Poor accuracy with less than 90% load density, and the hottest primer to ensure no hang fires with the slow powders required (no fillers), ya.



The .416 Taylor is the real efficiency champ, and that means that the .416 Remington has no pressure problems whatsoever.



Any screw-ups with .416 Remington pressures have come from poor factory ammo, botched by the factory.



Any able handloader can make the .416 Remington get a totally functional and modest pressure 2400 fps with 400 grain bullets and 24" barrel.



O.K., I am taking sides with all the .416's. Nothing wrong with any of them. I better quit now.

So depending on what velocity you want to achieve, smaller capacity usually means more efficient powder burn?

And on the Reload Bench site it states:

"Due to the extreme large powder capacity of the .416 Rigby, it should be loaded with magnum primers and powders that fill its case to at least 90 percent charge density."

Why is that? What would happen if you don't fill at least 90%? Hangfires?

I'm learning a lot from this. Thanks for your patience!

The Cool Guy,

You got that right. The 416 Dakota will be red faced to keep up with the 416 Rigby with 350 grainers at 350 yards. It is a personal decision thing, 3 in the box and lower pressures or higher velocity with the Rigby, versus 4 in the box and not much better than the 416 Remington regarding pressure, but sans belt with the Dakota.



Actually at Dakota Arms, they seem to build more rifles in 416 Rigby and 416 Remington than in 416 Dakota, just my impression from one visit to the premises and a brief chat.

But what do the "masses" of Dakota rifle purchasers know?



Dakota seems to be pushing the 404 Dakota over the 416 Dakota right now. It could be said for it that it has all the performance of the 416 Dakota, and the 404 Dakota will fit in a standard length Mauser 98, 30-06 length.



The rub with any 404(.423cal) is poor bullet availability compared to any .416.



So I guess the 416 Dakota is the unappreciated technical champ. I might have to have one of those one day, but I am waiting until I can afford all the bells and whistles on a Dakota 76. H&H be damned.



Until then, I can make do just fine with 3 in the magazine of a WinM70.416Rem or the the CZ or Ruger .416 Rigby.



Ron Thompson, with claim to over 5000 elephants culled, just made it a habit to reload quickly after every 4 shots with his .458 WinMag, 3 down and 1 up quick-time. He must have been a handloader to get good results with the .458 WinMag.

So the 416 dakota is just better than the rigby because it fits a smaller action?



.416 Dakota Case Capacity = 116 grains of water



From the Chuck Hawks site:



.416 Rigby (F C): 132.6 grains



humm... how noticeable is this difference in terms of potential velocity?



According to that same site.. an 06 and the 300 win mag only has a capacity difference of roughly 22 grains:



.30-06 Springfield (R-P): 68.0 grains



.300 Winchester Mag. (W-W): 90.4 grains



Wouldn't this make the Rigby have a slight edge in longer range shooting with say... 350 gr pills?



Thanks!

Cool G - I shoot both my Rigby and Dakota at a comfortable 2450 fps +/-. It just takes more powder to achieve the same velocity with the Rigby and I lose one cartridge in the magazine. That's the only difference between the two cartridges.



The most you will safely get out of the Dakota case is about 2550 fps. Because of the greater case capacity with the Rigby, you can squeeze another 50 to 75 fps over the Dakota case. However, this added velocity comes at a considerable increase in powder charge weights.



Having shot full-house loads in both cartridges, it would be difficult to tell which recoil hits harder. But suffices to say, both will get your attention post-haste.

Bill - You have me confused with someone else.