I am looking for my first .223 bolt action rifle after I was given good advice on this site not to upgrade my Mini-14. I plan to use my new bolt action rifle for varmint and coyote hunting.
I have been told to look at Savages for their prices and Remingtons for looks and quality. I do like the Remington 700 VSSF or the PSS versions. I am not sure what Savage model I should consider.

Furthermore, as a newbie what is the difference between short action and long action? How about barrel length? Should I get a 26" 24" or 20" barrel. The shorter barrels look nice but do I give up accuracy versus a 24" or 26" barrel?

Appreciate you help.
XMan

You don't give up anything with a longer barrel except easy of carry and a little more weight.
I think Sako and Tikka have about the smoothest bolts in the business. Remington has a smooth bolt, but you also inherit about an eight pound trigger pull with it. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

Well, maybe I can put it in perspective for you.

You are right, a good bolt action is the way to go.

I own more rifles than most people think make good sense. Some of them are light weight, some have barrels that look like truck axles. But, my .223 Remington is a plain old Remington 700BDL.

It has the standard weight 24 inch barrel and a wood stock. The only modification has been the very expensive addition of a Jewell trigger.

It shoots quite small groups with any number of loads and is great for what most people call "walking around" varminting. I own bull barreled 22-250's, 6mms, 7mms, etc., but for walking around in the hills and taking whatever shots I can get at ground squirrels, coyotes, bob cats, etc. the .223 is my choice. Besides which, it works just fine in South Dakota shooting prairie dogs.

Just my choice in this matter, but I would not change it. Sure, I might like a bull barrel .223 Remington to go with it, but I would not be without the standard weight barreled gun.

R F

getya a model 7 in .223 with the 20" barrel. should weigh around six pounds or less. avoid a scope that has a big (50mm or so) objective lens. Or you may can still find a NIB Remington Classic in .223. I think it was year 2000 or 2001.

XMan,

Right now the most accurate rifles out of the box seem to be the Savages. Sure some people don't like the way they look but you can’t argue with the way they shoot. Me, all of the Savages I own are older Model 99's but I'm looking at the possibility of getting a .300 WSM in a Savage. Another thing when varmint hunting you are not walking around all that much. Most times you are on a "stand" of some sort. Be it calling coyotes or whatever or busting ground squirrels/p-dogs/chucks you are not moving around so portability is not an issue. Accuracy is. Go with a 24 inch barrel and a heavier weight rifle for stability. Lawdog

One thing I read in Guntest mag., was a test of the varmint 223s, they said the most accurate was the Winchester Stealth, don't remember if they tested the Savage, I'll have to see if I can get the issue from my buddy, Jay

Be sure to take a look at the C Z. I have one in 22 Hornet that is the most accurate out of the box gun I ever bought!
Pete

Hi XMan:

Well, you're headed in the right direction. The .223 is the "best" 22-cal. in my humble opinion. You will have a real good time loading and shooting it. My first caution is to try and decide exactly what you want to do with this new rifle. Things like barrel length, rifling twist, barrel diameter, stock design, etc. are all directly related to useage. Some of the high points are:

Heavy Varmint/Target: Savage 12 BVSS: most will shoot less than 1/2" groups right out of the box, quite heavy, not a "carry rifle", has 1:9 twist to shoot heavier bullets. In my opinion, for the things .223s do best this is the best value on the market. A couple hundred bucks up the ladder, and worth the money if you've got it, is the Ruger 77 V/T. Quality, function, accuracy to equal or exceed any factory rifle. Excellent trigger, nicest action in the industry.

Medium-heavy Varmint/Target/some carrying use: Howa M1500 Varmint Supreme. Haven't shot one of these yet, but lots of forum reports on them, and I looked one over very close at the gun shop yesterday. Very well-made, nice trigger, nice laminated stock with choice of blued or stainless. (Just so you know, I'm into laminate/stainless and don't care for "plastic" stocks. Other guys will have a different opinion, and that's OK.)

Also in this class, the CZ-527 Varmint with laminated stock. I'm not totally cool with the extended clip, but this rifle is a thing of beauty. Light enough to carry, beautiful trigger, good quality.

Down from this would be the standard "sporter" class and a very wide field. My suggestions would be a Ruger 77 stainless/laminate, Ruger No. 1, Howa 1500 Thumbhole Sporter. If you want even smaller/lighter, the CZ-527 carbine.

As you can see, the choices are almost overwhelming. Stainless or blued, walnut/laminate/poly, light/medium/heavy. Take some time, some careful thought, and pick the rifle that suits your way of shooting. By the way, short actions are just that. About .75 to 1" shorter than the long actions which are required for larger calibers. Short actions are stiffer, weigh less, and are the best way to go with a .223.

As far as barrel length, it depends on powders and bullets, but somewhere in the range of 50 to 120 fps per inch of barrel after about 20". For a .223 I personally like 22" or 24", but with the short action 26" isn't bad.

My guess is, you'll get lots of advice. Some of the guys on here have lots of experience and way more money than me. Just sift through it all, pick what makes sense to you and at what level you want to get in at. Remember to save some money for a good scope. I'd rather pinch money on the rifle than on the scope. Best of luck ...

I like my 700 VLS .223 26" barrel.

This was/is my first expensive gun.
The trigger is nice, I adjusted it to around 3lbs.
It looks nice, Im almost afraid to take it afield.
Ive only got about 150 rounds through it, but it shoots 3 touching holes at 100 yards with the Win. 45gr HPs. It shoots the same with varget and 52gr. matchkings. It also likes 40gr v-maxs behind 26.6grs of H335, 5 shots into .5". This is with a $140 Tasco Scope even . I havent done anything else to it besides adjust the trigger.
I am pretty happy with it.

I would have liked a VSSF, or even a VS better, but I couldnt find a new one for around the same price. I would just rather have a syn. stock for hunting purposes.

It is a little heavy, but mine will see more bench use than hunting.

I looked at Savages also, but I didnt want the 1/9 twist, and I couldnt find one locally that was compareable to the VLS in features and price.

Whatever you decide,it makes perfect sense to me that you are considering sticking with the 223 since you already have one and know how to use it. derf

Here's a link to a VSSF for sale at a decent price. I don't know the seller so I don't know if it's still avail. or not.

http://www.snipercountry.com/forsale/Display_Message.asp?Message=0000008049.txt

I had a .223 VSSF that averaged about .7". Best group ever was a .5" All groups were handloads with various 52gr. match bullets. I sold it (only because I'm left handed )and bought a .223 VS LH, shoots about the same. My .22-250 Savage will avg. in the .5" range with many groups in the .3-.4" range. I'm more excited about the Savage and the upgrade possibilities with it vs. my Remingtons. Barrel changes can be done by myself with pre-threaded, chambered barrels from SSS. Trigger (a must) and stock can be upgraded as well if so desired.

-Rick

[ 08-07-2003, 11:41: Message edited by: rduncan ]

I own a batch of bolt 223s.

The Ruger VT, the Remington 700 VLS, the Winchester Model 70.

However if one was swiped and I had to replace it, there would be no question in my mind:

Savage 12BVSS, with the accutrigger and laminated stock. Helped a handicapped friend acquire one, and what a rifle!!! Fit, finish, smoothness of the action, accuracy.
Best value on the market in my book. And in the world of some real class acts in varmint rifles, that is quite a statement.

I love Kimbers, but I still would pass on the Kimber and buy me TWO Savages if I had the cash to spend.

I would like to thank everyone on this thread that gave their advice/wisdom in helping me select my first bolt action rifle. I found my new rifle on www.gunbroker.com. I thought $450 was a reasonable price and wanted to save some $$$ for a qualilty piece of glass.

Brand: Savage(New in Box)
Model: 10FP-Tactical
Caliber: .223
Barrel: 24" HB
Standard black stock and it has the new Accu-Trigger.

It was a difficult decision between this model and the Savage 12BVSS. So I decided that in the very near future that the 12BVSS will be my next rifle especially if the 10FP is as good as they say it is.

XMan,

Great. I believe you made the right choice. Keep us informed on how it shoots for you. Lawdog

X man you made the right choice!!!!! those pretty rifle guys will not be laughing when they see that thing shoot. be sure and let us know how it does