The November 2003 issue of American Rifleman hit my mailbox yesterday. The cover story is ".458 Lott All Business" by Mark Keefe. The cover photo shows the action area of a really good looking rifle and a single Lott cartridge.

Upon further review the rifle turns out to be the Ruger Magnum M77 Mk II.



The rifle pictured in the magazine has a great piece of walnut for its stock, and the text notes that Ruger is building these rifles with "Circassian AAA walnut"; it is two steps above the catalog photo in appearance.

A "lot" of rifle for $1,695 suggested retail.

jim dodd

Hey!! I just bought that rifle. How'd they get a picture of it?

Unfortunatly I don't get Rifleman, but Hunter. I'm going to have to ask a buddy for a copy of the article.

Thanks for the heads up, Jim!

-Steve

Steve,

Since you own the rifle, you need a color copy of the article.

Perhaps NRA will get it up on the American Rifleman website one of these days.

jim

How is the wood on the actual guns? Ruger usually does not use the best wood I've seen (except for a commemorative No. 1 that had beautiful Circassian wood).

Anybody have a comment on what the stocks have looked like?

Jim,

My buddy is going to bring in the article and I'll take a look at it. I can scan it or use a color copier, if I decide not get a back copy.

Thanks!

TT,

My stock has noce color and a bit of figure on it. It's very pretty, but certainly not a 'great' piece of wood.

Here are some pictures that ngrumba (from whom I bought it from) sent me prior to me buying it.





The figure and color shows up better in person.

Take Care,

-Steve

Steve,

I say that is a pretty good piece of wood for a factory rifle.

I have seen numerous Dakota's that say they have XXX wood that aren't nearly as nice as the wood on your Ruger. Is it just me, or does Dakota charge some outrageous prices for wood that is graded far higher than most people would grade them.

For example, this is listed as XXX wood by Dakota





Regards,

Terry

If buying a Dakota I recommend the McMillan stocked version. The wood stocked ones I've seen are not worth $1,200 extra.

Steve,

What do you consider a great piece of wood? All the Rugers big-bores I have seen have had excellent wood, including yours. What is it that Ruger is suppose to do for $1600 (retail)?

T Carr-

That looks like a well-stained stick of Birch...

Occasionally Ruger does stock their rifles with really nice wood. I had a M-77 in 416 Rigby stocked with full fiddleback and lots of contrasting stripes in the butt. It was every bit XXX if not better. Number Ones often have very nice wood in the butt, Claro walnut.

Will,

I didn't say it wasn't nice (or noce if you type with your thumbs). I just said it wasn't GREAT! I'm certainly very pleased with it.

I proabably made the mistake of comparing it, in my mind, with some of the custom stocks that I've seen. I agree that isn't quite a fair comparison.

I got a very good deal on it (here on AR) and am quite happy.

BTW, when I was picking up the rifle, the fellow at the gun shop told me that a Ruger rep had told him that Ruger has stopped manufacturing the magnum CF rifles Ruger will discontinue offering them when current stock is gone. Not sure if it's true and it's clearly hearsay. So take it for what it's worth.

-Steve

Regular Rugers are not going to get the same wood that the Safari grades get, thats for sure..

On the big bore safari grades you get Turkish walnut, on the M-77 regular models you get black walnut like all the other factory rifles in the USA....

To the best of my recolection all the Safari grade big bores I have seen since the change are of high quality european wood (probably Turkish)and properly laid out for the recoil...Recoil limits the cut of wood by lay out that can be used on big bores therefore you won't see marble cake hopefully....and hopefully all blanks will be quarter sawn....Also hopefully they will all be dry and cured properly...

Steve,
That is the first I have heard of the Ruger M77 Magnum Mark II RSM's being discontinued.

I will keep ear to the ground.

I wonder if the bedding system of the RSM has anything to do with it, or whether CZ is just killing them in sales.

If I were going to pick a factory .458 Lott, I would be looking for the CZ 550 American Safari.

And if they ever decide to offer the 404 Jeffery, I would finally have a 404 Jeffery, but I do not see that happening ...

Considering that the M77 CF rifle is the main stay of the Ruger company I do not think that they would throw away nearly 40% of their business. The bean counters wouldn't let them do that. Rumor I would say started by someone that has a beef against Ruger. I have heard these things before. Lawdog

The rumor is that the M77 Mark II Magnum (.375 H&H to .416 Rigby length action) is to be discontinued after they sell them out in a last gasp of .458 Lotts.

This does not apply to the .300 and .338 Win Mag length (short magnum) offered in stainless and blue as the M77 Mark II Rifle.

Heck, maybe they will recreate the M77 MK II Magnum in stainless and blue with a normal bedding system as found on the short magnum rifles, doing away with the amazing recoil plate on the barrels of the Magnum/Express rifles.

They gotta do something to top CZ.

Guys,

I've had one of the RSM's in 458 Lott for about 4
months now and mine has a VERY nice piece of
English walnut.

I was really surprised how nice the wood was on a
"production" gun good figure and decent color.

It was difficult but I refrained from calling
Ruger and complaining about them substituting
English walnut for Circassian walnut ;-)

Now if I can just out and fire the durn thing.

Had 3 vertebrae fused in my neck in April and
have been being VERY careful about shooting
anything with heavy recoil :-(

But I can only wait soooo long. And my patience
is wearing thin...

hmmm, perhaps ruger is going to BUY cz and slap a quarter rib on the 550!!!

I can't imagine them stopping selling them. The tooling cost alone would not be depreciated for the Lott tooling.

This would be like ford stopping selling jags, or GM dropping caddy... the guys won't be dropping their top of the line models.. then they can't compeat with winchester, beretta, and company...

now, if they dropped the rib, and made the thing in the 800 dollar range....

jeffe

Found a pic of a Ruger...looks like a nice stick of lumber.

This might be a better question for a new thread, but can someone give some knowledge on the different types of walnut? Figure, grain, color, wieght, strenth, grade, etc? My untrained eye would say the wood below is something along the lines of XX. Comments?



[ 10-16-2003, 07:25: Message edited by: TrademarkTexan ]

New Rumor: The Ruger Rumor is just a marketing "leak" contrived to sell RSM's. Gotta get them while you still can, before they are discontinued. They are surely to become a collector item like that rare 404 Jeffery Ruger No.1.

As you were.

Trademark Texan,

Try this for info on wood Dressels

I'm no expert, but assuming the other side of that stock was similar - I go with you and say XX on that piece of wood.

Regards,

Terry

Dangit, Terry...I needed to get SOME work done today.

Instead I guess I'll be educating myself on wood.

Terry & Fellow Pirates,

I went back and looked at the other photos of the Ruger Magnum in American Rifleman. I learned over the years that the number of Xs in the stock grade related to the number of quarters of the wood showing figure. One X meant 25%, two Xs meant 50%, etc. The entire stock covered was XXXX or Exhibition grade. This is just my personal scale, perhaps Chic Worthing will comment.

At any rate, the photo on p.51 shows a stock with figure all the way to the fore-end cap, so it is at least XXX on my scale. The author remarks that it is the most beautiful piece of wood he has seen on a Ruger.

jim

Forget the x/s, thats a poor way to grade wood from a hunter/consumer standpoint..To start with a big bore should be quarter sawn, therefore it won't x out like a piece of marble cake clown wood...

The stock for a big bore should be quarter sawn, with streaks and grain starting at the heel and flowing straight to the forend with perhaps a bit of upward path....that prevents splitting better than any thing I know, it prevents shearing of the pistol grip and when cured and dryed properly will prevent warping...So I give the above Ruger a xxxx based on that....Contrast is nice to have....

Were it full marble cake from one end to the other and what most are looking for, I'd regulate to the show room....Some like marble cake in the butt and perhaps thats OK, Perhaps not, but its not for me, I use my guns and I have hunted all over the globe and I have never had a wood stock warp, but I take the necessiary precautions to prevent such things happening and my guns are old and thus dry and I keep them sealed as best I can...Whatever I'm doing is right because it hasn't happened yet...Alaska to the Sudan...A good custom made rifle from a knowledable smith is a fine investment for the man who hunts a lot...

The Ruger is a heck of a lot of gun for the money, nothing has topped it so far IMO, An "integral" quarter rib alone cost two grand on a custom gun. Add a barrel band swivel, a barrel band front sight, and a 3 pos. M-70 safty to that nice thin shelled walnut and its pretty hard to beat...The bedding system is a good one, it works fine, but if you don't like it then its an easy change to install a lug ala remington 700 type...

I'm wondering how the above poster can tell the difference in California and Turkish, other than suspecion, since they are both thin shell walnut and color can very pretty close between Turkish and California wood in some circumstances..They advertise it as European so thats what it must be by law is my understanding..

Bob,

I'll bet what you posted was what the fellow I talked to was refering too.

Thanks for clearing it up.

-Steve

Gossip killed, mystery solved.

Easy to mix up the Express and Magnum models in conversation, on transmission or reception.

Now, another mystery: Why the crossbolt on the M77 MkII Magnum?

There is no recoil lug at the location of the cross bolt. Is there?

Why doesn't somebody else besides me take their M77 MkII Magnum out of the stock and comment on the bedding system.

Can anyone else besides Ray comment on the Ruger Magnum bedding system, with a recoil plate in the forearm, and no primary action recoil lug?

If you put a washer/Remington-type recoil lug on the rifle, you have to discard the recoil plate and add a lug to the barrel too.

Cowards!

RIP,

Check out the article in The American Rifleman.

It includes a picture of a massive steel "bedding plate" in the stock just ahead of the front action ring. This plate fits some kind of corresponding recoil lug assembly on the bottom of the barrel.

I can only assume that the recoil lug backs up the bedding plate.

My local gun shop has a M-77 in 30-06 with the same stock as the Express pictured, nice figure and a contrasting end cap, but no sights.

Is that an "Express" rifle or some other variant?

My local gun shop has a M-77 in 30-06 with the same stock as the Express pictured, nice figure and a contrasting end cap, but no sights.

Is that an "Express" rifle or some other variant?

I can't help thinking how good it would look with 9.3X62 barrel and quarter rib.

mrlexma,
Yes, I have one that I have taken out of the stock to look at. That recoil plate hooks over a stud on the barrel. The 45 degree front action screw pulls that recoil plate backwards, tight against the stud on the barrel, when the action screw is tightened.

If you take the barreled action out of the stock, the recoil plate falls off the barrel. There is no other recoil lug on the rifle other than the recoil plate.

This may be just fine and dandy, but I will buy another RSM when the action has a recoil lug integral to it. I would like to see a barrel recoil lug made integral rather than a quarter rib.

CZ's are better in the bedding system: effectively two recoil lugs insted of one.

Rick R,
I have never seen an Express without the quarter rib and sights. I have never owned one, but I would guess that they use the same action as the regular medium magnum Mk II M77, with the recoil lug on the action, unlike the "Magnum" action. That would be a fine rifle, but apparently now discontinued due to unprofitability, as the cheaper standard Mk II 77's are available in the calibers that the Express was available in.

The 30-06 may be one of the Ruger Ultralight Mark II M77's??? They used to have an ebony forend tip.

Sumbuddy who know?

BTW, the Express is not shown in the 2003 Ruger catalog, though the Magnum is, eh? Aye.

[ 10-21-2003, 02:33: Message edited by: RIP ]

A coverup conspiracy then, eh?

CZ wins by default in the Magnum rifle class.

I own more Ruger rifles than any other make, and I think the up-to-medium-magnum M77 MkII is as perfect a factory rifle as you will find, out of the box, except the trigger should be made adjustable like they used to be.

I only own one RSM, and it befuddles me that this is the only rifle I own that has no recoil lug on the action. But it do have a doozey single recoil lug in the form of a plate on the barrel that separates from the barrel when you take it out of the stock.

The recoil plate is an "extension lug" that slips over the nub on the bottom of the front action ring. This cantilever reaches forward into the forearm and plants the solitary recoil lug surface for the whole rifle into the forearm.

To leave this setup un-altered, one could put a secondary barrel lug on, to anchor further out in the forend, somewhere short of the tip! I wonder if this would affect accuracy? It would be an easy way to have two recoil lugs on the rifle.

My apologies to Paul H. It appears that all that is necessary is to just add a secondary recoil lug of the standard barrel lug sort, seated in the forearm ahead of the recoil plate terminus. Better put a heavy duty cross bolt through there too. Still a bit unusual, and all stresses still come to bear in the forearm, and still no integral recoil lug on the action.

Nonexistant problem solved?

[ 10-26-2003, 23:27: Message edited by: RIP ]