I am surprised I am the first to post this... some guys must not be out surfing the web site to see if they can find out any new offerings for 2006......

Well of interest to you fellow varmint hunters....

Howa is offering their Varminter with a Boyd's Laminate thumbhole stock ( that ain't new) but what is new.. is that it is available with a Christensen Arms Carbo Lite Barrel!

It is to be chambered in the standard 223, 22.250, 243 and 308 calibers.. but also in the 204!

One of those babies in a 204, should let some of you "Bonnie and Clydes" of the prairie dog towns shoot all day bliss!......

price is not mentioned on Legacy Sports website, but I am sure it will be something of interest to my fellow varmint shooters....

Any Howa I have dealt with has always been a tack driver....

I can see trading off a couple of rifles to find a spot for one in my gun cabinet!

http://www.legacysports.com/newproducts/index.htm

cheers
seafire

Seafire/B17G

Carbon barrels well over a past few years several gun manufactures have offered them. They seem to have faded away for the most part. There have had lots of claims about them they have hyped them to the max. Now the material they use does not transmit heat so your barrel doesn’t feel hot. But down under that composite that barrel (liner) is hot and the composite is acting as an insulator and keeping hot. That's my opinion however. I read a lot and never have seen any independent testing that has suggested they are better barrels than conventional CM or SS barrels in which the mass of metal tends to dissipate heat.

If the manufactures claims were correct these barrels would be far outlasting and highly more accurate than convention barrels. In that case you would have seen a real switch to these in the BR community and I’ll tell you that isn’t happening at any measurable level that I have been able to detect. I’m not going to be one to jump on the bandwagon here over a bunch of marketing hype.

Seafire/B17G: Thanks for your post updating us "bonnie & clyde types".
That Rifle design and the stock features sure reminds me of a couple of Remington Rifles I have bought recently!
"Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" is it not?
No, to each their own, but one of the main reasons I buy traditional Varmint Rifles is for their massive barrels, the weight of which adds to my accuracy in the field for certain AND it probably adds to accuracy from the bench as well!
Now the Howa folks did not mention the weight of the new Carbon Fiber Supreme but I would guesstimate its 2+ pounds lighter than it would be if the barrel was traditional steel.
Now I hope that the several claims the Howa folks make regarding this new Rifle work out to be true, as a founding member of the "bonnie and clyde" Prairie Dog shooting team I am sure I would rather have the mass of an all steel barrel.
I do though think that many folks will differ with me on this point and Howa will sell some - depending on the price of course.
The Remington version of the Carbon Fiber Varminter did not do to well recently. And it, was EXPENSIVE!
I wish the Howa folks every success with their new offering.
By the way Seafire/B17G you can join the Bonnie & Clyde Prairie Doggers Association for only $19.95. Simply forward your certified funds to ME and I will promptly send you back a B&C Permission Slip that will allow you to Hunt Prairie Dogs in the 23 western states!
I am surprised you are not a member already!
Hold inot the wind
VarmintGuy

Jay, well it could be all hype or not. I have a CS Remmy composite in 223 and it is a tack driver from the very get go. I have not shot it enough to report on a heating factor as of yet. The upcoming sage rat hunts will be a good test and I will be able to give a full report back then.So far I am very pleased with the way the gun preforms.

Jimmy

I have a Remington VSSF that is my go to PD rifle in no wind conditions a VSSF. It has the stock ribbed SS bbl. The rifle is approaching 3000 rounds now and the accuracy is not fading. It's had a good test on the PD fields over the last 3 years. It will still shoot .2's if I do my part. Hope yours does as well. Keep us informed.

Jimmyd223: My Varminting friend in far NW Washington state has a Composite Barrelled Remington 700 Varminter also in 223 Remington.
He is also VERY proud of its accuracy.
I am waiting from him as well as from you on how you like it out in the field over improvised rests, bi-pods, window bags and the like!
And as an aside - he got his new about a year and a half ago from a source that sold it to him for less than wholesale price even!
Still if I owned a Rifle with one of the carbon fiber encased barrells I would shoot it at a very measured pace - slowly in other words.
Wishing you continued good luck with your nifty 223!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Jay,I "had" a VSSF that was one of the greatest but in a weak moment I let it go, of course at a profit but at a great loss to me in as such went a near perfect sub 1/2" varmit rig
I am so far impressed with the composite and while it is lighter than the same contour in a bull barrel, I am not sure of the exact differance. The composite weighs in at 11 lbs with the scope and bi-pod, where the Holland gun with the #8 contour barrel and the Holland stock and a LR/T 6.5-20-50 weighs in at 15lbs.

The Composite is topped off with a leupold 8.5-25-50 Premier reticle mil-dot sitting in Mk 4 rings. I am hoping that this will work into a 5-600 yard varmit rig.
As was said above the remmy composite were, I think overpriced and this did not help sales. I was lucky as I got mine for a steal.

VG, I understand what you are saying. The good part of all this is that a Darrell Holland Kreiger barrel would fit right in that barrel channel

Jimmy that's a nice looking gun. Like your choice of scope too. My VSSF had a Leopold 6.5 X 20 X 40 now sports a 6 X 24 Burris signature and shoots better than me. So far my best with it has been a PD at 480 yards.

Jimmyd223: Great looking Rifle you have there!
I love the Leupold 8.5x25's and that power range for so much of the Varminting I do!
I even have one on my Antelope/High Plains Mule Deer Rifle (Remington 700 Sendero in 270 Win.).
Thanks for posting the well defined picture of your rig!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

VG:

I'd consider joining the Bonnie and Clyde Prairie Dog Club you speak of... however, I am founding member of the Southern Oregon Bonnie and Clyde Sage Rat Shooting Society... not sure if Dual Membership is allowed in our organization.....

However, any member of your organization is always a welcomed guest in our home territory... and we can always line up "targets of opportunity" and even "target rich environments".. if yourself or any of your members are going to be over in this direction....

And we will waive the $19.95 courtesy fee also...

cheers
seafire

As far as the carbon fibre barrels...

I kind of like them...I have one on a 10/22... with magnaporting... it is from Butler Creek...along with a Hogue Rubber Stock on it... and a 3 x 12 x50mm, Made in China, scope from Walmart.....

But this thing is not only as light as a pistol, but most anyone else that sees it, seems to like it a lot more than I do..... People offer to buy it all the time....

I take Boy Scouts out shooting also, and they seem to fight over who gets to use the Butler Creek Barreled 10/22....

I know about a dozen people who have copied it after seeing it, and wanted to know what the components were....

The Carbo Fibre barrel on the Howa is from Christensen Arms... I checked out their web site....they will carbon wrap any customers barrel for $999.00...might as well say a cool grand....

I got to admit, I was thinking out loud....

But a 28 inch carbon wrapped varmint sized barrel.... say in a 204, or 20 Tactical, or a 223... utilizing Blue Dot powder and lighter bullets.... The benefits or never loosing sight picture.. in say a Burris 8 x 32 scope( with a mil dot) or the Leupold 8.5 x 25 ( with the varmint reticle).... say in a H/S Precision stock....IN a target rich environment....

ONE could shoot that puppy all day, without having to worry about barrel heat........

That would be almost as desirable as having a Mint condition 69 Z/28....or a Mint Condition 66 Vette with a 396 or a 67 Vette with a 427 with Tri Power ( 3 two barrel carbs)....

I feel myself doing the Homer
Simpson Day Dream as we speak!

cheers
seafire

Sea-thanks for the update, it will give me more to think about as I drive from Minne back to home in Montana tomorrow.

I have this current flame for a CFiber tube, I saw a 700 in 22/250 at Scheels the other day that is just killing me. Big time issue with lust over this one.

I kind of wish the Howa had a glass stock instead of plywood but that is just my tastes.

Thanks

Mark D

seafire

Does this mean you have finally seen the light and you're jumping on the .204 bandwagon ?

It's about time(grin)


If you check out the Winny website , you will see that they are gonna offer .204 s in several configurations.........the little cartridge seems to be doing right well for such an inferior round(chuckle) Right off the top of my head I can't think of a major gun builder that is not now making 204 rifles.....

quote:

Does this mean you have finally seen the light and you're jumping on the .204 bandwagon ?

It's about time(grin)

Well, Actually, partway.....

I am looking to order a 204 barrel for a switch barrel on my Savage 12 BVSS....That way I can try it out....and if I don't like it.. I can talk it up being a great cartridge and sell it to one of my fellow unsuspecting AR varmint shooters....

I have to admit... I am looking at a Ruger 77 Mk 2 Sporter that may be getting close to needing to get a replacement barrel on it...a 26 inch chrony moly heavy magnum contour barrel in 20 Tactical... might look pretty good sitting in that grey Laminate Boyd's stock.....

The 20 Tactical is appealing based on the amount of 223 brass I have possession of........

If one of those allusive Remington 700 ADLs in 204 happen to cross my path... I do admit.. I would probably horse trade off something to make a spot for it in my gun cabinet....

But my most recent varmint toy, is a 22 caliber barrel from PacNor in 24 inch stainless steel, in a magnum coutour, with a one in 8 twist and previously chambered in a 223... just got returned from the gunsmith.... on a Ruger 77 Stainless action that use to have a shot out 243 barrel on it... that barrel was rechambered for 22.250... and I have about 1500 rounds of 75 grain VMaxes... and about 8 pounds of H 414.. and about 600 rounds of Nosler 80 grain Match bullets.....

And a Buckmaster 4.5 x 14 scope is just waiting to have a set of rings put on them and mounted on the Ruger now.....

on the Savage, tho, I am also debating about a 20 BR barrel over the 204.....

decisions decisions decisions....

cheers
seafire

Seafire/B17G

quote:

I am looking to order a 204 barrel for a switch barrel on my Savage 12 BVSS..

That's funny I just happen across a Savage FV12 a friend bought about this time last year. He has shot about 40 rounds through the gun. I know this gun and it a pretty sweet shooting rifle. We had lunch together today and he annouced he was going to sell it and get a lighter rifle. Curious I asked him how much he wanted for it. He paused then said $300. Well looks like I have a canidate for a switch barrel too. Same as you I'm thinking .204 or Tac 20. Guess I need to do a little more reading on the 20's. Took a look at some barrels over at Sharp Shooter supply.

Jay,

Sharp Shooters Supply is the site that got me going on this bandwagon...Kinda of like an erector set for varmint shooters....

quote:

I kind of wish the Howa had a glass stock instead of plywood but that is just my tastes

Mark:

If I am not mistaken.. this rifle will have an HS Precision or a Bell and Carlson stock on it.. the picture I saw didn't have a laminate stock on it...which I actually prefer....

cheers
seafire

Thanks I'll be for checking it out.

Mark D

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
Jay,

Sharp Shooters Supply is the site that got me going on this bandwagon...Kinda of like an erector set for varmint shooters....

Seafire/B17G Yes I know what you mean. My mouth almost started watering while I was on their Website. It really got the gears engaged. Pick up my new used Savage Friday after work. I feel a project coming on.

quote:

Originally posted by VarmintGuy:Still if I owned a Rifle with one of the carbon fiber encased barrells I would shoot it at a very measured pace - slowly in other words.VarmintGuy

Please don't take this as questioning you personally, but I thought the idea behind the carbon fiber is to dispate heat QUICKER than steel and be lighter in weight. Have you found this to be incorrect?

Thanks for your help....I don't want to believe everything I read LOL

Jimno

I've had a VSSF with a Leupold 6.5-20x50 EFR for a couple of years that I use for eastern groundhogs and the occasional coyote. I love it for it's accuracy and easy carry wt. for a varmint gun. When I first chose its favorite factory loads I posted my results. I was ridiculed by the sceptics so I won't repeat them but they were awsome and the groundhogs and coyotes believe. I haven't shot it enough to have any feel for how long the accuracy will hold. If these barrells weren't so darn pricey I might try one in a mountain gun.