The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Win 375 H&HGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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On Saturday, after months of trying to justify the purchase of a big bore gun, I bought a Winchester Model 70 Classic Super Express chambered for the 375 H&H. This gun has been fired and carries some nicks on the stock forward of the bolt and also on the fore end. No marks anywhere on the metal. I plan to mount a Leupold 1.5x5 in some ouick disconnect rings and maybe change out factory open sights with a more visible type. Looking for advise and recomendations on rings, bases, new open sights, brass, bullets (brand & weight for practice), loads, and any other info you think will be helpful. I have already reviewed the loads from the loading pages on this site. An African hunt, or for that matter a western hunt, at my age is not going to happen but I have always wanted a big bore gun and now I have one. I'm one happy man and look forward to shooting it soon. Chief. P.S. Have pictures but unable to post them. | ||
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Chief, The answers to all those questions can be yours by using the 'Find' button above. As for posting photos, see this thread. George  | |||
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George, Thanks for the link on how to post pictures and I'll check out the find button. Chief. | |||
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I wasn't trying to discourage responses to your post, but those questions have been asked and answered many times before. George | |||
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nothing wrong with asking. we can all learn a few things, by reading new postings. I suggest Leupold quick release bases and rings Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum | |||
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I second hikerbum on the Leupold quick release rings and bases, that's what I've got on my M70 .375 and have been very happy with them. As far as the scope itself, while I think the Leupold 1.5-5 is as good as it gets for a big bore rifle, I would encourage you to consider something with a little more magnification on a .375. I put a 2.5-8 on mine and think you'll find that or a 1.75-6 might help you take advantage of the .375's versatility. Check Midway, Brownells, or NECG for your sights, and you can get resonably priced bullets from Hornady and Sierra. Good luck and good shootn'. | |||
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With the Leupold mounts keep in mind that they have the cross slot weaver style and a type where there is a post or stud on the bottom ring. This post or stud has a section scalloped out where the lever cams the ring down and forward. I like these rings very much and have used them on 375, 378 and 460. There cane be confusion at times when "quick release" is used for Leupold. Also, when ordering your mounts make sure you specify M70 375 as the hole spacing on the rear of the action is different to the standard M70 Mike | |||
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In regard to rings/bases for your Model 70, have a look at these: http://www.jeffsoutfitters.com/store.aspx?panel=3&productid=444&categoryid=99 They are a copy of the EAW quick release mounts, with 1" rings. I purchased a set myself, and can vouch for them being well constructed. Exactly what your rifle needs. Garrett | |||
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Chief, I've got the same rifle and will be picking it up this weekend from Roger Ferrell. It's been to him for some of the same work you want to do to yours. The list includes full length bedding w/ S.S. pillars, polishing the bolt and receiver for smoothness, ensuring proper feeding, Williams Oberndorf bottom metal, metal grip cap, NECG banded front sight, NECG adjustable rear sight, Talley barrel band swivel, new decelerator pad, etc... I'll try to post some pics this weekend or next week, if I can figure out how. Needless to say, I'm exicted to get it back. As to QR rings, I went with Talley. You'll probably need to call Gary at Talley and get his 1/4" extended front base. I had to use to mount my VX-III 2.5-8, and it's still tight. But these should work just fine with the 1.5-5 or the 1.75-6 as well. All these scopes are fairly short for a .375 length action. Good luck and I'll get those pictures up ASAP. David | |||
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I too have a Win safari express in .375 H&H. I am considering strongly a 2.5-10x24 NXS from Nightforce. The only reticle worth using(my opinion) is the FC-2. Anybody have experience with these scopes or specifically this one? Andy We Band of Bubbas N.R.A Life Member TDR Cummins Power All The Way Certified member of the Whompers Club | |||
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I use and like the Leupold QRs on my M70 in 375. I recommend redrilling and tapping using 8x40 screws to mount it though. Your scope choice is fine, as are many others depending on what you want to do with it. Mine won't be going to Africa but will get its use in US. | |||
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I'd also recommend the talley's over the leupold QR. The QR leupold rear base overhangs the rear of the ejection port which I don't like as it could interfere with loading if one got excited. The talley's don't have that overhang. You won't need the extension base with a 1.5x5 or 1.75x6 Leupold. The 2.5x8 is a very short scope, better suited to short actions in my opinion. The 1.5x5 or 1.75x6 have a larger ring mounting surface and don't need the extension base. I have a 1.75x6 on my M70 .375 H&H stainless in talley mounts and there's plenty of room. | |||
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+1 for the Leupold 1.5-5 in Leupy QR rings. But this year I switched it out for a 2x7 Leupold and designated the 1.5x5 the spare. ______________________ RMEF Life Member SCI DRSS Chapuis 9,3/9,3 + 20/20 Simson 12/12/9,3 Zoli 7x57R/12 Kreighoff .470/.470 We band of 9,3ers! The Few. The Pissed. The Taxpayers. | |||
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Many thanks for your replies. They are certainly appreciated. Ordered the Leupold two pc bases and the stud type rings to mount my VariX-III 1.5x5 scope from my 338-06. Checked out the Talley's and the EWS copies but picked the Leo's because there standard mounts have worked well for me in the past. Not going to change the open sights at this time, probably wouldn't help anyway because of these old eyes. Have a clean gun, a box of Remington 270gr SP factory, waiting on the mounts to arrive so I can shoot this week end. Keep you posted on the results. David: Good luck with your Super Express. I'm sure it will shoot great with all the mods you have done. I do know how excited you are and look forward to seeing pics of the gun and targets. I'm going to wait until I see how my gun shoots before making any changes. I will keep your suggestions in mind. See George's thread above for instructions on posting pictures. Its very informative. Mike: Your recommendation of redrilling and tapping to use 8x40 screws is one I will consider. As a side note I spent a lot of time snowmobiling in the Warren, McKean Co area during the 70's & 80's. Kinzua dam, Jack's rock Hearts Content, the old Kinzua bridge, and to the Westline for dinner and drinks. Great memories. Don't ride any more, too old, but still hunt some in McKean Co. Mostly now I hunt around Emporium in Cameron Co. | |||
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The chief This is a beautiful area, and you didn't even mention the fishing which is my main reason for being in the area. Smiths's Custom Guns in Warren converted my rifle and bases for $40 a couple of years ago. I thought that a reasonable price for the benefits received. | |||
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Chief, My biggest concern would be feeding with second being bedding. The 375 probably won't be enough recoil to cause you any stock splitting problems, but I like all of them bedded. Mine didn't fed fairly well, but the bolt travel was a little rough. It was also flattening one side of the case mouth on hard ejections. Roger polished everything and checked it all for feeding. Said he may change the follower/mag spring to a flat based spring instead of the bent one that came in it. I expect this would allow 4 down with no problem. It would hold 4 before, but wouldn't cycle well loaded that way. Your scope choice is spot-on as far as I'm concerned. The 1.5-5 or the 1-4 VX-II will be my back up scope for the 375. I'm taking the 416 as my primary for buffalo and plan to use the 375 for plains game. It's a bit much for most PG, but perfect backup should the 416 go down. I have the Leupy QR's on my 300 Wby and they do a fine job. Have yet to shoot loose with well over 100 rounds through it in the past year. I'd rather have they're QRW rings as they appear to be a little stronger built, but again, with the 375 it probably won't matter. David | |||
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I agree completely. I have the Safari Classic in the LH version with the Leupold QR mounts and they have served me well with the small scope in Africa. Also took a Saskatchewan whitetail with it just because I could.  But if I had it to do over again, I would buy a slightly more powerful scope because of the caliber's versatility. And I might go with the Talleys because of that rear mount overhang. I'm used to it, though and was able to reload rapidly in Africa when circumstances required. It just takes a bit of getting used to. Good luck with your rifle. With some good handloads, it's a cheap, fun rifle to shoot. I take mine out at least once a week, sometimes more, according to how ambitous I get on the reloading bench. I shoot Hornady 270 & 300's almost exclusively, and they are quite accurate but do leave some copper behind, so a good copper cleaner like Barnes CR 10 is a necessity. Just don't leave any in the bore for long. | |||
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I have had perfect performance using Nosler 260 Gr. Accubond and Swift 270 Gr. A-frames for all N. American hunting. WYLD | |||
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Mike, please post or send me the phone number foe Smiths Custom Guns in Warren. His price for the drilling and tapping is reasonable and I may want to discuss some of the mods David suggested,if necesary, with him. Also Mike, assuming that you reload, what brand of dies do you recommend for this caliber and is neck sizing a good option for practice loads? I do full length my hunting loads but prefer to neck size my varmint and practice rounds. Boltman: Thanks for the information about the rear mount overhang of the Leupolds. I'll see if they cause a problem and if so change. Jetdrvr: Thank you too for your input. I have some Hornady 300 gr RN bullets coming for reloading after I shoot my factory Rem 270 gr cartridges. Since you you shoot the same bullet in your rifle could you please suggest a practice load? | |||
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Cheif, I have the exact same rifle and I love the leupold QR rings and bases. Also use the 1.5-5 leoupold. I glass bedded the stock and it will shoot MOA at 200 yds all day long with 2 loads. I use 79 gr. H4350 and the 300 gr Hornady RN and the same powder charge with the 270 barnes X (original). I have used the hornady bullets on doe antelope to bison with perfect results. I will use the same load on a Kalahari lioness this July. I shot a bunch of plains game with the X bullet and only recoverd one from the eland. All one shot kills. You have a great gun and it is perfect for whitetails or anything else you want to use it for. Congratulations on your new aquisition. | |||
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Chief Tim Smith's number is 814.723.7583. I've used him a number of times and was pleased with his work. I don't know enough about dies, but I always full length resized. I'm not an expert though that's just what has worked for me. My M70 shoots the 260 grain Accubond the best of anything I've tried. The Federal premium load is excellent in my M70. | |||
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Also the Leupold QRs hang over the front of the loading port a bit. Not ideal but it doesn't seem to cause any problems. The M70 action is long and I am particular about getting the scope the right distance from my eye. | |||
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Chief, PM me for any load info. you may need. I've got some pretty goad loads worked up for 300gr. TSX/solid and for the 350 Woodleigh soft/solid. So far everything I've put through this rifle shoots great groups. I put up another post about light practice loads for the 375 and 300gr. using 5744. The response i got was: "Behind 300 grainers, use 45 grains for about 2000fps, 50 grains for about 2200." I've got some loaded to maybe shoot this weekend. I'll post results when I can. David | |||
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I haven't chrono'd these loads, but they shoot MOA for me. For the 270's I use 78 gr. of IMR 4350 with Remington cases and CCI magnum primers. For the 300 grain, I use the same case/primer combo with 76.5 IMR 4350. I've run at least 1100 rounds of the 300 grains through it . Hunting buff amd plains game and whitetail, I use the same 300 grain load with Swift A Frames. I will try some Hornady 235's next deer season. The Remington bulk cases aren't the most expensive, but I average 7 to 8 reloads before I start getting excessive neck wear or other pressure signs. I trimmed to 2.84 and I neck size after initially full-length sizing for practice loads, but full-length size for hunting loads. And IMR 4350 is a clean burning powder and is stable through a wide range of temperatures. These loads are listed as near max in Richard Lee's book for the 270 gr. and max in the Swift manual for the 300 gr., so I suggest you start lower and work your way up. One of these days I'm going to just go speed check this stuff, but since I show no pressure signs in rifle or cartridges, I haven't felt the need. I've loaded lower and gotten poorer accuracy. For example, the 270 grainers didn't shoot well with 76.5 at all. My rifle seems to like the max listed loads for better accuracy, so that is what I use. Hope this helps. | |||
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If you don't ream or lap your rings after mounting them on the rifle, then I suggest Burris "Signature Rings". The ones with the bushing inside the rings that pivots to self aligns the scope tube within the rings. This will prevent the tube scope from acquiring ugly ring rash. I use these Burris Weaver style "Zee Rings" on Weaver "Grand Slam" steel bases on my M70 in 375H&H | |||
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Chief Tim Smith's # is 814.723.7583 He might have some other ideas after he looks at your rifle. | |||
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Get a set of Talley Quick Detachable rings and bases, and Talley makes a clean, neat, little peep sight that will slip on the rear base for a $60 dollar bill. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Hey Chief,is your Win 375H&H action the same size as a Win 300WM action? | |||
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The 1.5X5 leupold is the classic african scope, But in africa , you hunt all day. So there is usually plenty of light. So a 20mm objective won't be a problem. Come back to the states and you likly would profit from the larger objective on th 1.75X6. New england custom gun service has some great backup sights...tj3006 freedom1st | |||
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Mike: Thanks for Tim Smith's phone number will call him for his suggestions and recommendations. Will try the 260 gr Accubond, among others, once I start relonding. Jetdrvr: Appreciate the load data. I'll neck size the once fired Rem brass from the factory loads I've shot with Hornady's 300 gr RN. Greenjoy: I too use the Burris "Signature" Zee rings. They hold my Leupold Vari X-III 6.5x20-50mm - 30mm tube, in Bruce Baer tapered bases on my 7/300 WBY. Work very well. Ray: Thank you for the advise on the Talley QD rings and bases with the peep sight attachment. The peep sight seems like a good idea. However, did purchase the Leupold QR rings and bases, with the post, before your reply, mounted them and shot the gun. So far all is well. I didn't noticr the rear base over hang in the loading port to be a problem. Richard: Both you and Mike suggested the Nosler 260 gr Accubond as a good bullet I will try it in time. Thank you. Mustbhuntin: Will start reloading with the Hornady 300 gr RN I have on hand and see where it leads. Thanks for the info. Shootway: The 375 H&H is a true magnum action,very long, and I think its longer than the 300 Win Mag action. Others would know for sure. I do know both cartridges have the same head size. Thomas: The 1.5x5 Leupold has been on several light short rifles used in the Pa woods during drive and stand hunting. Not ideal but it worked. I agree a 1.75x6 would probably be better but since I had this scope I decided to use it. Will check with the New England Custom Gun Service about their backup sights if I decide to change. Thanks. Once again I thank everyone who gave suggestions and advise. As planned I shot my gun with the Rem 270 gr factory loads on Sat and was extreamly pleased with the accuracy, the trigger, the handling, and, in my opinion, the over all goog looks, of the gun. The factory loads avgeraged 2616 fps at 10 feet from the muzzle. If anyone is interested I'll try to post pictures of the gun and the targets. Chief. | |||
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Gonna try to post pics for the first time. We'll see how it turns out.  NECG Masterpiece front and Talley barrel band.  NECG Masterpiece rear. Note Talley scope base. That's the 1/4" extended front.  Fiber optic front bead. Getting a "ported" hood for it.  Williams 1-piece Orbendorg bottom metal.  Williams 1-piece Orbendorg bottom metal.  Rear sight with warthog ivory insert that Roger added for quicker alignment.  Hope this works. Finger crossed. Enjoy!!!??? David | |||
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Ha!! It actually worked the first time. Beginner's luck, I promise, no skill involved. She just needs a nice piece of wood now. But that's a buff trophy fee, so it'll have to wait, a long time. Enjoy, David | |||
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Nicely done, David. Hope you get the chance to use it for its intended purpose! Wayne E. | |||
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Since David was successful in posting pictures of his rifle on his first attempt I decided to try and post pictures of mine as well. These are pictures of my Mod 70 375 H&H before the scope was mounted and the targets from the first firing. David did say it was "beginners luck no skill involved". We'll see as I have very limited computer skills. Chief.        | |||
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Seems to have worked out just fine. You're really gonna come to love this rifle. David | |||
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I have fancier rifles, but I love that Winchester the most and shoot it often. | |||
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Got to the range to shoot her today. Had some scope adjustment to do, but she's pretty good now. Shot number 1 is a little suspect. I may have light-loaded it. It gave the same velocity as my 71gr. load (H4350) and shot low. The other 4 are in a nice little cluster and had fairly consistent velocity. I'll definitely be doing this again. This is the only group I got to shoot. I was gonna pattern the light load with AA5744, but the first one I shot broke the case just above the belt and left the case in the chamber. Didn't have anything to remove it with me. Any suggestions? I haven't decided if it was a cracked case that slipped thru the cracks, or over pressure. I'm gonna back off a couple grains and work back up to see what's going on. Here's the target:  This was with the Woodleigh 350gr. Round Nose Soft over 72gr. H4350 using a Fed 215 to light it. All rolled in a R-P case. Shot at +/- 40F degrees. Shot the same load last summer at +/- 85F with velocities from 2312-2344 for 10 rounds. David Walker | |||
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Chief, I also used factory Remington 270's to break in my rifle, albiet much cheaper in Dec. 2005 than they are now. I get excellent accuracy from the Hornadys I mentioned, but I would only use a Hornady on whitetail or other thin skinned game. I bought my rifle specifically for a buffalo hunt. I scoped it with the Leupold 1.5-5x20 with Leupy QR rigs and bases and have had nothing but good luck with it. The scope wears a German #4 reticle, which I really like. For Africa, as someone already mentioned, that scope is all you'll ever need. I took plains game with it at 300 yards using factory Remington A Frames, and a decent Selous buff at 100. On my upcoming hunt, I'll be using the same bullet, handloaded. Post pictues if you like. I'm interested. jetdrvr | |||
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