quote:

Originally posted by lindy2:
2.5 inches thick is pretty thick for knife scales. One could probably divide that in half.

I'd see if I could find a knifemaker who would take it in partial trade toward a custom knife.

quote:

Originally posted by drhall762:
I guess the first question I'd ask is what is it made from? Paper, canvas or linen? We use the term micarta kind of like we use the term Kleenex to include all phenolic laminates. Micarta is however a registed trademark of Norplex-Micarta.

quote:

I use a lot of micarta materials (over 1,000 pounds per year) and have for a long time and would like to weigh in here on the "Micarta" name issue.

Westinghouse made and sold some of the best reinforced phenolic and knife makers such as Bob Loveless popularized its use on knife handles, so the knife buying public is familiar with the term "Micarta", but might not know what a person is talking about if they hear "laminated phenolic and fiber composite". It just doesn't have the same "ring" to it.

I remember about ten years ago when industry made the change. From my point of view it was actually pretty terrible. I didn't change my orders with my material suppliers, but the material changed with the end result being some pretty major problems with the work I was producing at the time requiring significant re-work, replacements and some non-trivial losses. The new Micarta was not a quality material. It turns out that Norplex bought the name from Westinghouse and applied it to cheap import junk material which lacked the dimensional stability and quality of the original. Import material labeled "Micarta" because they'd bought a name.

It's my understanding that Norplex does make some good materials, but much of it isn't, and that name doesn't mean anything anymore.

In my opinion, the best phenolic is manufactured in Yonkers New York by Accurate and is called Acculam. To me it's the closest to the original material that I've found.

There are some important issues with the quality of the raw material that I've found:
1: The extent to which the fiber is impregnated with phenolic. Some materials are incomplete causing issues with dimensional changes from moisture absorption and problems getting a clean buff and a smooth finish.
2: The amount of filler used vs virgin resin. There can be so much regrind and filler added (to reduce cost) the amount of virgin phenolic resin is not the major percentage of the weight of the final product. This results in a weak crumbly material with soft spots that doesn't polish evenly and breaks or crack when dropped.
3: The quality of the workmanship concerning distribution of fiber and flatness of finished sheet.
4: There are probably differences in the quality of the base resins and cotton products also.

The end results being quite a bit of variation across the brands and grades ranging from the original Westinghouse Micarta that is hard, machines smooth, and is durable and stable and attractive, to low quality import materials that swell in water, won't lay flat, have a chalky quality and get dirty and uneven when buffed and crush or crack when a screw is run tight on it. Makers need to know what they're working with and avoid low quality materials or the quality of their knives will suffer. Why try to save two dollars on the cost of the material? That's all it is and it's foolish.

So, I describe the Acculam phenolic I use as micarta because my customers know what micarta is and would be confused by "laminated phenolic and fiber composite". It's straightforward and simple word that people understand. And I don't feel it's being disingenuous because it's closer to Westinghouse Micarta than most of the Norplex stuff is. That's a lower case "micarta". Times when I use Westinghouse Micarta that's capitalized Micarta, a proper noun. I understand that Norplex owns the trademark now and can legally call anything they want "Micarta", but to me that's getting into word games. Polyamide is Nylon, polyoxymethylene is acetal is Delrin, and reinforced phenolic is micarta, we all know what it means.

The take-away here is, call it what you want, but be aware it is all the same thing, but it isn't all the same quality and that brand name doesn't mean what it used to mean. Personally, having been burned, I try to stay away from Norplex products.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
Butch:

Did you ever sell it?

I accidentally ran on this post while reading on Blade Forums. Seems that there are only 2 REAL Micartas, because the name is trademarked. The original maker, Westinghouse, whose product is held in very high regard, and the company that then bought the name, Norplex, whose product, at least some of which is imported, is not so widely respected. So, technically much of what is called Micarta these days is probably not. This post is by a widely respected knifemaker:

quote:

I use a lot of micarta materials (over 1,000 pounds per year) and have for a long time and would like to weigh in here on the "Micarta" name issue.

Westinghouse made and sold some of the best reinforced phenolic and knife makers such as Bob Loveless popularized its use on knife handles, so the knife buying public is familiar with the term "Micarta", but might not know what a person is talking about if they hear "laminated phenolic and fiber composite". It just doesn't have the same "ring" to it.

I remember about ten years ago when industry made the change. From my point of view it was actually pretty terrible. I didn't change my orders with my material suppliers, but the material changed with the end result being some pretty major problems with the work I was producing at the time requiring significant re-work, replacements and some non-trivial losses. The new Micarta was not a quality material. It turns out that Norplex bought the name from Westinghouse and applied it to cheap import junk material which lacked the dimensional stability and quality of the original. Import material labeled "Micarta" because they'd bought a name.

It's my understanding that Norplex does make some good materials, but much of it isn't, and that name doesn't mean anything anymore.

In my opinion, the best phenolic is manufactured in Yonkers New York by Accurate and is called Acculam. To me it's the closest to the original material that I've found.

There are some important issues with the quality of the raw material that I've found:
1: The extent to which the fiber is impregnated with phenolic. Some materials are incomplete causing issues with dimensional changes from moisture absorption and problems getting a clean buff and a smooth finish.
2: The amount of filler used vs virgin resin. There can be so much regrind and filler added (to reduce cost) the amount of virgin phenolic resin is not the major percentage of the weight of the final product. This results in a weak crumbly material with soft spots that doesn't polish evenly and breaks or crack when dropped.
3: The quality of the workmanship concerning distribution of fiber and flatness of finished sheet.
4: There are probably differences in the quality of the base resins and cotton products also.

The end results being quite a bit of variation across the brands and grades ranging from the original Westinghouse Micarta that is hard, machines smooth, and is durable and stable and attractive, to low quality import materials that swell in water, won't lay flat, have a chalky quality and get dirty and uneven when buffed and crush or crack when a screw is run tight on it. Makers need to know what they're working with and avoid low quality materials or the quality of their knives will suffer. Why try to save two dollars on the cost of the material? That's all it is and it's foolish.

So, I describe the Acculam phenolic I use as micarta because my customers know what micarta is and would be confused by "laminated phenolic and fiber composite". It's straightforward and simple word that people understand. And I don't feel it's being disingenuous because it's closer to Westinghouse Micarta than most of the Norplex stuff is. That's a lower case "micarta". Times when I use Westinghouse Micarta that's capitalized Micarta, a proper noun. I understand that Norplex owns the trademark now and can legally call anything they want "Micarta", but to me that's getting into word games. Polyamide is Nylon, polyoxymethylene is acetal is Delrin, and reinforced phenolic is micarta, we all know what it means.

The take-away here is, call it what you want, but be aware it is all the same thing, but it isn't all the same quality and that brand name doesn't mean what it used to mean. Personally, having been burned, I try to stay away from Norplex products.