't see the trouble you put yourself through for $20.

If you want a Rem VLS in .204 any they aren't being built yet, then you should get one built. It's been a long time that I've seen you here looking for a great deal on one such rifle and maybe you will eventually come across it. Maybe you won't, or maybe you'll come across somehting that will be "almost" what you wanted.

Imagine you had gotten a parking ticket while you were away? That would have compensated for any $50 discount you might have found on a rifle!

The way I see it, even that Sako .222Rem Mag would have been worth buying, you spent the money to get you to the shows, put in the time, then came home bummed. What is a good mood worth to you?

You might have offered the guy to come back to a halfway point between his first offer of $500 and second of $750 = $650. That's a very nice rifle and you probably won't find many like it around. Shoot the barrel a bit, then convert to the .204! But done is done. I learned to be a bit more philosofical about saving money on my hobbies when I realized that sometimes I spent for and lost time in the quest for a deal. Do you consider how much that road trip cost you? How about the time you have spent NOT shooting a .204, you wanna put a price on that?

You now have an action to use as a doner, use it! Get a barrel the length you would want it. Have it chambered, trued, polished, blued, whatever takes your fancy.
But in the end you will have the rifle you wanted since the beginning. Mate, you've come to far to settle for a convenient bargain that isn't quite what you wanted now.

EXPRESS: Your pointing out my penny wise and pound foolish ways is quite appropriate. Since I last posted I have taken my new short barreled Remington 700 Varmint Special to the range twice! Once this morning and once again this afternoon. The morning session was so - so and I mainly wanted to get some fireformed brass for serious testing and to see if any of my on hand handloads would light it up accuracy wise. I have a large supply of Federal factory 223 FMJ cartridges and I shot 20 of them. They made groups in the 1.2" - 1.3" range. I got them back home and did some serious handloading on them. My afternoon session consisted of testing 4 different bullets all with the same powder charge and primer and using these freshly fireformed Federal pieces of brass. I used my sensational Sinclair bullet seating tool to get seating depths that had minimal jump to the lands for these test loads!
I used H4895 powder and the following four bullets - Nosler 50 gr. Ballistic Tips, Berger 52 gr. MEF's, Sierra 50 gr. Blitz's and Hornady 50 gr. SX's.
The results of the 5 shot groups with these at 100 yards were as follows:

Nosler = .927"
Berger = .678"
Sierra = .499"
Hornady = .282"

I was just thrilled with the one hole group made with the Hornady SX's! I have never done much with this bullet and to tell the truth I do not know where I got this box of them. I do know they shoot in this Rifle!
Now it looks like I will have to keep the little sawed off Rifle as is! Yes, I know, one five shot group does not mean this Rifle will do it everytime. But the promise it showed with both the Suerra Blitz and the Hornady well, its just a keeper!
More later popcorn is done!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

From past posts I gather you already have enough 223s(?). Go ahead and make up the 204, you'll enjoy it.

I didn't make the Spokane show this time. My hunting buddy Ed (you guessed it-Ed in Idaho) who is on this board was there and bought a Whitworth 375 H&H.

Sometime, when we both are going I'd like to meet you, shake hands, and talk shop. Call em in close_____Pedro

BTW- I shoot a 20in.barreled (223) early Mini Mauser as a calling rifle.
I bought the barreled action new for $180 and stocked it with a nice classic carlo walnut stock/3X9 Leupold = 7lbs. complete.

VG:

Dale, we haven't met face to face yet, but I know your patterns it seems. Not much different than other guys.

I'd re barrel the Remington you just bought to the 204 and have a lot of fun. You can always screw back on the 223 barrel, and sell it once you have the real Remington VLS or VSS in 204 that you are waiting to get, when it comes available.

Who knows, at that time if the 204 is hot, I bet you can recover most if not all of your investment by the rebarrelled 223 at that time, even if you decide to sell it.

I'd prefer a good PacNor barrel to factory any day. Just the 223 action alone for $250.00 I'd say you did well. If that Trashco Pronghorn Scope is surplus I have some nephew and niece in Billings that I bet would be happy as a clam to get to put on a 22 rimfire.

Keep us posted. PS got a couple of emails from Mark White also. Glad he liked the Blue Dot loads. Seems like a great guy.

Cheers and Good shooting
seafire

I have found out that it is always cheaper to buy what you want the first time. Spend some of that money you can't take it with you. I would have tried to haggle with him on the Sako. I have been looking for one at a good price for years. I have also been told that Remington actions are better than Ruger so re-barrel the Remington and don't look back. My 2cents worth.

Seafire/B17G: Yes it is a minty little Tasco (Trashco - I like that!) with a silver Pronghorn on the side. It is a 3x9 variable with no adjustable objective. I have no idea what it costs or what it is worth but I would make them a super good deal on it. Once the weather stabilizes I am heading east but skirting Billings 60 miles to the north going over and way to the south on the way home.
It was cold enough here last night to make ice out of the lawn sprinkler water! They predicted 38 last night but obviously it got down to 32 degrees at least!
Cool - sunny and bright today!
Does Pac-Nor make 20 caliber barrels! I don't know - I will look them up on the computer today. My Riflesmith works only Wednesday through Saturday at his shop and I need to call him today and see if he has a 204 reamer.
Yes Mark is my main man! His home computer burped to death and he is so busy at work I hate to bother him there with to much computer traffic. He has shot a lot of Coyotes, Raccoons, Ground Squirrels, Possums, Rock Chucks and such but I am trying to get him over here for a grand style Prairie Dog Hunt to break him in on those critters!
I am still amazed those Hornady 50 gr. SX bullets shot better than the Berger 52's and the Nosler Ballistic Tips in my new Rifle!
Like they say EACH Rifle has its own favorites and you sometimes have to try them all to find that particular best component.
Thanks for the help on the 204 decision. I need to make something happen soon.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Pete In Idaho: Dang sorry I missed you - or you missed me! It was really a pretty good show. Gee I wonder if my friend was the one that sold your friend the 375 Whitworth Rifle. He had one but I was away from our tables so much I did not see him sell it! Small world if it was him!

Yes I do have a batch of 223 Varminters already! And I do not really need another.

I remember those mini-Mauser actions. I wish I had bought one and put it aside. I assume they do not make them anymore? I saw a Moose (Bull) walking in the creek west of Kellogg, Idaho. He had nice antlers and was just walking along ignoring the traffic on I-90 not 150 yards away!

I weighed my cropped off Remington 700 Varminter with Sightron 6x24 scope and it weighed 10 pounds 4 ounces! The now adjusted trigger is just wonderful and would work nicely if I have to change it to a 204!

Hold into the wind

VarmintGuy

Swede44Mag: Yeah I would have been pleased as punch to add that 222 Magnum to my Varmint arsenal! The last I saw the owner had removed the Redfield scope and was asking $650.00 for the Rifle itself (with rings?). I could try and fetch up his name for you or have my friends watch out for him at the upcoming shows. The metal was very very nice. The wood was perfect and plain grained (preferable in a Varminter?). It had just one clip with it but that was minty condition itself.
I have the exact same Rifle that is also custom stocked in my arsenal now. It shoots very well indeed.
I feel lucky and envision either a Ruger 77VT or a Remington 700 VLS coming my way soon if not I can always rebarrel my new 700 Varmint Special!
Let me know if we should put out the word to find the Sako L-46 owner.
Thanks for the advice!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

http://www.accuratereloading.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=693232&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=21&fpart=1&vc=1#Post693232

enjoy!!!!

VG.....there's a Ruger varmit target grey laminated at gun broker right now for a buy now of $630. shipping is $20.....dealer tranfer 20? out the door for 670 no tax. I am in no way affiliated with this dealer. I'm gonna wait for the 700 LV. or the CZ which ever comes first. In the mean time I'll just play with my 77 stainless in 204. BTW i got 200 rounds of 40's for 129 delivered from lock stock and barrel.

Lofter, I hope your 204 likes the 40's better than my Savage VLP! It doesn't like the factory forties and it doesn't like the few handloads I've tried with the 40's either! But as long as it keeps shooting the 32's in the .3's, I'll just live with it! If I want to go to 40, I'll switch to the 222Mag or the 22-250! The 32's are a hoot!! You can see the bullet smack the varmints! NO RECOIL!! Check out www.thefirearmsforum.com and look for a post in General Discussion about "Miss GHD and her first centerfire varmint "smackdown"! She likes the rifle too! GHD