With bullets of the same weight and design, say 400gr and 450gr, is there really a noticable difference in bullet drop or is it mostly theory? I know they were meant to be up-close rifles but what about those unwanted running away shots or a longer shot at moose? Would there really be something to measure between the two ? If you´ve had the pleasure and, I dont mean just shooting at paper, please do tell I´m in the middle of a choice here thats distracting me from sleep.
boet

Unless you want a serious stopping rifle I would go with the 416. Ammo will be easier to get, less recoil and more versatile, imo.

Boet,

I shot a 450 Dakota with 450 and 465 grain bullets at 2500-2550 fps and it was useful for Plains Game as well as DG (elephant and buffalo).

Recoil and rifle weight is the major issue.

I shot kudu at 200 yds and impala at 150.

Thats long range for an elephant rifle!

Velocity helps but I am not sure you would not be better off with a scoped 375 and a heavy w peep sight.

Andy

1) They are not the same weight.

2) Yes, a noticable drop between a 500 gr at 2150 fps and a .416 grain at 2400 fps.

3) 99% of all game runs away, DG or not, the .416 is much better in trhis regard!

4) Not on moose. African buffalo, yes .458 or better yet .500 Jeffery.

Bottom line for you: General hunting .416. Making a stand .458 or .510 is even better.

I´m talking about loads of the same velocity and same bullet weight and same construction in two different calibers using the same basic case. In other words, is the difference in sectional density and diameter noticable. I am not in a position to develope loads and do a test before deciding. Anybody out there done this comparison? Maybe witnessed events similar enough to draw a conclusion? I know what ballisticians might say, I´m hoping for a witness.
come on fellers
boet

I don't know if this is the answer you are looking for, but I can give you the benefit of some shooting experience with .416s and .458s.

There is very little difference, in fact, no practical hunting difference, between a .416 Rigby or Rem. Mag. loaded with 350 grain bullets and a .458 Lott loaded with 450 grain bullets, in terms of their respective trajectories, out to 200 yards.

The .416s are flatter shooting, but not so that you or your quarry would notice or care.

There would be less difference if the Lott were a .450 Rigby or Dakota.

It is a far more important question what the primary purpose of the rifle will be. If this rifle will get a lot of use for buffalo and elephant, then IMO it should be a .458. Otherwise, it doesn't matter and you'd be better off with a .375.

quote:

Originally posted by Buliwyf:

2) Yes, a noticable drop between a 500 gr at 2150 fps and a .416 grain at 2400 fps.

3) 99% of all game runs away, DG or not, the .416 is much better in trhis regard! ....

If boet is talking about the .450 Rigby rimless (aka .450 Rigby Magnum Rimless) cartridge, then it fires a .458" 480 gr bullet at approx 2370 fps. It's the old .450 Nitro Express (rimmed .450 introduced by Rigby circa 1898) that is in the 2150 fps velocity range with a 480 gr bullet. The .450 Rigby rimless is simply the .416 Rigby case necked up to .458".







see: http://www.kynochammunition.co.uk/

-Bob F.

quote:

Originally posted by boet:
With bullets of the same weight and design, say 400gr and 450gr, is there really a noticable difference in bullet drop or is it mostly theory? ...
boet

boet,

Your question as stated is a little confusing. Do you mean comparing a 400 gr bullet in both the .416 Rigby and .450 Rigby and then comparing a 450 gr bullet in both the .416 Rigby and the .450 Rigby? Or, are you wanting to compare a 400 gr bullet in the .416 Rigby with a 450 gr bullet in the.450 Rigby?

Regardless, trajectory is determined by the velocity and ballistic coefficient of the bullet. Bullet weight and caliber are not relevant.

Using your .416" 400 gr and .458" 450 gr bullets as an example (just assuming a ballistic coefficient of .300 for both bullets):






The .416 Rigby fires a 400-410 gr bullet at 2350-2400 fps.

The .450 Rigby fires a 480-500 gr bullet at 2350-2400 fps.

Assuming the bullets have the same ballistic coefficients, the trajectories will be the same.

-Bob F.

Like some of the earlier posters, I am a bit confused by your choice. I load my .404 to factory .416 velocities and it makes a truly fine general purpose gun for those who don't mind getting slapped around a bit by the recoil. My .450 Rigby, on the other hand, is too heavy and kicks 'way too much to be anything but a pure DGR. Though it would definitely knock the crap out of anything smaller than a buff, I honestly couldn't justify carrying it for that purpose. And I believe that it would be a complete waste on moose. As was earlier said, a scope sighted .375 makes better sense for those circumstances you mention.

Ok, heres the thing.(sorry to be a pain) I want a 416 Rigby. I always have, for no good reason, because I have or have had rifles that can do the same job. Now, I have within my grasp a very pretty 450 Rigby rimless for a very good price. What I want to know is if I can load it to duplicate the ballistics of the 416. I have a 425WR that I´m too scared to fire monolithics in, I gave my 375 to my son, and I sold my lott because I just plain got a headache firing it.
So, in a nutshell, if I cant use the 450 as a 416 efficiantly, I´ll give it a miss.
I´m about a day ahead of most of you timewise, so sorry for taking so long to respond to your much appreciated replies.
boet

Ah! Now you are clear. No, the .450 will not be as general a weapon as the .416. It is a serious stopping rifle suitable for charging blue whale at the beach. Unless you need another headache machine, give it a miss.

Sarge: How much does your 450Rigby weigh or what weight do you recommend for it? jorge

It weighs 10.25 lbs and I wouldn't subtract an ounce. Some time this year, I'll put a new stock on it, probably synthetic, and I'll make sure that it's o.k. to put in twin mercury buffers and enough extra weight to bring it back up.

Thanks. I'm aiming for right about there with my 450D. jorge