Do any of you guys get involved with groups like this?

I always figured it was a way to let as many people as possible what you have stored in the way of foodstuffs and firearms/ammunition at your house.

A friend of sorts is. He picks my brain about once every other week about issues as they come up.

They have a group of 10-12 families with children, about fifty people.

They meet monthly to update and exchange ideas. It turns into a potluck dinner.

One of the families two HS-age daughters have turned "Vegan" and now refuse to eat anything with meat/fish/poultry in it. Wild game, is definitely a no-no for their parents and one other couple.

It ends up with about six to eight people who are "picky eaters" who even sort through stews to take out the things they do not eat. He wants my advice.

I told him I want to go to the next gathering to see this circus. Can't do that, it is a "Secret Society".

I told him to just wait until TSTF and shoot them all after all of their food, firearms, and other necessities for an aftermath lifestyle assemble.

He thinks I am kidding...

Not as a survivalist, but its amazing how finicky eaters become not finicky when they are hungry and no one gives a &^%$ about their "needs" anymore. They will dig in with everyone else into the 'possum.

"Picky Eater" and Survivalist, bit of an oxymoron isn't it?

Grizz

some people live too well inside their parents house. I have two married friends with children in their late-twenties and early-thirties still living at home, or recently returned.

It's a cold, hard reality these days for some...

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
some people live too well inside their parents house. I have two married friends with children in their late-twenties and early-thirties still living at home, or recently returned.

It's a cold, hard reality these days for some...

Like everything in life, having the kids live with their parents can be a double-edged sword. Sure some kids do it because they are spoiled. We all know how to complain about that and what "SHOULD?" be done about it.

Still, in many such families, it is a GOOD thing. Sort of takes us back to the Good Old Days" when the vast majority of American homes were multigenerational. And it might save us much of the cost of the "Social safety net" if more families were that way today....eliminating many of the ghetto problems today too.

There always were extra pairs of hands around to help with the chores, care for grandma and grandpa as they became old, bring in a little extra income with what work they find, and so on... a corrective hand was always there to stem misbehavior by the kids.

Also saved money on baby-sitters and nannies, and maybe best of all, kept home-burglaries way down...was always Some Adult at home....and if anyone needed to get to a school function, doctor, wherever, there was always someone on hand to take them.

One of my younger sisters (age 70) has that kind of family right now. Her son and grandson both live with her and her husband (their son's wife died at 26 from a brain cancer). As a result, they have three incomes instead of two, and they have the time and wherewithall to take in every San Jose Sharks, San Francisco '49ers, and SF Giants home game played, every year.


Because they have all those season tickets, they also get "comped" for a lot of other stuff , such as Harlem Globetrotters and so on....whatever is being held in the three home stadiums.

And Jacob (her grandson) has all the benefits of having three adults in his life as role models on how to make a real, loving,family.

My other sister (also age 70) has both her son and daughter living at home with her and her husband. Same deal there...4 incomes...allows them all to live on 5 acres in California's "gold country" (Sierra Nevada Foothills) near lake Tahoe in their huge 3-story home surrounded by BIG trees and covered in deer, quail, etc. from the bordering forest. She spends her spare time doing charity work free gratis. (Which lucky for me includes making and sending me a couple of pounds of home-made peanut brittle every other month!)

Everyone looks after everyone else in those two families.

So every family should be judged on its own merit, not by how many generations live under one roof.

Well said, AC.

Way back when, I read a very good article on "when kids move back in" that I used to guide me. Basically, it said when the kids move back, they are no longer kids nor GUEST. Before they get in the door, there should be a firm understanding as to what their responsibilities as to house cleaning, cooking, etc are going to be and what their financial contributions are going to be. If they're broke, what sort of sweat equitity are they going to do to make up for the lack? If they have kids, they shouldn't assume that they have live in baby sitters.
These ground rules should be laid down before they get in the door and enforced in a pretty hard-nosed manner.

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:
Way back when, I read a very good article on "when kids move back in" that I used to guide me. Basically, it said when the kids move back, they are no longer kids nor GUEST. Before they get in the door, there should be a firm understanding as to what their responsibilities as to house cleaning, cooking, etc are going to be and what their financial contributions are going to be. If they're broke, what sort of sweat equitity are they going to do to make up for the lack? If they have kids, they shouldn't assume that they have live in baby sitters.
These ground rules should be laid down before they get in the door and enforced in a pretty hard-nosed manner.

One should have an understanding of all those things, I agree. I would add that it should only be tried/permitted if the family was a "functional" family before the kids first left home.

If either or both of the parents, or the returning kid(s) were irresponsible/demanding/ lazy/selfish/ or unloving before the kids left, things won't be any better when they come back. There is no point in putting back together a dysfunctional family. Trying to make that work will fail and everyone concerned will be unhappy as hell.

In functional families one doesn't have to be too firm...the basic rule there is everyone has certain roles/chores, but the over-riding precept is that if anyone in the family sees something that needs doing, THEY do it as quickly as is reasonable. They don't leave it for someone else because it "isn't their job".

Income earning/sharing also needs the same type of treatment...everyone has previously agreed income objectives to fulfill and bills to pay, but again if anyone in the family sees a bill that needs to be paid, and can do it, they pay it. They can always collect back from the others whose "role" would include being responsible for that type of family expense.

Last, and maybe most important, is that everyone in the family understands the exterior doors are all "two-way" doors. Folks who refuse to help the family function well can be pushed back out the door as quickly as they were welcomed in.

AC

That type of situation is still fairly common in Ranching/farming families-and yes you are correct. lots of historical precedent.

Grandparents make great baby sitters.

It was that way when I was born as well. My Dad's Dad died when I was 5 and his widow and my Mother had a never ending donnybrook about which was ascendant in the home. Two very, very strong willed women in one home is one too many.

My Grandmother had a 1954 Fordor with a stick shift. If the wind was right, I could smell that old black car coming about a mile down the blacktop. Gram thought the clutch pedal was where you rested your other foot...

We are becoming generational here again, and it's not a bad deal...

Rich

If there are grand kids involved I'll open the doors. If its my kids I'll quote my grand father.
"Starvation is inspirational"
Granddad was a cowboy in the pan handle of Okla until he got married. Once he got married he went to work for the Santa Fe, laying track.

Jim

quote:

If there are grand kids involved I'll open the doors. If its my kids I'll quote my grand father.
"Starvation is inspirational"

It would depend on the reasons but unless there was some extreme circumstances (untreated drug addiction as an example) I'm damn sure opening my doors to my kids if they need my/our help. What the hell else are parents for? "Starvation"........not while I've got any means to prevent it left.

I always thought it was a bad idea to stockpile ANYTHING
and let anyone else find out about it....

Particularly SHTF supplies.

Be realistic, IF you are prepping and you let anyone know it makes you a target

I have often thought, that should the SHTF, those most ready to adapt would be the gang bangers in the inner cities.

They already understand the premise of the 2nd Amendment, they have no qualms about shooting someone to survive, and they are ganged together in ways that even the Mafia can no longer match.

They make their living on the vices, which we all know, have survived every evolution, revolution, and institution known to man...

I really don't think they would notice a difference if society were to crumble.

If you or your group is in a true survival sit, then all other issues, considerations become secondary to the primary goal. No efforts, resources, or time should be expended if it does not support the survival of the group. Way too much time and energy are wasted on concepts like group dynamics, fairness, and compassion. If an individual will not or can not make a contribution to the group, they do not have a place in the group and shold be expelled.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:

One of the families two HS-age daughters have turned "Vegan" and now refuse to eat anything with meat/fish/poultry in it.

That's just a teenager crying for attention. Most of the vegans I've come across are doing it for the high maintenance/attention effect.

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:

One of the families two HS-age daughters have turned "Vegan" and now refuse to eat anything with meat/fish/poultry in it.

That's just a teenager crying for attention. Most of the vegans I've come across are doing it for the high maintenance/attention effect.

Or, for peer group acceptance. One of the most important things in the world for teen-age girls is to be recognized as a definite member of one of the "in" cliques at her/their school....the "female jocks", or the "classy upper crust", or the "do-gooders", or "politically correct", or "brainiac", or "saviors of the world" or who knows which.

If Veganism is one of the keys to entry, it will overwhelm any other logical options proffered to them...at least until they get married and have kids. (Or, find some other group they want to belong to even more, which pooh-poohs Vegans.)

teenagers...

I told my children if any of them come back home I'll never have to cut, haul firewood mow the grass, weed the garden or any other chores I can think off.

Maybe that's why they haven't moved back

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
I told my children if any of them come back home I'll never have to cut, haul firewood mow the grass, weed the garden or any other chores I can think off.

It's called sweat equity. Something we need to do with the slugs living in public housing.

Guess it depends somewhat on why society has failed, or what and/or how long the emergency lasts. For most of us in the more occupied places, guns, food and ammo only attract the rat scum of society and delay the inevitable. A stack of bodies in the yard may deter others interest for a while at least.

The societal failure I am is not why little johnny is attacking folks, but rather why society has broken down enough the marauders are out doing things.


For those of you living away from population centers (very few states qualify here), if you have a source of clean water you may be able to pull it off.

WASBEEMAN
Guess I was unclear . . .

I would expect yo BLAST him before he got on your chest, if not several mortal wounds once you were in the close proximity would be appropriate social intercourse.

TCLouis, If I've a 200# banger kneeling on my chest, beating the shit out of me, I'm not pondering where society failed nor am I concerned about his childhood. My concern is if I can get my piece into play and blow him away. Then we'll let his mama talk about what a "good boy" he was, aspiring rapper don't cha know.
According to your theory, I should just lie there as it's gonna happen sooner or later and hope he merely maims me instead of killing me.
In a time of social collapse, you will have two people, takers and givers, sheep and wolves. What's your choice?

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:

quote:

If there are grand kids involved I'll open the doors. If its my kids I'll quote my grand father.
"Starvation is inspirational"

It would depend on the reasons but unless there was some extreme circumstances (untreated drug addiction as an example) I'm damn sure opening my doors to my kids if they need my/our help. What the hell else are parents for? "Starvation"........not while I've got any means to prevent it left.

Gato

During Carters's recession I had two daughters, pre-school. I worked three jobs and the, then' wife worked one job. There was no option about moving back with the parents.
It never crossed my mind.

Jim

quote:

Gato

During Carters's recession I had two daughters, pre-school. I worked three jobs and the, then' wife worked one job. There was no option about moving back with the parents.
It never crossed my mind.

Jim

Sooo....you still managed to make it, but what if you didn't have a job, had gone thru all of your savings, unemployment, etc and you're losing your home due to non-payment of mortgage or rent? There are people in places where they just can't find a job or jobs. Maybe your parents couldn't or wouldn't help, but I damn sure will help mine.

Personally I don't think my kids would want to move back home either, and it is very unlikely to happen, but if the situation arises, I and my wife are PARENTS, not part of the time, not until they turn 18, not until they get married, not until they have kids, BUT ALL THE TIME while we're living.

As time goes by, the wheel of life turns and the love/support we gave to our kids may be returned when one or both of us becomes unable to live on our own.

The bottom line is, I don't give a rat's ass what your relationship with your children is, whether you would help or not, doesn't make any difference to me, but I'm there for mine 24/7.

neighbors,
strangers, dogs ,cats, food for survival.

I back my kids all the time. If they were delinquents perhaps I would feel differently but they're not.My eldest works the oil fields,my middle is a college prof., my youngest is in college + still holding down a full time job. Shoot, everyone makes more than I do but they thank me me constantly for the work ethic that I installed in them. No brag,just fact.You can not get a better memorial as a Father.

I guess it comes down to the fact that the difference between your family and friends is that you get to pick your friends...

quote:

You can not get a better memorial as a Father.

No Sir! You sure can't. Congrats!

.

When my Dad died rather suddenly, we took my Mom who had Dementia in with us and took 24 hour care of her for 5 years until she finally passed away.

I wouldn't do anything less for my own children who needed help in some way or form.

My wife and I took care of my aging parents for 9 years.

that is a whole lot different then strong healthy adults coming back to live with you

Long way around the barn but getting back to the original post;I do not think that it is a good idea for all to know what you have stockpiled for yourself. In my particular case,I live in a small community + out in the country.Everyone knows I have a range on my land,load ammo,shoot,etc. Too late to change that. Of course that could be a plus or minus depending on the sanity of the individual,which does tend to decrease as hard times loom.Most everyone here has a garden + cans,except the new transplants from the city that brought their money + bad attitudes because it was a beautiful place to live.Sorry,off the subject kinda. I also feel that these "groups" for lack of a better term will fail just like the hippie communes of the 60's. It is/was called the 80/20% principle.Without an organized + recognized authority 20% will work while 80% will loaf. Human nature in this day + time I'm afraid.Perhaps the odds will be better at first with the "survivalists" but I have a feeling that with permissiveness of todays society that the younger set will give grief. I recall several years ago when my sons were still young + at home,we had an ice storm which closed all the roads + knocked off power.I was out for 4 days,some were out for 2 weeks. No problem,I had a wood stove + cooked with gas. Only snag was water as we are on a well + that requires electricity.I have since solved that problem by installing a propane generator (propane won't go bad over time) in the well house in the event of an emergency.Also installed 2 propane lights;1 over the cook stove + 1 at the head of the stairs as well as 2 propane space heaters for quick heat. My other point was that the only snag in this iced in situation was that the kids did'nt know what to do without video games. Parenting 101,I read books + told stories.

I don't tell anyone what I have or where. Not their business.

My kids all came back home for various reasons. They all know I have a 90 day rule. If you are not in school (post high school) you have 90 days to get on your feet, get a job or two and be a productive citizen. If you still live with me after 90 days, apartment sized rent applies, and around here that is $600/month.

All three used the 90 days. The oldest I had to make move out because he decided to quit college with 40 hours left and sit at home and play on the internet. Not in my world. The middle was only there for a week. She lined up a job, apartment and roommate in that time. The youngest was two weeks. She now lives in a rented house with her best friend and her friend's brother. She has 4, yes 4, part time jobs as well as going to grad school. Her comment was "Old man (affectionately), as you and I get older, you will come to live with me, NOT the other way round."