The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Need Advice: Build 416 Weatherby vs. Rigby?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| one of us |
I have never had a rifle built so I need your help. First, can I handload a 416 Rigby to basically duplicate the 416 Weatherby? Second, what action should I use? Winchester, Dakota, Mauser, etc. I really like the ballistics on the Weatherby but I would imagine the Rigby case is more practical. I'm getting advice on this from a gunsmith, but, I really respect the opinions I read on this forum. Thanks Wes | ||
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Moderator |
For all intents and purposes, the cases are identicle, albeit the Weatherby has a belt. Personally I'd go with the Rigby, no need for the belt, it just takes up magazene capacity. The Weatherby balistics are all marketing and hoopla, 416's work best at 2400 fps, not 2700 fps. So, don't handload the rigby to weatherby levels, all it will do is make more noise, beat you up, and make the bullets do funny things on occasion. As far as what rifle, I'd strongly consider getting a CZ 550 416 rigby, having a custom stock made and a 3 position safety fit. Now, if money weren't an issue, I'd go with a Dakota action, and have a barrel with barrel band rear sight base with second recoil lug, barrel band sling swivel, and a barrel band front sight. The gun would be slow rust blued, and the stock would be an equisite piece of walnut. | |||
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One of Us |
DWS - I agree with Paul across the board. Go 416 Rigby on a Dakota action. The Dakota actions are some of the best that I have ever used. You may also want to look at the 416 Dakota. I have one and it shoots like a dream. Z | |||
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| <J.G> |
Well said, Mitch! // J.G | ||
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| <R. A. Berry> |
DWS, Gee, nothing left for me to say. I would have to agree with both Paul H, and Mitch. The choice is to the shooter, either one is good. ------------------ | ||
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| one of us |
You guys are helping me a lot and I appreciate it. A couple more questions. I am going for functionality and accuracy. Pretty costs too much! 1. Will a CZ-550 with Lilja barrel shoot as accurate as a Dakota action after the CZ has been accurized by a good gunsmith? Same question regarding smoothness and reliability of CZ. 2. At Weatherby velocities, can I achieve good accuracy in the lighter weights, ie 300 to 350gr, with proper handloads? As you can see I'm thinking this caliber could be "do it all" for me. I know the recoil is tough but that doesn't bother me. I'm just thinking that the flatness in the 300 to 350 and the knockdown in the 400 to 450 (aren't 450's available now) seems pretty neat to me. I made the fatal error of letting my wife hear me mumbling about this to which she said "...but you've already got Boomer (375) and Whacker (416 rem mag)" to which I responded "UUUUUHHHH, yeah" and hastily retreated. Oh well. Thanks Wes | |||
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| One of Us |
DWS, Accuracy differences between different bolt actions does not amount to much. If the barrel is good, the bedding is right, the scope and mounts are OK and the load is right, that is about 98% of the accuracy. In fact if you went to extremes and spent the same money on the CZ550 as the Dakota costs you could buy several match grade barrels for the CZ550. You would them test them all and the best would be real good. In other words a CZ550 with several match grade barrels to pick from would beat anything. I have not used the 416 Rigby but in the 416 Wby I had very good accuracy from the 350 Barnes X and the 340 grain Woodleigh. Also had good accuracy with the 400 Hornady loaded to various velocities. Mike | |||
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| <Mitch> |
DWS, ditto to what Mike 375 said. | ||
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| Moderator |
I found the 416Wby totally unshootable at full velocities so have retreated to the Rigby, loaded at normal 2400fps levels. Much better on me, absolutely no difference on game. That extra 300fps gets you nothing but horrendous recoil and inconsistent results with most bullets, especially solids. If you already have a 416 Remington, why not get a 450 Dakota or 460Wby? Then you will have a "real" thumper that can shoot about as flat as the Rigby does. ------------------ | |||
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| <Todd G> |
I have a Ruger M77 in 416 Rigby and have always hand loaded to Weatherby velocities. This particular rifle will shoot 1 - 1.5 MOA with 400 grain Hornady softs at 2600 - 2650 fps, 2 MOA with Woodliegh 340 grain at 2840 fps, and 1.5 MOA with Barnes 350 X at 2800 fps. I use this rifle for all my North American big game hunting at to around 400 yards. Todd | ||
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| one of us |
I'll go with thoes who like the Rigby. I wouldn't own a 416 or 460 Wby...I have seen softs fly apart in big animals on more than one ocassion, and I hear about it all the time. Adding velocity to 2400 FPS gains nothing..If you want more whump, go to a 500 or 505 or 577 and maintain the 2200 to 2400 FPS level of velocity that does not destroy softs and turn solids...IMO. ------------------ | |||
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| <Viking-59> |
quote: Wes, Like you, I spent a lot of time in OK [ Tulsa and Pawnee County ] and like you I am here to learn big bore and am getting ready to order my first custom built rifle. And like you I am yearning for a 416. So in the DGR I will defer to the great folks on this forum. On the wife thing I recommend buying her a gun and getting her involved and converted into a gun nut ASAP Pardon my humor, but as a guy going on 20 with my shootin' buddy - having a wife that shoots and likes guns is a dream. Actually I did not convert her, she was raised in a hunting, farming and game managing family so I lucked out. But if you can get those ladies involved. Save you some grief and it is fun for all. - In reference to this post - I have oft read the CZ500 action as a good deal. Please qualify that if you can. How much would a CZ550 action be versus the cost of a Mauser suitable for a DGR? Also what is the expected price on the Dakota action? And as always, my complements for a great forum and thank you for your help. Marv ------------------ http://www.Gunnery.Net | ||
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| <JohnDL> |
I have a 416 Wby in a custom mauser action and a 416 Rigby Heym (mauser). Both are inherently accurate rounds. It is almost hard to find a load which the Rigby won't shoot well. Ray is right about the velocity thing. Bullets start doing strange things at high velocities, most of them bad. If you don't mind recoil and feel that 400 grains at 2400 fps is inadequate, move up to a 45 caliber (Dakota or Lott). Just one thing-don't get a Weatherby rifle! It has far too much drop and with that recoil you'll get pounded above the eye. Also it has only two rounds in the magazine and is not CRF. To go into action with three rounds in the run you have to chamber a round and leave the safety on. | ||
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| <Terry P> |
I also have a Ruger 77 in 416 Rigby. Reloading to near Weatherby ballistics should be no problem. I have a friend that uses a hot 350 gr Barnes load exclusively. He swears by this load and says he has some friends using it in Africa. He was hunting buffalo but came across a sitatunga that he was able to shoot at 150-200 yards. Says it does great on buffalo too. I stayed with the standard Rigby load however for my last hunt but I may try to hunt with his load one of these days. | ||
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| one of us |
Terry, Tod and John S. What loads are you using for those 2400 fps loads? I am looking for loads for that 416 Rigby. I am using a 24 inch barrel. I don't want to load it too hot as any relief from recoil will be appreciated. I don't think speed over 24-2500 fps amounts to much of a gain at DG distances. Time recovering from recoil to get another round up the tail of a retreating buffalo may be important. My Chrony is sick and will not give me reliable readings. Thanks "D" | |||
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| one of us |
D Hunter, some of my loads are in the "your favorite loads" section of this forum, if you want to take a look. I don't know much but will share what I have experienced. Good luck, Bill | |||
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| one of us |
DWS, What actions are your own 375 and 416rem mag on? Why not just convert the 416 rem to 416wby or Rigby? Since you are interested in an 'all round' 416 rifle you will not need the rem anymore. Regards, | |||
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| one of us |
whoops! old thread. | |||
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