I have come across a Dacron Plus and a Dacron 1. Both by Dupont. So which one is better for loading in my 470 nitro.

Thank you.

this is what Dacron pillow filling I use looks like.


the current bag I am using is "Polyester Filter Fiber" I use it in one of my Saltwater fish tank filters.

Whatever you polyester fiber filler for pillows that you find at a fabric shop should do nicely.

Hope this helps

Thank you Sir. The 2 Dacrons I found are both in pillows. One is the wife's the other the daughter's. They look the same to me. I guess I'd rather have the Daughter mad than the wife .

Yes, Rusty has steered you correctly.
We have hashed this out in the past.
Dacron is just a trade name for a polyester fiber filler ... any polyester pillow stuffing will do well for taking up the air space in the voluminous cases used with faster powders. It's just easier to type the shorter word, and pundits of the past got in the habit of recommending "dacron" as maybe it was the "in" thing at one time, or the hot new trade name for this marvelous technological advancement.

Don't rip up your daughter's pillow or stuffed animal unless they don't mind getting rid of it. You can get a lifetime supply of it for 2 or 3 bucks from the fabric/sewing aisle at most any Wally World type store or a fabric shop.

Use a new wooden pencil (flat/unsharpened end or eraser) or a wooden dowel to stuff it in with.

It is not hard to weigh out 5 grains of the wisps and wad it up into a puff ball to cram into a .470 NE case to hold the RL-15 in place.

Polyester fiber seems to be the approved filler across the board. Nothing special about the "Dacron" name for this purpose. It is polyester.

You will get a snowstorm with each shot, regardless of what Uncle Ray says. He just doesn't notice, since he fought and lived through Custer's Last Stand, and got used to clouds of black powder smoke when he was learning to shoot as a wee lad. The polyester flurry is very minor compared to BP smoke.

I use a household plastic funnel and once I get the stuff started I can pull out a fairly uniform length of filler and cut it with a pair of good sharp scissors. For my rifle I use about a 1-1.2 grain tuft of Dacron.

Here is a link to the "Reloading the Nitro Express" by Ross Seyfried posted on NitroExpress.com
Reloading the Nitro Express

ps RIP
I love the sig "Indians Vow to Endeavor to Persevere"
I see Chief Dan George giving that line in "The Outlaw Josey Wells"!

I have that issue. I had forgotten all about it.

Concerning the Dacron. I asked at several fabrick stores and was told that Dacron is flame retardant but regular Fiber-FDill would melt when exposed to heat. That is why I finally found some Dacron. Not sure if if the melting part is correct but figured better to play is safe.

Thanks again Fellas.

Concerning how much to use. Going through the search funstion I found quite a few people who spoke of 85 grains RL15 with 5 grains of Dacron. Does this sound about right to most of you? Or is the 1-2 grains of Dacron enough?

I loaded some rounds this evening and man 5 grains definately packs everything in tight. Federal brass, federal 215's, 85 grains RL15 and 5 grains of Dacron.

Any advice and input is welcomed. TRhank you.

Rusty,
Ray is actually the original Josey Wales, gone to Texas in 1865 with Red Legs chasing him out of Missouri. Had something to do with molesting mules in MO, but Ray did good, eventually, even became a Union soldier and stood beside Custer when he got Siouxed. Humble hero that he is, he doesn't dwell on his heroic past, would probably deny some of his adventures way back then ...

outlawsix,
The flame retardant issue is no big deal. The WalMart pillow stuffing, polyester fiber fill, is flame retardant too. There has been progress since the 1929 to 1950 birthing of Dacron. Of course, Dupont wants everyone to think that Dacron is still very special.

You will see any of the polyester fiber fills, including Dacron, blown out of the barrel unchanged.

Josey, er, uh, Ray uses 5 grains. Ross recommends 5 grains for the .470 NE and 4 grains for the .450 NE, IIRC.

It is good to have it packed tight. The object is to get rid of any compressible air space and to keep the powder packed tight against the primer for uniform ballistics.

Your current recipe is the universal starting load for the .470 NE with standard 500 grain bullets. It ought to get you over 2000 fps and see if it is close to the regulated load for the rifle.

You will get much more out of the exercise by chronographing.

I now much prefer 109 to 110 grains of H4831SC Extreme (the new one that is a short cut grain, extruded powder). George Hoffman recommended it in the past, when it was the old long cut form of H4831 (Thanks jjs.). This is now "The George Hoffman Memorial .470 NE Load."

I think that 1 to 1.2 grains of polyester fluff might top this (H4831 110 grains) off well instead of the 3/16" thick foam wad I used last. There is only a wee bit of air space left in the H4831SC load.

I might not even notice the snow from 1 grain of polyester. Just like Josey, er, uh, Ray!

Edited to correct the inadvertent substitution of H4350.

George Hoffman Memorial Load: H4831SC 109 to 110 grains in the .470 NE.

Outlaw,
The Dacron I use is not consumed in the firing, rather spat out the barrel. It looks like you could reload it again.

As far as load use the formula in the article.
that is 1.19 times the original cordite load your rifle was regulated for, and substitute RL-15.
I have a 55 cord rifle so my load is 1.19X55 =65.45 grains of RL-15. I backed off that to 63 grains when I first started working up the load. I now use 65 grains of RL-15.

Just work up a load that your rifle likes and regulates with.

You can contact me at rkmojo@aol.com if I can be of service!

RIP:

Not H4350 but H4831sc!!!! Did you forget already...109 to 110 grains of H4350 may be a bit heavy a charge...somewhat faster burn rate than H4831sc!!! So RIP post "George Hoffman" load is 109 to 110 of H4831sc!!! not H4350!!

Oops, big brain fart! Thanks! I got H4350 on the brain from upcoming "other" loads. Gotta go correct that fiasco. I was running low on caffeine at that point ...
Thanks again, jjs. I'm awake now.

The formula for IMR4831 is 1.33x the cordite load...

The formula for RL-15 is 1.19 x the cordite load...

Using not enough dacron will ring your barrel on ocassion, and a good double is down the tube..a good solid pack of dacron is needed, and when you shoot a buffalo it will eigher look like a snow storm just hit or you can pick up the plug and shoot it again!

RIP, get it right...I was never a damn Union Soldier, I was a Texas Ranger scout for the confederacy!!..I'm a red stater, believe in God, Apple Pie and motherhood.. In Idaho we still say the pledge of Alligience in our schools, along with the Lords prayer at our Rodeos, and shoot folks that disagree with us, and the supreme court means little to anyone locally then think its the judge that finds them guilty for running our stop sign!! ...

Ray,
Thanks for the correction of that fanciful biography of yours. You are a celebrity, and tongues will wag, don't you know. A truthful autobiography is called for to set the record straight, so get to work on that book, please.

Here is how the ".470 Nitro Express George Hoffman Memorial Load" shoots at 50 yards in my Merkel 140-2 using the 50 meter leaf:
H4831SC 109.0 grains


Truth be known, the peak pressures are much lower with H4831SC, though the peak may be farther down the barrel. It is slower than IMR4831, but not much.

RL-15 and Dacron only in antiques??? But settle for something like 2050 fps with 500 grainers in the .470 NE, to keep pressures below 40Kpsi???

I would not shoot an antique anyway, but if I "had to" I would stick with the 85 grain RL-15 and 5 grains of polyester fiber fill load.

It would seem that any arguments against H4831SC in an antique rifle would apply to IMR4831 as well.

Anyway, a stout new rifle like the Merkel 140-2 in .470 NE has no frailties, no worries with any reasonable load, stopping around 2150 fps with 500 grainers.

And how is it that Federal factory loads with all that air in them do not ring barrels? Sure the primer is a special hot one called the F216, but is that enough?

If I may butt in? What rings from air in a cartridge? I thought that was a problem with fillers? I'm loading down a 458 and now you have me worried.
Good group above, was that starting with clean barrels? :-)
JL

JAL,
I do not understand the "barrel/chamber ringing" that Ross Seyfried hinted was due to plastic foam filler wads. He dropped that little bomb and skeedaddled without ever explaining his thinking.

Could a packing foam filler liquify and act as an incompressible hydraulic fluid hammer???

I do not understand any "ringing" due to excessive airspace, unless it is related to a detonation type phenomenon.

The Federal factory loads can be erratic, and that is a fact.

Dacron/polyester fiber filler is supposed to be safe.

If I use a 3/16" thick foam wad in a 96% density load just to eliminate the powder shake in my case, it must surely be harmless. One grain of Dacron should do the same, assuming 5 grains takes care of an 80% load in the same case.

The group above was through barrels that had been fouled.

I get all my Dacron from the checkpoint at the border between Idaho and Oregon halfway between my house and Jordan Valley. Before we let any of the California folks in who have driven up on route 95 we make them eat a cheeseburger and wear a fur coat until they finish. Some refuse and get sent back south. Some complete the task and are passed on through. A fair number fall over dead from the shock of red meat entering their system for the first time.
We ship the bodies back south. To pay the freight charges we sell their hybrid cars to the ding-dongs in Sun Valley. We go through their luggage and pockets of course. A lot of them have those Patagonia brand pile jackets made out of the "post consumer marketing/recycled synthetic fabric). We have discovered that a plug cut out of those jackets with a sharpened 470 NE case is just the right weight and thickness for loading your favorite double rifle.
That checkpoint has proven to be a reliable sourch of income and entertainment for our county. The only problem so far has been with one guy who was moving up from walnut Creek, California. He tried to smuggle a sheep into Idaho in the back of his Toyota Prius. Due to a scheduling screw-up there were two Basque guards on duty that day. They confiscated the ewe and immediately started fighting between themselves for the opportunity to win her affections.

lawndart

quote:

Originally posted by lawndart:
I get all my Dacron from the checkpoint at the border between Idaho and Oregon halfway between my house and Jordan Valley. Before we let any of the California folks in who have driven up on route 95 we make them eat a cheeseburger and wear a fur coat until they finish. Some refuse and get sent back south. Some complete the task and are passed on through. A fair number fall over dead from the shock of red meat entering their system for the first time.
We ship the bodies back south. To pay the freight charges we sell their hybrid cars to the ding-dongs in Sun Valley. We go through their luggage and pockets of course. A lot of them have those Patagonia brand pile jackets made out of the "post consumer marketing/recycled synthetic fabric). We have discovered that a plug cut out of those jackets with a sharpened 470 NE case is just the right weight and thickness for loading your favorite double rifle.
That checkpoint has proven to be a reliable sourch of income and entertainment for our county. The only problem so far has been with one guy who was moving up from walnut Creek, California. He tried to smuggle a sheep into Idaho in the back of his Toyota Prius. Due to a scheduling screw-up there were two Basque guards on duty that day. They confiscated the ewe and immediately started fighting between themselves for the opportunity to win her affections.

lawndart