This weekend I finally got around to shooting my Brand New 9.3X64 Brenneke. I built it two weeks ago out of a bunch of parts mostly because there are a buch of knowledgeable people on this site who revere this cartridge alot. The receiver is a much abused FN with an old Canjar trigger. The Barrel is a 26 inch long #5 from Pac-NOR and I have to say was some of the most beautiful stainless steel I've ever machined. I installed a Vais muzzel break and used a target crown on the barrel. The threads were absolutely beautiful and the chamber was so clean I hesitated to even Emory it. The reamer came from JGS and produced a mirror finish. Stock was from Boyds and was a real disappointment ( cheap wood and a crappy finish). It didn't help that it came with a #1 barrel contour and I had to do alot of work to open it up for the Pac-Nor barrel. Unfortunately, when I steelbedded the action, the cheap FN potmetal bottom metal broke so I used the bottom metal from a Turkish Mauser( which fitted really well).Turkish Mauser bottom metal is really good stuff and doesn't have to be welded up to look good. The bolt had to be opened a bit for the 9.3X64 brass which I got from Buffalo Arms.This brass is made from 458 Win Mag brass with the belt turned off and a new Rim turned into the brass. I was only able to get one box of RWS brass, but the Buffalo Arms stuff works fine. Scope is a Leupold vari-XIII 2-8 in QD Warne Rings mounted as low as possible. Bases are steel Warne. First loads were 69 grs of RL-15 and a Nosler 250 gr BT bullet. I used these to break in the barrel. They were way too hot,giving sticky bolt lift and after two reloads opening the primer pocket. Interestingly,they hit 2920 on my Oeler Chrono and shot a 1" and 1.3 inch group at 100 yrds. I backed off the load to 66, then 63 grs of RL-15 and the same Nosler BT, this gave 2820 and 2720fps and both loads shot three 1 hole groups essentially to the same point of impact(63 grs-1 inch low).I settled on the 63 gr load as after five reloads a case still had a tight primer pocket and the cases showed no evidence of sticky bolt lift. We spent the weekend shooting the gun off-hand at various targets out to 300 yrds. It was great fun and recoil was about like a .338 Win mag. It is extremely accurate! It is very interesting to me that Saeed got over 2940 FPS from his gun with about 73 grs of RL-15 and a 250 Woodleigh. Thus, I was very suprised to see 2920 with my 69 gr. load. I wonder if the difference was due to the Nosler bullet,different lots of powder and/or the Buffalo Arms cases. Nevertheless, it was too hot for my gun. Significantly,you just have to be impressed with something that can get this close to the performance of a 338 ultramag or 340WBY with the same bullet weight. This from a cartridge that will feed flawlessly from a std short magazine. My conclusion is that this cartridge is everything that has been said about it. I would not hesitate to use it on Buff.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
Good for you, it sounds like a nice rifle / cartridge combo.
One question, did you check the water capacity of the Buffalo Arms brass vs. the RWS brass? You may find that the internal capacity of the Buff Arms brass is smaller than stock RWS brass due to case thickness of the .458 win.
Posts: 694 | Location: Des Moines, Iowa, USA | Registered: 09 January 2001
We need a rule in this forum that you cannot build a rifle & tell us about it without posting a photo of same.I don't like to be teased. Kinda like reading a Playboy magazine & not getting to enjoy the fold out! Doug
------------------ NRA Life member
[This message has been edited by Bear Claw (edited 03-11-2002).]
Posts: 8351 | Location: Jennings Louisiana, Arkansas by way of Alabama by way of South Carloina by way of County Antrim Irland by way of Lanarkshire Scotland. | Registered: 02 November 2001
Rodgunbuilder, try Varget. I have had good success with it in my 9.3x64. Hogdon says it's too slow but I had better results with it as far as pressure than R15. For serious work try the 286 Barnes-X. Awesome performance! Glad to hear you've joined the 9.3 club!
Daryl- Thanks for the info. I'm impressed to say the least! What load do you suggest? I have had good results with varget before in other calibers,but never any luck with barnes X Bullets.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
Robgunbuilder, approach these loads with caution, please. My M70 chamber has the typical European free-bore and thus may not let pressures develop to an unsafe level. With the Barnes X I topped out at 65.0 grains of Varget with RWS brass, WLRM primers: they clocked at 2500fps and were mild, but then again the Barnes X are quite sticky and hard to push so I kept it so. I have also worked up to 72(!) grains of Varget with the Speer 270 using RWS brass and WLRM primers. Hot! They clocked at 2800fps. With the Nosler 286 Partition I got up to 69 grains of Varget but it's too hot! No real problems but 67 grains is OK. 69 grains clocked at 2750fps. This is with a 25" bbl. Varget, as you know, is supposed to be temp stable; these loads were tested at about 20 degrees Celsius. I got less than 1" 3 shot groups with the hot Nosler load @ 100 yds. Very tempting, but be cautious! I would really like to try some of the B-Tips(250gr.). Good luck!
[This message has been edited by Daryl Elder (edited 03-12-2002).]
I'll post some pictures soon! Daryl- Thanks for the load info. My Reamer has a very short throat and I expect this contributes to the high pressures I ran into well before others.Nevertheless, this is a real screamer of a cartridge and has caused me to re-think some things.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
Its my understanding the 376 Steyr is based on the 9.3x64 case, albiet slightly shorter. The question I have is, with wanting a 376 built, is did you have to do much feed rail work to make it feed properly? The action I'm using is a 30-06 Howa. hanks. ~~~Suluuq
To get the 9.3X64 to work in my FN Mauser action I had to open the boltface up slightly. The stock boltface was for a 30-06 and the 9.3X64 has a rim dimension intermediate between that of the 30-06 and that of the .532 win mag. You might get lucky and have sufficient slop in yours so as not to require machining. It only took about five minutes with a file to get it to feed. The stock extractor worked beautifully and did not require any modification at all as did the magazine follower.Neither did it require any ramp work. The 9.3X64 is a really interesting cartridge and I'll bet with a little bit of freebore, you can come within a hairs breath of a 340 WBY or .338 ultramag performance. Buffalo Arms has solved the brass problem and hopefully more people will try this thing. It's something else in a cheap M-98!-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
Robgunbuilder and all, Thanks for sharing with us all this thread. I have a 9.3x64 next on the list as well. I have some questions I thought I'd throw out for you now that yours is built and for others who have 9.3x64 rifles as well.
1) What is a comfortable weight for a 9.3x64 express type rifle - assuming it's fitted with a good buttpad? ...8.5 lbs OK?
2) What is a preferred barrel length? I would think that since this is such an efficient case that a long 26" barrel is not required unless it is for proper balance of the rifle. I'm 6'4" with a "generous" neck, so this might help balance the rifle better due to my requirement of a long LOP, but generally I prefer a 24" barrel.
I can only tell you what I have chosen on my '64. It has a 23,6" Lothar-Walter barrel with 1/12 twist. It's about 9,2 lbs heavy. You might want to consider a rather straight stock, it kicks a bit harder than a 30-06. It also has a medium size kick pad. I have not tried it in the chrono yet, so I can't give any velocity with this barrel.
As a said, this is what I have done. I'm not an expert on rifles, but I like this one very much.
I wanted max velocity so I went for a 26 inch barrel. The gun weighs about 8.5 lbs and with the muzzel break recoil is certainly no problem. My son shot this last weekend and he's 5'11. Most people think the balance is not bad, however, I used a number 5 contour barrel and it balances just over the receiver.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
I just got back from SCI Dallas yesterday and am still unpacking and I took my new 9.3x62 Sauer that I just re-stocked to show around to some of you and some oil tycoon from cajun land turned me into a whore and now he owns my lovely rifle...
A piece of advise on the 9.3x64 is to never use magnum primers which I have a hunch Robingunbuilder is doing with that 69 gr. load of RL-15.
I found RL-15 the best powder in the 9.3x62 but for the 9.3x64 you need a faster powder and H or IMR 4895 proved the winner with IMR-4320 close behind..
Ray- I read your earlier post and was using Fed-210's.I suspect the high pressures were due to the brass and short throat. Sure shoots well though. Unfortunately I can't get my pictures to upload on the server.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
Buffalo Arms has 9.3X64 made from 458 win Mag brass. It works fine! Using their brass as an example, I was also able to make some of my own on my Lathe but it was not easy. The belt has to come off, the rim needs to be turned down and then thinned, rebated sligthly and a new extractor groove machined into the brass at the correct angle and depth. You then have to neck it down using .416 and.375 dies until finishing with the .366 dies.-Rob
Posts: 6314 | Location: Las Vegas,NV | Registered: 10 January 2001
I order my brass either from Parabellum or if you live near Oslo Jaktpartner have these brass in stock. Parabellum takes 231,- kroner for a box of 20, and Jaktpartner I think will charge you about 245,-. It's RWS brass, and my experience is that they are very good.
I had my 9.3x62 CZ American rechambered to 64. Shoots and feeds like a dream. I am using 65gr of RL15 with 270gr Speers for shooting paper. For all you guys interested, I have a source for RWS brass. $21 a box delivered directly from Germany. Takes about 4 weeks. I had difficulty using the brass from Buffalo Arms. Full length sized with my CH4 dies, I could not get them to chamber. No problems with the RWS stuff. Cobalt
Cobalt,I have tried to e-mail you and it returned undeliverable. I am interested in buying 10-20 boxes RWS 9.3x64 brass. I am also in need of RWS 404 Jeffery brass and would make a very large order if they have it. Please contact me at lb404@mmcable.com 405-794-6172 Thanks, lb404
I bought about 200 cases of RWS from the Old Western Scrounger, you know dangerous Dave about 6 months ago...but sold it with the rifle...He had plenty at the time for about $26.00 per box as I recall.
I built a beatifull 9.3x64 with a laminated Turkish walnut stock, exhibition walnut on the outside...26" barrel and a Mauser action...man it was one nice rifle, but I weakened and sold it too...
the 9.3x64 is the best all around rifle in the world and takes the title from the 375 H&H because it is actually more powerfull and more versitile...and thats no light praise of the 9.3x64 she is traveling in some pretty heavy company there....
