I'm going to have a 416 Taylor built by Pac Nor. I wanted to send along a dummy round to set the throating with so I need to get dies/brass now. My questions are, do folks think its better to go from 338 winnie brass or neck down 458's? I don't yet have neck turning equipment if that matters. I'm thinking of using the 400g Nosler but if someone knows of a more easily expanding bullet that would be great--my goal is a serious knockdown rifle for elk/moose in dark timber, I want to transfer energy fast(penetration should't be a problem.) Also, what do folks recommend for a crimp die? Thanks to all in advance for the guidance.

Snowcat,
use the 458 winnie brass, as it will be MUCH eaiser to form, and less failures.
Pacnor, unless they are feeding, won't need this, but you might contact ch4d to verify the throat. It's MORE than okay for long 416 bullets...

great luck
jeffe

Snowcat,

I agree with the previous posts unless you want properly headstamped brass (available from Quality Cartridge). The other thing is that for elk and moose at Taylor velocities you don't really need the Nosler unless you just like it. The Hornady 400 grain RN's will do just fine--they even work on Cape Buffalo. You'll be looking at velocities of 2300-2400 fps. They'll exit an elk or moose before they blow up--even at short range. Anyway, of the 3 416's I've had I miss my Taylor the most!

Good Hunting,

I got my dies (RCBS) from Midway. They were pretty cheap and very quick.

458 WM brass is definately the best. When you resize it, it comes out about .110 longer and will allow you to seat your bullets out to the appropriate length (if you crimp, otherwise it doesn't matter a heckuva lot). 458 WM brass will also resize down to a more consistent neck thickness and will probably be more concentric.

338 WM brass does nicely in a pinch though, and is what I had to start with due to a shortage of 458 brass in Canada. Availability has vastly improved over the last year, so I don't bother with 338 brass any more.

I would recommend having your throat reamed for the Nosler bullet or even the Swift A-frame if you like it. The Hornady is a good bullet, but it starts to taper almost immediately after the cannelure. My Taylor was built with a short throat, and it worked great with the Hornadies. Unfortunately I had to get it "deep-throated" a little while later because I couldn't seat any other bullets out far enough. I wanted to use the Swift A-frames (my favorite bullet), and they extend a ways beyond the cannelure before the short radius ogive starts.

It won't hurt anything having the Hornadies jump a bit before they engage the lands. After all, its not like we are talking about a benchrest cartridge here!

Hope this helps. Enjoy your Taylor!

Canuck

.458 brass it is. Pac Nor asked that I include the dummy round so I guess it won't hurt anything. I'll probably shoot the Hornadys but would like the option of longer bullets (we'll see if THIS rifle likes Barnes--none have so far.) What do you guys recommend for a crimp die--I've heard good things about the Lee collets...or does the factory set usually include a crimp die? In your opinion, is a 22" barrell reasonable? Thanks again for all the help!

You might wait until you get your rifle back then make a chamber cast to see how long the throat acutally is.

My Adams & Bennett will allow a 2.525" long case. I tried Winchester 458 win brass at first and they shortened up to 0.020" on the first firing. Most ended up around 2.47" long without any trimming.

I tried Remington 416 Rem Mag brass from Midway. It is a bit of a hassle to form then cut 0.3300" off to 2.525", the fired case measures 2.51" to 2.515". That puts a Speer 350 MagTip seated even with the base of the neck at 3.42", just right for my Savage 110 magazine.

The Win 458 brass shoots just as well but I get about 0.040" longer case with the Rem brass. I know, it's nit-picking, nothing more than experimenting, although the Rem brass has a 0.013" wall thickness and cleans up at 0.012" and the Win brass is as low as 0.010".

snowcat,

I don't have any Lee dies, but I suspect you will have to get the factory crimp die separately. I plan on ordering up a set for my Taylor at some point this year. My only exposure to them was Don G's 416 Rem handloads he had in RSA this year. They looked great! To get the factory crimp dies made for the Taylor, I believe you have to send a dummy round in to Lee. Pretty cheap and easy though, from what I gather.

A 22" barrel will work fine. I couldn't decide whether I wanted 22 or 24, so I split the difference. For what you are proposing (moose, etc), I don't think you'll notice much either way.

Cheers,
Canuck