I'm having just a wench of a time getting 405 gr cast bullets to shot worth anything in my Handi-Rifle. They are all over the place. Current load is 50 gr Varget, CCI LR primer, and Meister hard cast 405 gr pill. It shoots the 300 gr bullets ok. I'm thinking that these bullets are just not a match. It's nowhere near a max load, but maybe too fast for these bullets? They lead the last few inches of the barrel pretty good also.

Has anyone developed decent loads for the few 350 gr bullets out there? The 300 gr pills are too light for me, and these 405's are giving me fits. Maybe it's the alloy, etc... I'd love to shoot cast 405's, but don't have a lot of time to mess with them now. I have to get this all ironed out before an elk hunt in 5 weeks. I think a fast-moving 350 gr bullet will still work just fine! thanks, maxman

I've settled on the 350s as my standard .45-70 bullet, specifically, the Hornady JFP, the same bullet they use in their .450 Marlin factory ammo. In my Guide Gun, I believe 53 grains of IMR3031 gets me just over 1700 fps.

I also had poor accuracy with 405 LFPs from Laser Cast in a previous Guide Gun and a Siamese Mauser. And I agree that 300s are intended for the smaller and/or softer big game (though my Guide Gun cloverleafs the Winchester JHP factory 300s at 50 yards!)

[ 09-08-2003, 20:51: Message edited by: Slingster ]

300 grian hornady's are designed for 1800 and down... in fact, hornady doesn't list any major loads for them in 458 win.... instead keeps them at 45/70 loads...

350s rn's are great bullets... and we tend to get 1.5 or better moa out of them

jeffe

Speer makes a 350 grain bullet specifically designed for 458 mag velocities it is a semi pointed flat point and tests at 45-70 velocities the bullet acts as a solid, it is a hot core

Maxman. I am not sure what you are asking. Are you asking for 350gr. jacketed loads, or 350 gr. lead loads? I too have not had much luck with 405 gr. lead bullets in my 45/70, but to be honest I have not spent that much time on it. I have however got a couple of excellent 405 gr. jacketed loads that are wonderfully accurate. I shoot a Ruger #1. I am looking for some accurate loads for the Hornady 350gr. jacketed bullets. the lead stuff can wait for now!
Peter.

Sorry about the confusion. I am looking for info on 350 gr jacketed bullets (smokeless powder, 22" bbl). With cast bullets, there are too many variables at this point. Granted it would be much more personally satisfying to pound away with a classic 405 gr cast bullet, but time is my factor here.

I think a good jacketed load, like that mentioned by Slingster, will be much easier for me to settle on this year. Cast bullets are cheap and certainly fun to play with, but they are a lot more work in the development stages I have found. maxman

I've had pretty good luck with TrueShot cast bullets from Oregon Trail, plus at a very reasonable price. They got some .458 with gas checks. They're worth a look if you don't find a suitable jacketed bullet.

Maxman
I've not shot a jacketed bullet thru my Winchester 1886 but I do have a great 350 grain cast bullet load that I load up buckets full of.
I use a 445 grain gas checked cast bullet in my Siamese using 50 some odd grains of IMR 4064, with good results.
The 350 grain mold is made Saeco, has a gas check. I make my own but I've noticed that Leadhead sells the same bullet and you can get it sized .459. I've always planned to use Leadheads product if I run out of time to cast my own.
I use 52 grains of RL-7, Win. brass, Win LR primers. I use this load to bang away, off hand at an 8*8 gong at 100 yards and a 12*12 at 200.
I hit the gongs most every time I shoot at them, should I miss it's not the bullet.
This load gives me no leading, seems clean burning and is a pleasure to shoot.
Jim

CK: I tried the TrueShot fodder from Oregon Trail and considered it over-priced junk. Much, much better off buying from Leadhead than Oregon Trail. Better bullet for the 45/70 (Oregon Trail's alloy is too hard for 45/70 pressures) and better price.

Have you thought of maybe getting rid of that particular gun and getting at least a Marlin? That may suit you unless price is an over-riding factor.

Maxman--Use 350 gr Speers.They are tough and can take velocity.My 458HE puts them up to 3500.
Your 45-70 should get them to over 1700 fps.
Use Slingsters load listed above.You will have good results on game.Ed.

Actually, 475Guy, I like the rifle as it is. I wanted a single-shot 45-70, and the TC offerings are very overpriced if you ask me. I like the fact that I have a 22" bbl in a rifle that is only ~34" overall and comes in at 6.5 lbs. It's easy to carry all day and quick to handle. That it was cheap doesn't hurt either The action is as strong as the Marlin, so performance will be as good (or better due to the extra 4" of bbl). It just isn't a repeater - don't bother me none.

It does shoot most things besides these particular 405s very well. It handles the Rem factory 405 JFP loads nicely. I'm sure I could make them work if I had the time to play with powders and loads, etc. In my experience, cast bullets are more difficult to get shooting right. I think I'll get some of the Hornadys and Speers mentioned above and give them a shot. The Hot-Cors sure do look interesting! maxman

maxman

I think most cast bullet shooters use 3031 and/or RL-7 for 405 gr bullets in the 45-70. I think Varget likes to burn at higher pressures than what the 45-70 can handle.

Varget is very close to RL15 in performance.

I have found about 50grs of RE7 behind the 350gr Hornady to be a sweet spot for my Siamese...

Could be a twist rate problem. I don't know what the handi-rifle has. If you say the factory 405 ammo shoots well, it might be fine. I was going to knock the rifle until I remembered the Indian who said "Any Gun Good, Shoot Gun Good". I would use a 350. You'll get a little velocity over the 405.

I have an Ruger #1 Load which I have found the most accurate and for sure powerfull out of my 30" barrel is as follows.
Bullet: hornadys 4512 350 grains
Powder: vihtavuori N 130 3.5 gram
Primer: Federal 215 (mag rifle prim).
Abowe gives a speed 664 M/s and energy 4990 J
Please notice that this load is for sure too much for some older arms..

regards....

Geez Elias, that's a pretty serious load you've got there. I have always thought that N130 was a pretty fast powder. I used it in my 6mmBR, and you want to use 54.01 grains with a 350 gr jacketed bullet. I would suggest that you might want to put a disclaimer like 'work up to this" or something like that!
Peter.

I shoot a moose bull this monday with my 458Win and the Hornady 350gr Bullet(loaded to 2500f/s) distance 50y. Both bullet (althou one would have been enough ) stayed just inside the skin at the opposite side of the animal (227gr,238gr). So I should guess they would be perfect in a 45/70.
PerN

I use Harnady 350 FPs and 49grs H4198 for hunting in my 1895G. I have shot 50 grains with no pressure signs but the groups started to open. They snort, at least to me! I have also loaded them with 25grs and they shoot about 10" higher at 100 but the same point of impact at 200yards. Its fun just to lob them down there with open sights and they have no blast or recoil but use your own discretion with the light ones.