The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores .416 RigbyGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| One of Us |
Hi there, I’ve been loading 92gr soft and 94gr AR2213SC in my .416 Rigby. Not sure exactly but I think that’s about 2200fps? It is the loads recommended by Woodleigh for the 450gr projectiles. Question, how many grains For 2400fps with the same powder and projectiles. And out of interest what would be an upper end load and velocity for these? Thanks DK | ||
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Thanks for your response. I meant 92gr AR2213SC with the 450gr soft point and 94gr with the 450gr solid. Looks like I need quite a bit more powder. Will check for Weatherby, good suggestion. Thanks | |||
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RIP's answer is good. The Rigby can be loaded close to Weatherby velocities in modern strong rifles like the CZ, Ruger, or Dakota, et al. We like the Rigby as an all-around caliber so we load up 350gn TTSX to 2825 fps, about 6200ft# muzzle energy. Approximately 101-103 grains of R17 should get you to that level. Or try R16 now, too. If you do not have access to R17 and R16, then I would try H4350 (which is AR2209 IIRC). Hunting at 2800fps makes the Rigby great for everything from Tommy to buffalo. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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Keep in mind when looking at 416 Wby data from any source, including different forums, that the 416 Wby is a little bit bigger case capacity. The 416 Wby is like a 416 Rigby Improved. | |||
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Thanks guys | |||
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| one of us |
Yes, that is a good point. Take my QuickLOAD with a grain of saltpeter: .416 Rigby H20 gross: 127.49 grains, MAP = 47,137 psi .416 Wby.Mag. H20 gross: 140.0 grains, MAP = 63,817 psi For 24" barrel length in .416 Rigby: Woodleigh 450-gr RNSN length = 1.437" H4831SC 94.0 gr >>> 2236 fps <<< 46,220 psi H4831SC 95.0 gr >>> 2261 fps <<< 47,813 psi H4831SC 101.0 gr >>> 2405 fps <<< 58,141 psi Woodleigh 450-gr FMJ length = 1.510" H4831SC 94.0 gr >>> 2262 fps <<< 48,530 psi H4831SC 95.0 gr >>> 2288 fps <<< 50,249 psi H4831SC 100.0 gr >>> 2410 fps <<< 59,423 psi The Woodleigh manual data is identical for H4831SC and AR2213SC: 94.0-gr with FMJ >>> 2140 fps 95.0-gr with RN SN >>> 2165 fps Their velocities were about 100 fps slower than QuickLOAD, and I suppose are within CIP MAP, but no pressures are shown by Woodleigh. For 24" length in .416 Wby.Mag.: Woodleigh 450-gr RNSN length = 1.437" H4831SC 106.0 gr >>> 2404 fps <<< 52,117 psi H4831SC 112.9 gr >>> 2560 fps <<< 63,817 psi Woodleigh 450-gr FMJ length = 1.510" H4831SC 105.0 gr >>> 2407 fps <<< 52,920 psi H4831SC 111.3 gr >>> 2551 fps <<< 63,817 psi QuickLOAD absolutes might be +/- 10% on powder lot properties, they claim, and they have no allowance for throat effects. Shorter throat on the Rigby versus the Weatherby, though the .416 Weatherby is relatively tight for a Weatherby:  The Weatherby might be capable of more velocity at lower pressure than QuickLOAD shows, but relatively speaking, according to QuickLOAD predictions: With the Weatherby you will burn about 5 or 6 grains more powder and get 6000 or 7000 psi lower pressure for same velocity: About 2400 fps with 450-grainer. Or, you burn a lot more powder (about 17 grains more) and get a higher pressure circa 5000 psi more to get only about 150 fps more velocity. | |||
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I recommend using a chronograph with load development and set a reasonable "max", say 6200 foot-pounds muzzle energy for the Rigby. The Weatherby is probably good for 6500ft#. You should discover that primers will still look "mild", nothing like the semi-flatness that is often seen in max loads for small calibers 24-30. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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I would always be cautious of top pressure loads in a 416 Rigby with any new batch of brass. Firstly, they don't have to make the 416 Rigby brass to take the pressure. Norma branded Wby brass is cheaper and then Wby branded Norma brass but usually softer. An example being a mate of mine who post on AR as Blair 338RUM and a 22/240. Rilfe (and accuracy type rifle) was set up on Wby brand 24o brass and he bought some Norma brand 240 brass due to price and had to drop loads and lost over 100 f/s with 80 grain bullets. I know with PC a 416 Rigby with Bertram brass was in trouble at 2450 f/swith 400 grains. | |||
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Yes, this is also a good point. So far, I've used primarily Norma brass and Hornady brass in 416Rigby. Both handle the "normal" pressure loads just fine (60k PSI or under), but I like the Hornady brass better. It has been more consistent in weight in the batches that I've used. Quality brass has worked well in the 500 AccRel. It seems a good company for wildcat brass. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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Hi guys, Great info, thank you. My mate has the same rifle (CZ550) and he chronographed same load and from memory got 2230fps with the same load I use for the RNSP. Therefore that quick load data looks spot on. I’ll load a few up at 98 and 100gr and see how that goes. At 94gr powder is pretty mild still. 100gr will be close enough to 2400fps. I’m using Norma brass. Cheers | |||
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FWIW, I've never flattened a primer in Rigby loads. I don't feel like I'm missing out on any fun because recoil in the 60ft#-and-up level is already exhilaratingly fun.  +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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I have never owned a 416 Rigby as I am from the dark side, that is, Weatherby  . However, I can confirm a 416 Wby without muzzle brake on is a real head jolter. Of the 3 big Wby calibres the 378 always seems the worse but I think that is due to the 300 Magnum type ballistics you do a lot more shooting/testing to get that top combination of accuracy and velocity. Without a muzzle brake and wanting to be able to shoot from improvised rests a 400 grain at 2400 f/s is about the top number. I think the big plus of the 416 Rigby and 416 Wby over the 416 Remington is they do the 2400 f/s in cruise mode and with about any powder that will go BANG. | |||
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Only adding to the good advise above: The single absolute way you are going to know what YOUR load is actually doing is to buy, beg, borrow, steal a chronograph and actually measure YOUR loads, no "I think" ....No "not sure"....no BS.......anything else is pure guess work. | |||
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100%. Also try 2208/Varget/4064. Obviously drop the powder charges back for those powders. As an example 85 grains of 4064 in a 460 with 500 grainers does right on 2000 f/s and shoots top accuracy. 85 grins of 2208/Varget in the 378 does 2600 f/s plus with 225, 270 and 300 grain Hornady. Obviously pressure with 300 grain Hornady is highest but still fuck all. So in short with a 416 Rigby you don't need to worry about what powder will give you 2400 f/s with 400 grains and with peak accuracy. Leave those problems to those stuck with a 416 Remington. | |||
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First of all, I shoot 350grain bullets in my Rigby, so my comments on improvised rests might not fit everywhere. Improvised rests are common in Africa. Typically, they are trees or rocks. I learned early on to wear a hat and to use a hat between my hand and a tree that I was using as a rest, whether a vertical tree or a horizontal log, rock, or mound. I have almost never needed to shoot prone, although I've found crossed-knees very accomodating. For prone I remember shooting smaller calibers from river banks across rivers at geese or smaller antelope. Having said that, I've never practiced prone with heavy 416 or 500 loads. I suppose that I would take a prone shot in the heat of a hunt, but it has never been necessary. What is 5" eye-relief for, anyway? I remember once with my back against a tree while shooting a cob, either a 270 or 338. I leaned out from the edge of the tree so that my shoulder would have some give. The last two shots with a 416 Rigby this decade, "weatherby" load, were sitting or kneeling. That is as low as I've needed. Africa is typically flat and prone just doesn't suggest itself. A note on 400 grains. Our Rigbys have usually been 16.5" twist. To maximize stability I have gone with 350gn flat-nose solids. Maybe that is 'over-kill' or 'over-stable', but it is my choice. Of course, I don't hunt elephant. I might choose something heavier for elephant. But for buffalo on down, the 350grain has been fine and it provides the nice 2800fps hunting speed that I like. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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I've used 2400 FPS 400 grain .416 Rigby loads from prone while hunting buffalo. It was sufficiently unpleasant that I don't see any need to either up the weight or velocity. The buffalo died quickly. I also see no need for upping it from that end, either. If you want to shoot 450 gr at 2400, go for it, but I still look at it and go "why?" given that the .404 and the .450-.400 both made their bones with a 400 grain bullet going 2200 or so. | |||
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