I hunted with a friend's 416 Rigby which had a mercury tub recoil reducer installed in the stock. The recoil was quite managable. I am now considering the purchase of my first big bore rifle. Who makes mercury tubes, can they safely and effectively be installed in a wood stock, and are there any downsides?

Check Brownells (www.brownells.com), they list 3 or 4 brands and several sizes and weights.

Yes, they can be used in a wood stock.

Downside - extra weight. They usually weigh between 8 and 13 oz.

I just bought one by Break-O. It's 4" long, 7/8" in diameter and weighs 13 oz. I am building a 470 Capstick and plan to put it in the stock.

http://www.98.net/chr/indexhpc.htm

Will custom make any practical length with diameter up to 1 1/16".

I feel they contribute to recoil reduction while others think that they just add weight. I think there not a bad idea, I have a .416 without them and I am thinking I could add some at some stage to.

Can these tubes be installed so they are easily removed?

It would be great to have it in during load development/practice, then remove when it comes time to lug the rifle over the hills.

Tim

Sure, they install so that a 1/4 x 28 bolt will screw in the back. Your gunsmith can install it so it'll be removable.

Hi Gents,
If you installed a Pachmayer Triple X recoil pad on the rifles you've described you would do more to tame recoil than any mercury recoil reducer could offer. The bonus is no added weight and you can always leave it there. The model is the F990 and it's listed in Brownells also.
Take good care and the best of luck with your new rifles.
470 Mbogo

470,

I have three merc reducers in my .585 Nyati they cost me $180AUS for them, I like to think they work mate

HI PC,
What did you install for a recoil pad in conjunction with the Mercury reducers? What is the weight of the three together. Aprox 2.5 lbs. If you haven't aready try the F990 pad and see what you think.

Take care
470 Mbogo

Hi PC,
I just remembered that pictures of your gun were posted and went back to have a look. Nice rifle, one hell of a big hole, try the F990 you'll like it. Will it stay clear enough with the scope or does the scope make you wonder if it's coming your way. I've been going to the Express Sights peep and found out to 100 yds that they are faster and very accurate and it takes that scope possibility out of the picture. Just curious.
470 Mbogo

I always throw this out for what it's worth: it appears to be very much illegal to carry such a device on an aircraft. Liquid mercury is a no-no, because it eats aluminum.

Pertinax

Related to Pertinax's point -- I believe they are sealed, wonder how much pressure is in there? Just thinking how much pressure there ISN'T at 30,000 ft. I've always wondered how much of the recoil reduction is simply due to extra weight.

If you don't like vented recoil pads, look at the F550 Pachmayr. Thick, soft, works very well in my personal experience.

Todd

470,

could not get hold of a xxx pad (none in the country), but the pad I have got on it is very good it is a Pachymeyer but thicker and bigger than the one on my .416, I really like it and with break, pad, merc tubes, it is not that bad to shoot. It fits my shoulder really well, it's curved with a "Pigeon Pattern" on the pad face.

My stock maker feels this pad is as good as the f990, I do not know as I have not tried one yet. I might get one and put it on the .416 one day.

PC.

I too seriously doubt that the Hg tubes do anything other than add weight. I've never heard of anyone doing a blind comparison to see if they could tell the difference, but I'll bet there is none, or very very little. I would expect the manufacturers to trumpet to the high heavens the effectiveness discovered in such a blind test, but they do not. That causes me to keep my money in my pocket.

Just add some lead. It's much cheaper, and adding a couple of pounds will definitely help. Or add a bigger scope, etc. Getting the mass up will help dramatically.

Pertinax

Please Pertinax, let me live my dream

well, for slow recoiling rifles, less effect than fast recoil, ie 505 gibbs vs 460 weatherby, as the fraction of time the mercury is "moving forward" is less. I imagine it "takes the edge off" the sharp felt recoil of the 460 but less so of the long push of the 505.

In some respects I would have liked to shoot my .585 w/o merc tubes then with them to see if there is a diff.

Well PC, to really learn anything, you'll need to compare the gun with Hg tubes against the rifle with an equal amount of weight added. There's no question about the weight helping. The issue is whether the mercury sloshing around really does anything extra.

I understand why it might work. After all, we're all familiar with the felt-recoil reduction benefits of the bolt or slide moving in semi-automatic firearms. However, I'm skeptical that some magic property of a liquid causes a noticable difference. Why, for example, would a chunk of lead on a spring not be equally effective? It moves too, and would increase the time over which the recoil is spread. But that's a cheap solution, and not mysterious like the mercury tubes.

Just my opinion. I have _NOT_ tried them. But I'm skeptical.

Pertinax

Generally those chunks of lead have springs on both ends. Once they compress the spring they'll bounce back. Too, the lead is not free to move like the liquid is, since there is a certain resistance to the spring you'll need to begin moving it far and fast enough for there to be any benefit.
I am slowly getting my .500 A-Square stock ready for the repairing of the crack in it. Would this be a suitable test mule for you? I think it recoils hard enough and far enough. I also have one of the reducers here and will install it, then go shoot it, take it out and shoot it.
I am not looking forward to this since to remove the reducer and the scope will place me in the position I was when I first bought the thing. Ouch!
11.25 pounds is not enough to take the bite out.

They weaken the stock of a big bore rifle..They spoil the balance of any rifle....add that much weight to any rifle and it effects recoil....These guns become too heavy to hunt with and handle effectively...If one needs one on his rifle he is then overgunned and should get a lighter caliber....It proves to me that their is a sucker born every minute...

Sorry if I ticked you user off, but that's how I feel about them..and that's why I shoot a 404,416 etc as opposed to a 505....

It is interesting that Ray feels that the Mercury Recoil reducers hurt the gun balance and I feel that it helps. This is probably because Ray has longer arms than I do. I feel that they do help tame the recoil. Wheither it is due solely to the weight or not, they work.

I have one in my 458 Lott, my son's 7-08 Winchester Compact Classic, and a 30-06 Winchester Supergrade. I have an identical 30-06 Supergrade without one and the difference is noticable. The balance on all three guns "feels" much better to me. Once again, that is my personal opinion.

With all of that being said, I just killed my first Buffalo last week with my Lott. The Lott weigh right at 11 lbs. We stalked the herd for nearly 3 miles in 110 degree heat. After the first two shots (both would have proven fatal if we waited), I was on a 400+ yard sprint firing as many rounds to stop him before he hit the thick stuff. I fired 9 rounds total and the weight nor the recoil was noticed.

I have thought about these recoil reduction systems quite a bit. The Dead Mule, Mercury, or Muzzle Brakes are best suited for the range because you will never notice the recoil when shooting at game. But they do have their place. Most people should spend more time at the range becoming proficient with their rifle. If it takes some form of reduction system to help them along, then so be it. Ray really likes the Muzzle Brakes at the range then capping them off in the field. He may be on to something.

[ 10-10-2002, 02:28: Message edited by: Longbob ]

Ray,

Building .505's or .585's or whatever is no different to the bloke who builds a car with a big block in it. I also own a .416 which is in my eyes a more practical rifle. If we were all the same Ray it would be a bloody boreing world/forum

I hate muzzle brakes. At the range, they are as annoying as someone with a 45 auto next to you, with hot brass flying all over.

Last week some bloke with a 308 lazzaruni warburd was shooting on hte adjacent bench and the side blast was obnoxious. Couldnt move tables cause there was a waiting line for access. But it did obviously help him, and his synthetic rifle was amazingly accurate.

His velocities were 4something. and the 200 yard targets I peeked at were tite indeed. But still an obnoxious neighbor, even with foam plugs and muffs on.

seems like a mercury reducer would be better for everyone else around..

roger,
i do not have any experience with the reducer but to make your comparison apples to apples an equal weight of whatever should be used in place of the removed tube or anywhere on the rifle.

we figure that the tube is half empty (or half full, depending upon your optimism). Then, under recoil, the rifle moves rearward and the mercury "fills" the end of the tube (before is was laying horizontal, with the tube empty above it along the length). So, in effect, for a moment, it is as if the weight increased by 1.5x.

So,for 1lb. tube, effectively adds 0.5lb. however, once the tube is "filled" on the end, then goes back to 1lb weight for the remaining end of the peak recoil rearward, then starts back.

Well, 0.5lb (and not even there for the full recoil period) added to 10lb rifle, for 80ft.lbs recoil, is only 5% or 4ftlb. reduction. For me, it would probably be a pyschological improvement in felt recoil and i would just add the extra 0.5lb as a fixed weight and not worry about any effect due to "moving parts".

Steve,

I can see what you are saying, I will do that.

I wonder how effective the mercury would be when hunting in the mountains or hills.

It seems like aiming up/down would change the position of the liquid, causing the recoil reduction effect to change also.

Sumbuddy who knows????

Rick.

Rick,
now your really complicating the issue

I hate sissy slots, and weight is the best next alternative

And, to get used to a big'in, they are a good way to start.

I have offered anyone with a mod 70 in 416 to borrow my original stock with one in it, and then to put lead in it, and see.

jeffe

yep. shooting straight up would be twice the effect and straight down, only the weight of the mercury.

i guess another way to reduce body recoil movement is to stand back to back with a good hunting buddy, opposite handed, fire at the same time. No body movement, only sore, sore shoulder.

There are a couple of situations here. One is a usable hunting rifle that can be packed all day and the other a hot rod to take to the range and impress people with. To have a usable hunting rifle I would think that 11 lbs. is about the max and 10 to 10.25 is about right up to a 500 A-Square or equivilent. Lets say the high 90's to low 100 ft lbs of recoil. If your adding mercury recoil reducers there is a point where your rifle steps from hunting use to range use and once you've made the change it doesn't really matter what you do to it. It's just for fun. To stay in the hunting section your looking at trying to keep the weight down and staying with a good stock design along with a good recoil pad to help keep the rifle shootable. My new 470 weighs in at 10.25 lbs and is very managable to shoot. The 10.25 lbs. is just the weight of all the materials neccessary. The recoil can be handled with practice. The big thing is good design so that the stock doesn't really hurt you which will effect your shooting. To respect the power you should feel the power but not get injured by it. I hate muzzle brakes also and would rather put up with more recoil than noise or weight.
Take good care,
470 Mbogo

470,

I totally agree with you, my "powerful hunting rifle" is a .416 Rigby which weigh's 10 pounds, and it has a good stock and recoil is controllable. My .585 on the other hand is insome respects my stunt gun, and while I will hunt with it the hunting situations will be different in respects of distance from the veichle I will go with it. The .585 hunting application would be as follows; were driving along and we see a patch of lignum or scrub we want to check out so we stop 1km from it and proceed to walk through, if any more walking than this was involved and I needed alot of power I would definitely opt for the .416. But that does not mean my .585 will not see use on game, the only times I will shoot targets with it is for load developement or scope zeroing. The rest of my shots will be at game. To give you an idea I have fired 30 shots from my .585 and 12 or 13 have been for testing and zeroing and the rest have been shot at game, I will not shoot at targets other than to check zero every now and then.