SMKNBARREL, you really want to become involved in an instantaneous, unplanned rodeo??



What you see on the teeeeveee tube and in the flicks, are people using very special blank loads when they shoot off very specially trained horses. The load makes virtually NO sound, although plenty of "gunsmoke." Later, in the Sound Lab, a Sound Technician loops in a loud BANG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Aside from damaging your horse's ears, do as one other poster suggested. Just get on your horse with an unloaded rifle/handgun, and try to actually acquire ACCURATELY, a target. It's very, very difficult, notwithstanding what we have seen in 1,000s of teeeeeveeee shows and flicks.



Get off that horse, find a rest, shoot, and take home the meat, I say.



FWIW.



L.W.

In the old days in the Northern Tarritory they would shoot buffalo from a horse.

They would gallop up alongside the bulls, and shoot into the spine at near point blank range, when the horse would then side-step the falling buffalo.

Most common rifle would have been old .303's and they could shoot 10 to 30 or more buffalo in a day.
This is when they were out in the bush, with no other means of transport other than horses and manpower.

The buffalo were shot for their hides.

Some pics from the old days express was talking about.





With a well trained horse and lots of time to put into it I think it could be done. Make sure you do lots of lead up work to make it so used to the sound it won't blink. Our work dogs are trained to lay next to us as we let loose with automatic weapons so it can be done.

Well this is certainly not the optimistic, advice giving replies that I would have hoped for. I planned to do something similar to sticking cotton in the horses ears and certainly would spend several hours on ground work before I ever attempted to fire from a mounted position. This is not cruel, nor does it damage the horses sense of hearing. Please respond with any POSITIVE relpies.

Mate would that be Tom Cole in the first pic?

The horse would be Trinket?

Yep, from his book "Hell west and crooked" I found the book interesting as it was about the area I live in. Great read.



Smoken,

As Joe said there is an association of mounted shooters and they would be a good mob to get info from. I believe they use the same ammo that the movie guys use and it only travels about 15 feet. It still must go bang however. I wouldn't worry about sticking anything in the ears, we don't with our dogs and they can still hear after we dump a full mag! Mate give it ago.

I went out this evening an introduced Apache Gail to the Golden Boy. At first, she like "What the heck is that shiny thing?!" I rubbed it against her and after she got accustomed to it a layed it across her back popped off a round. She took one step forward and that was it. I also found an interesting article at www.cowboymountedshooting.com that had some information:

"To start shooting off your horse, or to test a prospective mount, try the following ideas. A good way to start a horse is with the use of a .22 caliber “Starter Pistol” (can be purchased at sporting-goods stores for around $27.00). These guns are city limit legal because they are incapable of firing a projectile of any type. I recommend you get an assistant for the first gun test on any horse. One person fires the gun while the other person rides the horse. I believe this is the best way to start the horse to new sounds or things that are potentially scary to the horse. The premise is that a well trained horse knows that the rider will punish him if he does wrong or misbehaves, but the horse isn’t sure if this new sound is a threat or not. Therefore, in most instances, the horse is more concerned about the rider then the new noise. While the assistant is firing the .22, give the horse something to do. DON’T JUST SIT THERE, RIDE THE HORSE! I start by putting the horse through a simple exercise, like a slow lope around in a circle (use of a round pen is ideal). If the horse has never been around gunfire, or if you are testing a prospective mount, start by having the assistant stand outside the round pen and fire off a few rounds when the horse is at the farthest point away from him. We continue to slowly move closer and closer to the horse, until the gun can be fired in the center of the circle I am loping around. Be sure to lope the horse in both directions so that “both sides” of the horse learn that the gunfire won’t hurt him. We also let the horse smell the gun after it is fired. We rub it on the horses’ neck to show that the “smelly gun” won’t hurt him. If the horse is responding satisfactorily, the gun can now be handed to the rider to fire from the back of the horse while continuing to lope in the circle pattern. The rider then fires the gun behind him and upward (overhead) to allow the least amount of concussion to the horse. Fire only one round, then praise the horse, stroke his neck, etc. Continue in this fashion until you are firing off two or three rounds in a row with little or no bolting, spooking, etc. Again, be sure to fire the gun off both sides of the horse. This is very important. At this time, if all has gone well, we repeat the entire procedure with the .45 caliber revolver loaded with the blanks you will be using. This step usually goes much faster because the foundation of praise is already established. At this juncture, we bring out a couple of poles with balloons and try shooting the balloons as you ride past them. In this fashion, continue to fire from the hip (don’t get any closer to his head until much later in his training to avoid “ringing his bell” and ruining a potentially good shooting horse) while still allowing the horse to experience the balloon breaking at the moment the gun goes “bang”. The balloon blowing up is always a surprise to the new horse in the beginning!

One of my favorite tricks for training a horse to do something you want and he hates or is totally afraid of, is to use food or horse treats. For example, to train a horse to not be afraid of your rain slicker (plastic sound), feed carrots or horse cookies out of a plastic bag. All my horses can’t get to me fast enough if they hear a plastic bag rattle! They think they are going to get carrots! The obvious parallel here is to make gunfire a HAPPY, HAPPY, JOY, JOY, TASTY experience. In other words, fire the gun, feed a treat, fire the gun, feed a treat, etc. I recommend starting with a child’s cap gun to lesson the severity of the noise. When you can shoot the cap gun and the horse is still around to get his treat, it’s time to move up. Use a louder cap gun or to a .22 Starter Gun or a Cap and Ball Gun with a soft load (creates a muffled sound while the .22 is a sharper sound) and start over from the beginning. For this exercise, some people leave the horse loose in a small enclosure (i.e. round pen) while others suggest that the horse be secured to a strong tie rack. Be sure to tie in such a manner as to afford the greatest safety to the horse and things around him. The choice of which to try, tying or leaving loose, obviously depends upon the reaction of your horse. If the horse goes wild and tries to slam himself into the fence at full speed, I’d suggest you try securing him. I would also suggest trying this with a rider and an assistant. Follow the steps in “The First Step” article, but reinforce each shot from the gun with a treat from the rider. This can eventually be stretched out to several shots between treats. Obviously you will need to get to 10 shots (a whole stage of fire) between treats by your first competition.
Another method of helping a frightened horse gain confidence is to use another horse for moral support. In other words, appropriate a gun-trained horse and ride the trainee next to this horse. The rider on the trained horse can fire the gun on the opposite side from the trainee. Be sure to start with a cap gun and fire toward the back and downward, away from the trainee. Using earplugs for the trainee is also a helpful training aid, if they will tolerate them. Using this buddy system, graduate up to the louder guns and increased speeds (trot and lope). Be sure to proceed only as fast as the trainee can tolerate. When the trainee accepts this procedure, try shooting upward or just even with the rider, but still on the opposite side from the trainee. When this procedure is successful, hand the gun (start with a cap gun or starter gun) to the rider of the trainee. Be sure to take only one shot at a time. Praise and treats help soothe a nervous horse at this time."

P.S. Sorry about the odd symbols that the computer inserted when I copied the excerpt.

Trying to shoot accurately off a horse is beyond me, but I have had several that were fine with small calibers. When I was a young cowboy, in Arizona we had to be able to shoot off the horses to protect ourselves if necessary from the Brahma bulls we ran. We used .22's or .38's with birdshot. To start a horse we used a .22 from a short distance and worked up to holding the pistol over the saddle and shooting it until the horse was comfortable with it. I once drew down with my .357 on an elk I (my horse ) was running alongside, but I bashed a tree with my shoulder and tore a rotor cuff. Painfully I holstered the revolver, and suddenly the elk stopped running ??? I baled off the horse, who had come to a fast sliding stop with the elk, and shot him at about 30 yards with my rifle. Now that was a hunt!

If you insist on shooting off the horse, why don't you try it like dog trainers do? Associate the noise with something pleasurable, like food.

Give the horse some sweet feed or oats, and while it's dug right in, go around the corner and fire the starter pistol. Do it from well away, so it doesn't spook the horse, but from a position that you can see the horse's reaction.

Do it only once! Then, tomorrow, do it again, only a little closer. If the horse spooks, back off the distance.

Gradually reduce the distance you do this, until you can stand right beside the horse while shooting. I think you said it was a yearling, so you've got lots of time to do this right, before you ever get on his back.

If this works then it is Apache Gail... If, that is.

Smknbarrel



I know you're looking for optimistic replies, and I wish I could do that. I love horses, I love riding them, and I've used them for hunting. I'd be the last person to say that it can't be done, but I also have had many dogs, who would 'tolerate' shooting over them, then a few years later, their hearing's gone, and they become useless. I don't think that's fair on the dog(s). Same with horses.



I have also found that a horse rarely stands still enough to take a reliable shot while I'm on it. Give yourself (and the horse) a break, get off the horse and shoot - if it hangs around, great, if it doesn't there's probably a good reason why it gets the hell out of there!!



"This is not cruel, nor does it damage the horses sense of hearing." Excuse me? Gunshots damage human (or any other animal's hearing - why wouldn't it damage horses hearing?



You can probably 'train' a horse to withstand the noise, but it had better not be one of my horses!



I guess it depends on how much pain you're prepared to cause your horse - I valued mine too much!