This goes along with a couple of other recent threads , but what would some of you'all consider the beat for whacking long range yotes ?

By long range , I mean maybe 400 yards and over.

I think the light bullet /very high speed route like a Swift works nicely out to about 400 yards and then begains to suffer compared to heavier high b.c. bullets in a big case driven as fast as possible .


In my mind , the best choices would start out with the big case .22 s and the heavier end of match bullets like the 75 gr A-Max . The 22 Howell and something like fiftydriver's 22/6mm improved come to mind here . I think the .22 WSSM has some potential here , but I haven't seen much mention of folks using the heavy match bullets in that case .

Next , I think the 6mm/06 would fill the bill very well with the medium to heavy plastic tip bullets , plus there are some high b.c. match bullets available . The 6mm/.284 or .240 weatherby should do about the same thing .

On the big end ,in my opinion , you have the old .264 . With 100 gr or 120 ballistic tips it hangs right in there with any cartridge for trajectory and wind bucking . There are also some 105 or 107 gr match bullets that should work well. I haven't tried any yet as it's hard to get by the accuracy I'm getting with the Nos B.T. s .

Of course the even bigger calibers like 7 mags will work good also , but you start to get into the realm there of somewhat unpleasant recoil in my view , and the extra energy is uneeded . The .264 with the lighter bullets still feels like a small bore(to me at least) in the recoil department .

The big .25 s are certainly good , with the .2/06 or .257 W maybe the best choice in stock factory guns , but the b.c. s of available bullets seem to suffer some as compared to the 6mm or 6.5 bullets .

I'm just rambling here , so any other thoughts on the subject ?

By far my favorite for long range yotes/chucks is the 6/06with a 25" 4 weight Schneider(6-20 Leo with Premier dotz to 700)

My second favorite is my 7 Mashburn Super with a 25" 4.5 weight Schneider(4-14 Leo with Premier dots to 700)

And lastly is my 340 on a M70 with a 25" 5 weight Schneider

If I have a nest built and know the range and the angle and there is not much if any wind then Mr chuck and Mr Yotes is deep in the hurt locker for a long long ways.....grins

"GET TO THE HILL"

Dogz

How about these.
Over the counter gun Bolt 25-06 with at at least a 24inch tube preferablly a Sendero shooting 105grn Berger with a 400+ BC at around 3300fps
Custom 26 inch 6.5-284 shooting 120s as fast as you could push them. Do not forget the 280IMP with a 140 B-Tip

Or get silly and go with a 17 VLR (Very Long Range) shooting 37gr Kindler golds. (maybe only Mountdoug would understand that choice) Nothing wrong with Marks choices either.

NOT to conflict with Mark D's 6/06, but I would prefer the 6mm Rem.

With a 60 to 80 grain bullet, I have achieved some pretty impressive velocities and have been surprised on how flat shooting they are, even the 60 grain Sierra and 55 grain Ballistic tips.

I just think an '06 case would just do the same burning more powder. But I don't own one so it is just speculation on my part.

I also have to point out, to me a 6mm Rem is a cartridge best set up in a long action rifle, not a short action. The long action can allow one to seat the bullets WAAAY out there, and that helps that velocity/pressure thing out a lot.

Cheers and Good shooting
seafire

Here's what i think u need for Very LR coyotes-- velocity, BC, and terminal ballistics. That being said-- if i could pick only one i'd probably go with a tight-necked 7 WSM with a 28-30" barrel blasting the 162 A-Max out of it. With a good system behind it- i bet that combination would go to a thousand with some degree of consistency (all conjecture for sure). I know of a guy that's shooting that bullet out of a big case, and having some good results to 700+.

Sure would be nice to have some VLD Blitzkings, Ballistic Tips, or V-Maxes.

I'd have to vote for the .25-06 Rem, launching 85 gr.

Nosler Ballistic tips. I am shooting a Tikka WHD(M695),

and my longest shot, on a coyote, is just under 400 yards,

and it dropped like a load of rocks hit it. I am going

to fool around with the 300 WSM, with 125-130 gr bullets,

just for fun, this winter, but I am really working on

a solution, with no problem. The .25-06 does a fine

job out to where my skills start to get marginal.



Squeeze

25-06 with a 26" tube. 257wby close second.(cost).

My 24-06 26" bbl Ruger !B does 3440 with 100 gr slugs and my 264 Win mag Super grade does 3600 fps with the same grain BT.

I've been trying to address the same question for awhile.
I have a 6mm varmint special that does alright out to 500-600yds on targets using Berger 75 MEF boatails. I have ordered up a Pacnor barrel in 1-10 twist for a 26" 22-6mm rifle. The plan is 75grn A-max or VLD over Varget. The rifle sits in a Bell/Carl tactical stock/25moa one pc base/leup. optics.

Stevo

Hey Stevo-- what kind of scope are u gonna put on that long-ranger-- are u gonna run clicks or use a ballistic reticle or both???

I don't know if 500 to 600 yds, is far to some.

if one has a range finder and knows his trajectories, it is not hard to really do that.

This was funny to me, but a month ago this happened.

I was shooting my 243 with a 75 grain Hornady HP.

There is a rock at 725 yrd about the size of a file cabinet. Our range runs gently up a slope of a mountain side.

With my last couple of shots I always like to hit the rock.
I usually do it with my scope on 6 power or so.

With two shots left I put my scope on it, and low and behold something is sticking its head out from behind the rock.

I am trying to figure out what it is in the rifle scope when out trotts this stupid coyote. I put the cross hairs on him and pull the trigger thinking I will just try my luck.

Low and behold, his rear end flies up in the air. He is circling biting his ass, and I put the last bullet down range, and down he goes.

Instead of this being a great marksman feat on my part, I knew the range and had a target walk right into my cross hairs.

My take on it, is the Shit luck of the Day award has to go to this dumb coyote, may he rest in peace, lol.

If you know your trajectory and distance, you really don't need some exotic caliber or rifle.

Considering the size of the rock about 3 ft high and 2 feet wide, I can see it fine on just 4 power. With a little practice it is amazing how easily your eye can adapt to seeing out there.

We have something made of cement that hangs off of a large target stand at 500 metres on our range that is the size of a milk jug. It is surprising on how easily it is to hit it once you have it dialed in. A bank of dirt right behind it allows you to see your misses and adjust your sites or just move your cross hairs without touching the scope.


Cheers and Good shooting
seafire

ss

I plan on working out the clicks which I done out to 600yrds with my 6mm. with the tapered base it'll be interesting how far I can get-should be fun!



As for the scope, I've got a Leup 4.5x14 w/knobs on the rifle now. I really want something with a target dot, high power variable. Not really sure what will end up on it, been watching the classifieds and ebay for something that will catch my eye. I do like a target dot reticle though.



Stevo

"If I could only just have one rifle"(GOD forbid!!) It would be a 25-06Remington to do what you are asking...varmints from 400-700. Yes I like the 6mmRemington too! And the 22-250 and the 243 and the 243AIand the 257 Roberts..but if looking for a long range "put the smackdown" on a varmint(or deer for that matter...they should be classified as varmints!!! Had to wait for a 10 pointer to get out of the line of fire on a groundhog last night at 491 yards(used the .204 on that one)just to be safe!!! Too darn many of them!!! Interfering with the groundhog hunting!!! Not to mention eating too much corn!! VARMINTS!!!! that's what they are!!!!) the 25-06 will fill the bill as well as anything you want to sit behind! GHD .....pastor at the church of GHD...25-06!!!

My vote in a factory rig is a 25-06,hands down.I have seen what a 25-06 can do at 400-600 yards on Coyotes.With an 80-90 frangible bullet in an accurate load,it is the HAMMER OF THOR to a song dog..

I have heard a lot about the 6mm-06 and the .25-284 but if I ever built a wildcat rifle to better the 25-06 it would be a .25-300WSM. Yes,a 300Winchester short mag case necked to .25 cal.It would have it all,a short action round with plenty of powder and 3,500FPS+ with a 90g bullet.It should work well..

Good story SeaFire-- I agree with u regarding get to know whatever u're shooting. I think one of the reasons you don't hear about LR shooting much is because there aren't many places where a guy can practice that kind of shooting. Not only that-- also doable LR opportunities really don't present themselves that often so consequently few investigate what's possible. Any comments on this??



U know a lot of guys sure like that 25-06 for LR coyotes-- gut a buddy of mine that's shooting a 25-284, and really likes it-- too similar to the 25-06 to split hairs over, i'd imagine.



Stevo-- sounds like a good system u've got there. U ought to check out www.longrangehunting.com for the ultimate in that very topic sometime.

SSCoyote:

Yeah I agree, I am lucky to have a place for long range shooting on a rifle range. IN the western USA people can get out on BLM or Forest service land and just set up something.

A little work but if isolated it won't be bothered most instances.

Like everything practice.

I have to admit I prefer the 6mm Rem over the 25/06 based on bullet selection etc. I'd put a 6mm Rem, with a one in 7 twist any day against a 25/06. I don't think the 6mm Rem will show any inferiority. Both cartridges perform closely, especially when 100 grain bullets, or less are spoke of.

I just like that 6mm has better bullet selection and uses less powder than the 25/06 to accomplish 99.9 % of the same job.

If I was looking at 25 caliber then I would go with the Roberts case over the 06 case. That is exactly what I did when I went with the 6.5 mm testing on what cartridge to build, for my long range rig. I went with a 6.5 x 57 ( 257 necked up to 6.5 essentially).

It gave me all a 6.5 x 284 could give with less powder and easily available brass. The 6.5 /06 offered nothing but more powder consumption. I did not even touch the mags, because the 284 case and the 06 case could not make the efficiency grade of the 57 mm case. The 57 mm case did offer something tho over the 308 necked down to 260.

In a long action, i can seat bullets out very far, and the 57 mm case is better for this in the standard magazine lengths than the 06 case.

Just my nickel's worth from Hooterville Oregon.

cheers and good shooting
seafire

ssyote--as far as long range opportunity's goes here is what I've found.

Rocks, yep shooting rocks at long range, in the wind and with weird angles and with mirage is one of the best teachers of long range shooting. This can be done in any number of positions. A while back I had my wife out shooting rocks at 700 yards, she was using my 7 Mashburn Super set up with a 4-14 Leo with Premier dotz out to 700. Said rocks were between the sizes of a grapefruit and a basketball, she powdered the heck out of them.

With the right condtitions and the right know how and enough practice and good equipment one can do some really neat stuff at long range.

Other excellent targets are rockchucks which we take to fairly hard each summer. For these, we back up to 450 and then start at them Anything under that range is shot from either sitting or off hand otherwise it is just executing them and of no challenge. None of this laying on the ground for the closer ones....grins (and none of this shooting off portable shooting benches)

Yotes at long range I would suspect comes under the heading of what type of country you hunt them in. Some of the country we hunt them in has some big wheat fields, and one can have some incredible opportunities to work at long range with them.

Sharpsmen--something to think about is a 6/06 if you're thinking 25/284. The 6/06 is my alltime favorite round for yotes and chucks at long range.

55 Nozlers @ 4400
70 Nozlers @ 4000
95 Nozlers @ 3500

(25" Schneider tubes)

With all due respect in talking about the different rounds I've yet to of found one of the small bores that will keep up with a 6/06. The 25/06 is a darn good one and the 25/284 as long as you can get reliable feeding out of it is a good one (to me the fact that a rifles has a short action means nothing). I've burned up a few 243, 6mm and 240 Page tubes and they all worked just fine, they could not keep up with not a 6/06 or a 25/06 speed wise, but with the right scope they will work just fine.

To me, most of this long range shooting is about knowing your equipment, serious time behind the trigger out there in the elements and not at the range (preferably).

As far as scopes goes I've found the quickest and easiest system is a good Leica range finder, and then setting up a scope with dots from Premier reticle. You range, you select your dot and you shoot, quick and easy and one less step than using a click scope. Perhaps if I was more of a load tinkerer I'd go with the clicks but I want one load and I want to learn it inside and out. To me the up and down part can be taken care of fairly easily, the extra speed of a couple of these rounds can really help out in windy situations.

Quick twists can be intersting and could be done with all of the above rounds and each one would get better I feel, and you would benefit some for sure at long range (as long as you kept that speed up). I believe my next 6/06 will be a quick twist and I'll shoot the 105's and the 107's. Although I've had basically zero complaints so far with the 95 Noz Bt at 3500.

Just some thoughts for the day.

Glad to see so many other long range coyote shooters out there. I am kind of amazed at how many people chimed in, there is 10 or 11 of us that has a enough experience with this to feel comfy writing in comments.

Have a super day.

"GET TO THE HILL"

Dogz

Mark , I think your dot system would be preferrable to "clicking" for yotes , as I figure many times the bloody buggers are just not going to sit still long enough for clicking the scope.

I think the Burris ballistic plex may fit here as well , and I aim to give it a try.......

sdslinger-yep the dots work quick fast and effective. If your trigger control and technique are good and you have the conditions doped you can do amazing things with it.

I just got one of the Burris B Plex scopes, it is a 3-9 and it is gonna go on my 338/300 WSM. It may just get a work out yet this summer for pd's. And it should be quite ready for yotes this winter.

By the way where is Gary S.D. at? Much for yotes/foxes/roosters around there?

Have a great day

"GET TO THE HILL"

Dogz

Mark..........Gary SD is on the far NE edge of the state .

We have enough yotes , though I don't think they are as quite as thick as the badlands side of the state . Fox can be good , or scarse , depending on how hard the yotes have been working them over.

Roosters are dependent on winter weather , we can get get some real bad winters that severely knock the birds back at times . They are unbelivably thick right now, following several easy winters.

I'll pm you, make that e-mail

Dogz

Mark-- shooting inianimate objects like u say is THE WAY since it allows u to get in a lot of practice. Last coyote season i was out on a nice afternoon with my wife. We were sitting on a low bluff overlooking a dry wash down below us. We were facing east to try to take full advantage of the late day sun. Since the drought's been hitting so hard here the past couple years coyote #'s have gone down some, so i decided to look for something else to shoot at. Across the valley was a dirt bank at a (Leica 1200) lasered 1000 yds. exactly to a dark spot on it about the size of a grapefruiut. I was shooting a 6.5-284 XP-100 pistol with a Harris tall bipod attached. I was sitting in an extra cushion reinforced closed cell foam stadium seat i covered and sewed up with a burlap bag (mighty comfortable and portable field seat with 1 extra layer of foam for each yr. over 40, by the way). I cinched up the sides tight and leaned back into it with the trigger guard resting between my knees (unbelievably steady position). My 3-12X Burris has the Ballistic Plex reticle and target elevation turret zeroed to whatever load i may be using at the time compliments of Gerald Perry's Exbal ballistics program to 1000 yds. using the lower post tip as a reference for comeup calc.'s to 1000. I ran in the clicks for 1000, got set up tight and took the shot. Of course, i couldn't tell anything at that range so we took a walk down there and sure enuf the bullet impacted 4" left, and dead on elevation. I'll never forget that shot, and others i've made like it at LR. It still amazes me just how close u can come @ LR when everything's humming just right.

I also believe the ballistic reticles are the way to go for coyote hunting since out to 5 or 600 yds. trajectories are still flat enuf with most cartridges to allow for easy (and just as important-- quick) interpolation between reference marks.

Great story ssyote--yeah I love to shoot those pesky and cheeky rocks.....grins

Seriously I have learned so...much shooting at those critters.

I've learned a ton about shooting in wind/mirage/angles. How to make a good nest (rest).

And I've learned what I can and cannot do and in what frame of mind I need to be in to do it best. One thing I learned in a hurry was to not expect tons from myself after a tough Monday..grins.

This has also helped me to make some really nice long angle shots on critters and it has helped me to not take shots at critters short or ong that would of ended up in a rodeo.

Have a awesome day

"GET TO THE HILL"

Dogz

Most of you fellas are approaching this from the perspective of using typical varmint calibers/cartridges on varmints, and with the 6.5-.284 there is a capability to reach beyond 1000 yards. There is a lot of talk too about the 6mm and 1/4 bores, and I have absolutely zero problem with any of these, but the question posed said beyond 400 yards as I recalled, and held no further caveats. Strictly within that context I've got to vote for something that will digest something like 120 gr. of slow burning powder and launch .338 300 gr SMK's at velocities above 3000 fps. Practical? No, not if you're going to walk. But it will reach well beyond 1000 yards.

digdan--if we were talking in that 1000K plus range I do belive we'd be looking at a different breed of round for sure. One of the big 6.5' the 7's the 30's or the 33's.

But, I think he was thinking about something in the "long range 400 maybe more range". Or something ot that effect, that is why we all gravitated the way we did.

Now, if you want to talk plus 1000K that is a different game IMO.

"GET TO THE HILL"

Dogz

Hey SD-- for "maybe 400 yds. and over"-- to maybe 600 you might also wanna consider trying some of Jimmy Knox's (JLK).22 cal. LD bullets. They are simply a VLD with the boattail chopped off. They still retain the higher BC of the longer larger ogive nose, but can be used in factory rigs with std. twist rifling (especially the Savage bolt guns since their bigger 22's are offered in 12 twist). He makes a 52 gr. for 14 twists with a .302 BC, a 60 for 12 twists @ .339, and THE bullet for the .223 WSSM (IMO) at 65 gr. for 10 twists with a WHOPPING BC of .395. Got a buddy of mine that has shot pr. dogs out to 650 yds. with a Cooper 14 twist 22-250. He's getting < .5 MOA out to that range on the calmest early mornings-- and that's just with the "little" 52. Imagine a .5 minute 12 twist Swift, or if lucky an accurate Mod. 70 .223 WSSM Coyote with that 10 twist 65. The "tactical" coyote sniper with such a rig would be able to do some things i'd bet.

Interested?-- call him @ 479-331-4194

Thanks , ss'yote , I will have to take a look at those JLK bullets , have seen a couple of other folks mention them .



I would like to try out a big .22 like the Howell cartridge some day . I wonder if any of the factory .223 WSSM have a twist faster than 1 in 10 ? I think the 75 gr A-Max needs at leats a i in 9 or so ?

U know SD-- i wonder if anybody's tried to get any "9" twist bullets to shoot out of a WSSM-- At the velocites a guy could get out of that case-- who really knows--sure would be fun to try tho.



I tell ya what i'd like to try out of one would be that 69 gr. Blizking Sierra's talking about, but it might need a faster twist. If they come out with it though, i'll defintely be trying it.

I ran some numbers a while ago and concluded that wildcats aside that the minimum cartridge for long range coyotes might be a 25-06 but that most big game cartridges that are about maximum for the bore would do quite well. Thus a 264 WM, 7mm STW or even a .300 magnum would carry the mail way out there.

Advice from Sierra on this quest was to figure a minimum of 2300 fps impact velocity to insure expansion in the small animal.

Nice shooting Seafire.

TY, Savage

seafire