I might try it on Cape Buffalo, because I know the partition bullet is adequate for buff. The Accubond is supposed to pretty much duplicate the performance of the Partition. But I would not use either of those bullets on an elephant! I'd want a monolithic, blunt-nosed solid!

I think that bullet is too 'soft' for Cape buff, except for gut shots.

I use bonded core partitioned bullet (Swift A-Frames) or solids.

George

Anyone that shoots a buffalo with that bullet is asking for trouble, sure it will kill one most of the time, but its definately no Nosler partition, Woodleigh, Swift or Northfork.....

IMO the only Buffalo bullets that are 100 percent positive, especially in the tall grass is a flatnose solid and as of late the Northfork cup point holds all titles for buff..

I want two holes (solid) so blood will be at shot level, which may be waist or shoulder level on the grass, then I can watch ahead of me and see the blood at the same time...one hole means nose, mouth blood on the ground and I would rather not be looking down and tracking a wounded bull in tall grass..

The last bull I tracked in the tall stuff was shot with a cup point and my khaki pants were streaked with blood waist high and on both legs when I finally killed him, I like lots of blood to walk through.

Has anyone actually shot anything with these? They really flatten out the trajectory of the 375 and shoot tighter groups than anything else I've used. I might want to find a use for them someday, but prefer not to be the guinea pig.

I have only used them for plains game and they work fine on the smaller beasts. I would hesitate to use them on anything larger then eland. As far as them working fine, there is probebly no bad 260 grain bullets for plains game.

mikelravy, I had outstanding results with 260 AB in Namibia. Only recovered a few, one retained 55% after going through a zebra front leg and vitals at 40 yds, another lenthwise through a gemsbok retained 77%. Very accurate in my 375, good penetration and expansion. Still I wouldn't choose it for buffalo much less elephant. There are too many good 300 gr bullets around to choose the 260 for anything other than plains game. I pssted pictures of my recovered bullets before the 1st of the year, so a search on my name might bring them up. Bob

Thanks for the info. I envision using my 375 on a combo moose caribou and maybe bear hunt in Newfoundland and this seems like a good possibility. I've been itchin to use my new 375 for something and this is the best chance I've got.

Roland 1,

Roland 1,
I'd like to see your source. Where exactly has Nosler claimed the Accubond is suitable for Cape Buffalo? On their website in FAQ they state it is suitable for bear, but I am unable to find ANY claim that the Accubond is meant for buffalo. After attending the SCI convention and talking with many outfitters on the suitability for the Accubond on Elk, the professionals opinion is that it will do a nice job on thick skinned, non-dangerous game in calibers of .338 and up. I have a 375 H7H that I will be taking on a Montana elk hunt, as well as a .338 Win Mag. The .338 will be loaded with Partitions, the .375 with Accubonds.

quote:

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Originally posted by nyrifleman:
Roland 1,
I'd like to see your source. Where exactly has Nosler claimed the Accubond is suitable for Cape Buffalo? On their website in FAQ they state it is suitable for bear, but I am unable to find ANY claim that the Accubond is meant for buffalo. After attending the SCI convention and talking with many outfitters on the suitability for the Accubond on Elk, the professionals opinion is that it will do a nice job on thick skinned, non-dangerous game in calibers of .338 and up. I have a 375 H7H that I will be taking on a Montana elk hunt, as well as a .338 Win Mag. The .338 will be loaded with Partitions, the .375 with Accubonds.

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nyrifleman

I did not say Nosler made the claim, Federal did.

http://www.federalcartridge.com/default.asp?pg=27

Click Here to view Usage and Game Guides

By the way, it works great on Elk.

Roland

The .375" 260 grain Nosler Accubond (SD .264) does not meet the oft-cited minimum sectional density of .300 for a dangerous game round. I think it should be a 3 by the Federal usage and game guide rating system.

I agree Jackfish, interesting that the bullet manufacturer does not rate the Accubond as a dangerous game bullet, yet an ammo company does. Think anyone at Federal would be willing to face a charge loaded with an accubond? A bullet which seems to be an elk bullet under the BEST circumstances. Thanks for the link Roland!

nyrifleman

Look at the size of the Elk’s neck, you can see the entrance hole, the bullet scattered the spine and exited - full penetration. Animal dropped, like struck by the hammer of Thor.



Roland

BobC,

Would you mind re-posting those pics???

The Accubond and Interbond appear to be bonded varmit bullets. Not a serious BG or DG bullet.

It is trying to be all things to all people. Accurate. Polymer tip. High BC. 50% retained weight when pushed to high velocity w low SD.

It is not a premium bullet to my way of thinking.

Youve got people compalining on the Nosler web site about a .270 on deer for god sakes.

A premium DG bullet will have a thick tapered pure copper jacket and bonded core, not some flimsy gilding metal w a polymer tip.

Think Bitterroot, North Fork, original TBBC, heavier Kodiaks, and heavier Swifts A-Frames (not Scirrocos).

If you need SD to control expansion you are not a premium bullet!

You should be able to drop down one or two weights and push them to highest velocity possible and still keep 90% weight. If it wont do that, its advertising, not a hunting bullet.

Andy

This got beat to death on several different types of forums, but here we go again. They are a great BIG GAME bullet, but not a DG bullet was the general concensous. I tested the heck out of the 375 260gr. AB's in the Fedreal load (2700 fps) before going to Namibia this past July. Double caliber expansion and 70-80% weight retention in both wood/paper media and water. Shot 13 animals from every angle and only recovered 3 bullets; 2 from Blue WB (broadside and rear raking) and one from a quartering Zebra. Drop in their tracks performance on 11 of the 13. I left 2 boxes with my PH, and my son will shoot PG including Eland with them this coming June.

Roland1,
Did you make a post about this at Nosler.com?

That elk serves as no evidence of much of anything. Heck, I've been hunting elk for over thirty years, and I've dropped 'em and have seen 'em drop like the "Hammer of Thor" with the .270 Win., .30-06, 7mm Rem. Mag., .300 Win. Mag., .338 Win. Mag., .300 H&H, and .375 H&H, etc.

Speaking of the .375 H&H, I once trailed a bull for over 200 yds. with both lungs completely destroyed after taking a Hornday 270 gr. spire point through both lungs, with the bullet exiting. With elk, you can't count on anything to work perfectly 100% of the time, even the .375 H&H........

But to the question at hand, I wouldn't hunt anything with that 260 gr. Accubond load, much less Cape buff'. My feeling is that proper .375 H&H bullets begin with a premium 270 gr. bullet, then premium 300 gr. solids and softs. The lighter bullets give up too much mass and too much SD for my liking.

The .375 H&H wouldn't be my first choice for buffalo anyway (I want more gun), but if I ever do decide to hunt buff' with the .375 H&H, it'll be with a premium 300 gr. soft (Nolser Partition, Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded), followed with premium 300 gr. solids. (Barnes, Trophy Bonded, Woodleigh). This is the dependable formula for the .375 H&H, and time has proven that it works and gets all of the buffalo-killing performance possible out of this cartridge.

I think some of these guys get way too enthusiastic over new bullets that remain largely unproven.

AD

I would certainly use the new .375" 300 grain Hornady Interbond round nose. Look forward to reports of its use.

Is it possible that the Federal loaded 260 grain Accubond is different to what we buy from Nosler.

Two bullets that come to mind. The Barnes Xs that were loaded in PMC ammo were different to Barnes X we bought.

The 400 grain Hornady 416 loaded in the 416 Wby is nothing like the 400 Hornady we buy, at least in shape.

Mike

quote:

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Originally posted by allen day:
That elk serves as no evidence of much of anything. Heck, I've been hunting elk for over thirty years, and I've dropped 'em and have seen 'em drop like the "Hammer of Thor" with the .270 Win., .30-06, 7mm Rem. Mag., .300 Win. Mag., .338 Win. Mag., .300 H&H, and .375 H&H, etc.

Speaking of the .375 H&H, I once trailed a bull for over 200 yds. with both lungs completely destroyed after taking a Hornday 270 gr. spire point through both lungs, with the bullet exiting. With elk, you can't count on anything to work perfectly 100% of the time, even the .375 H&H........

But to the question at hand, I wouldn't hunt anything with that 260 gr. Accubond load, much less Cape buff'. My feeling is that proper .375 H&H bullets begin with a premium 270 gr. bullet, then premium 300 gr. solids and softs. The lighter bullets give up too much mass and too much SD for my liking.

The .375 H&H wouldn't be my first choice for buffalo anyway (I want more gun), but if I ever do decide to hunt buff' with the .375 H&H, it'll be with a premium 300 gr. soft (Nolser Partition, Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded), followed with premium 300 gr. solids. (Barnes, Trophy Bonded, Woodleigh). This is the dependable formula for the .375 H&H, and time has proven that it works and gets all of the buffalo-killing performance possible out of this cartridge.

I think some of these guys get way too enthusiastic over new bullets that remain largely unproven.

AD

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Allen Day,

Allen, I am aware you can kill elk with a .270; I’ve been hunting for over 30 years to.
The elk’s neck was a massive chunk of muscle and bone, because of the angel the bullet crossed diagonal throughout the middle of the neck, the measured distance of penetration 23.4 inch and a 2 inch exit hole.

In December 2004, I shot 7 Hogs – 2 Red Stags and 1 elk, all one shot kills with the same Cal and ammo, full penetration; I was unable to recover a bullet.

I did not try to prove that you can kill elk with a .375 H&H and a 260 grain accubond.
The performance that I experienced was just very high, for that reason, I investigated Federals usage and game guide rating system, stating 4.
My choice for Cape buffalo and elephant is a monolithic bullet, except this is not what this is all about.

Allen I keep your knowledge and field experience in high regard, this is just strange, you know as well as I do, before launching a product that tests are done in dept and very extensive. Federals reputation is known to be reliable, of course mistakes can be made, and nobody is infallible.

Roland

The accubond 260 worked exceptionally well in Namibia on plains game. It wouldn't be my 1st choice on a bull eland though I'm sure it would work. I recovered 3 of 10 or 11 bullets, penetration was 4 feet plus on a texas heart shot gemsbok, recovered bullets were nice mushrooms with about 75 to 80% retention. They pass the test in my book. Bob

I think that one may be making the assumption that the bullet offered for reloading is the same one that the is being loaded in the factory ammunition, not what actually happens.

The ammunition companies contract with various manufacturers and supply the specifications and the manufacturer builds to the specified requirements, so while Nosler may not recommend thier particular bullet for DG, the one made for Federal may actually be suitable.

Just like duplicating a factory loads velocity is just about impossible, since the ammunition companies buy the needed powder in train car size lots and mix and blend to meet the needed specifications.

So unless one can take a bullet, reverse engineer it, section it, measure jacket thickness at several points, hardness test it, melt it down and do an analysis of the materials that go into the bullet and then compare the results to the bullet that is available to the reloader, then you will never know and have to take thier word on it.

One must also remember that in this day of litigation, that incorrectly labelling and selling an unsuitable product and have injury or death result from it's use can be very expensive.

The skeptic in me is coming out. We seem to be taking for granted that manufacturers make different types of the same bullt. One for reloading and one for the ammo companies. PROOF? It seems that the bullet companies would have a hard time justifying the expense of two kinds of the same bullet. Nor have I ever read anything on the subject until this thread, and I read a great deal of the gun literature out there. BTW, I took a 180# 11pt. Whitetail buck this past November with a 160 gr Accubond handload out of a .280. The Accubond is a great deer round. Will do the job on elk and plains game (thick-skinned, not-dangerous unless you do something wildly stupid). However, until you show me something concrete from a manufacturer, I do not buy that there are two versions of the same bullet.

OK, here's a repost of my pictures. Bob

I investigated the theory from Mike375 and Maltese Falcon.
Amazingly but true, large companies can give there own specifications.
Money talks BS walks.

Roland

I voted BS simply because there is only one bullet weight that makes any sense when useing the 375 H&H, and that is a 300 gr premium, soft or solid. That is not just for Dangerous game either. The gain in speed, or flatness of trejectory, with a 260 gr bullet of any kind is not worth the loss of weight, and SD. IMO, anyone who must have the little advantage in trejectory offered by the 260 gr over a 300 gr simply does not know his rifle well enough to hunt dangerous game with it. In the first place the gain is not evident till you pass 250 yds, and dangerous game is not dangerous at 250 yds, so what is the point. The fact is, the 300 gr bullet will do anything the 260 will, and do it better. The 375 H&H is margenal on things like Cape Buffalo anyway, so why would anyone want to handicap himself by useing a lighter plastic tipped bullet, for them?

As far as the neck shot on the elk, a 100 gr 243 hitting the spine would have dropped him just as quickly!

The 300 gr Nosler Partition is the only bullet of any caliber or weight that has given me one shot kills on Cape buffalo, unless the spine or brain was hit! Addtionally I can hit the vitals of a little impala at 300 yds with the 300 gr NPs every time. Because of this I see no need for anything else in a soft point.