Sirs,

I am venturing into 450 NE waters come September. I will start loading some Woodleigh and older style Hornady soft round nosed bullets. If a few, or many, of you would be willing to share some loads, I would appreciate it greatly. These will go through the pressure barrel first, and then, if there is a willing 450 NE owner in the Boise area, I can adjust for regulation.

Then it will be on to work up North Fork loads. These will be safest of all, due to the bore-riding bullet design.

Any and all help will be appreciated. The reward will be a few packets of production ammunition.

Loads utilizing RL-15 and/or Varget would be most valuable. I have plenty of Kynoch wads to keep everything very safe. Pressure gun first.

Thanking you in advance.

lawndart

You should visit the Double Rifle forum, as the latest and greatest for reloading the NE cartridges is discussed there.

A summary of what I have learned of late:

1) Using smaller volume powders (smaller mass) like RL-15 of course result in less recoil but will require a wad.

2) Kynoch and other wads will increase peak pressures.

3) Assuming Graeme Wright's pressure data is correct for other rifles, there seems little reason to re-invent the wheel. His 3rd edition provides sufficient pressure data for the 450 NE, in my opinion, except for your bullet of choice, the NF.

4) Wright's data using H-4350 shows about the lowest peak pressure for the velocities obtained. To get the velocity at a lower peak pressure means that the downstream pressure is higher, shifted down the barrel, which hopefully won't be a problem.

(I am mostly interested in the greatest velocity I can get at the lowest peak pressure. So I am biased for the lowest peak pressure data).

4) The use of 93 to 95 gr. of H-4350, per Wright's data, fills up the 450 case, almost anyway, with 450 gr. NF FPS's. Close enough for leaving out the wad, in my opinion.

5) To get velocity you have to have pressure. I do not have any pressure data for the NF FPS bullet but I don't think you can get any magical velocity with them without the resultant high pressure. This is seen in Wright's data in the differences between the soft and solid Woodleigh bullets. Forcing a hard solid bullet down the barrel to a specified velocity requires more pressure than for a soft bullet. Whether this absolutely applies to the NF bullet I cannot say as they are probably somewhere in between a soft and solid; would be my guess anyway.

A possible way to tell is to compare the velocity results if someone has been shooting Woodleigh softs and NF solids of the same weights in the same gun and with the same powder and charge. If the velocities are about the same then the pressures are about the same and the NF would be no worse than the Woodleigh soft, pressure wise. But I don't think that is generally true.

Maybe someone will jump in with a comparison(s). That might be a worthwhile result of your pressure data.

6) To get the most worthwhile "commercial" ammunition it would seem that trying to duplicate the original Kynoch data would be most useful, so that the old guns would regulate with your new ammunition. What duplicate results are for bullets not weighing 480 grains as in the original cartridges is a question mark for me. Maybe 450 NE No2's 75% rule would apply here, i.e., keeping the powder and charge the same regardless of the bullet weight.

If I have strayed from the gospel I hope someone jumps in.

Best of luck with your project.

I used 87 gr. RL 15 with a 480 gr. Woodleigh soft.

85 gr RL 15 with a 480 gr. Woodleigh solid.

Yes, filler with all.

Good luck!

Thank you both for your replies. Especially thank you Will for much fodder for thought. I will likely favor an early pressure peak as the barrels are thicker closer to the chamber, but it may not make any difference. I have some large bore rifle pressure peaks for 4831 and RL-15 superimposed on each other. No real difference as to position up or down barrel.

Once I have a selected starting point for the N/Fs, I will try these in a few rifles to figure out which charge results in good regulation - and then we are at the destination.

I will try both RL-15 and 4350.

Thank you both, very much.

LD

Lawndart. Here are some of my loads that regulate very well in my M.K Owen 450x 3 1/4:
84 grs. RL15 for both Woodleigh 480 SP and 480 FMJ
86 grs. RL15 500 grain Swift
95 grs. IMR4831 Woodeligh 480 SP
Peter.

Here's one Varget load for you
77.5 gr. Varget
215 primer
Foam wad
Woodleigh 480 soft

R1 2129 fps
L1 2096 fps
R2 2120 fps
L2 2108 fps
Good luck
Raff

Many thanks guys,

I have boxer primed brass, and now I received some Berdan primed Kynoch brass. I will load up both. These old British primers came in a tin filled with some primers and a lot of sawdust-too cool.