The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Feeding controlled feed actionGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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As I have mauser action rifle ( http://forums.accuratereloadin...4711043/m/4541033391 ) I have some feeding problem. I can not feed cartridge straight to the chamber, only through magazine. Bolt just don't close if I put cartridge to the chamber. I used to use Win 70 in .375 H&H and Prechtl in .416 Rigby. Those rifles allowed feeding to the chamber. Maybe it's a stupid question, but what is the problem with my rifle? | ||
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Mausers were designed to be fed from the magazine. It is possible to have someone knowledgable grind the front of your extractor so that it will snap over a round dropped into the chamber or you can pinch the side of the extractor while you close it over a round in the chamber --- although some do not recommend doing it often. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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There is no problem, it is designed like that. | |||
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What 458 Win. said... I personally don't want my extractor ground, as it has to weaken it to one degree or another.. I have done some testing on dropping a round in the barrel and closing the action as opposed to mashing the round in the magazine and closeing the action.. I found that pushing the round in the magazine and closeing the action to be less cumbersome and quicker.. If I want to fill the magazine and have one in the barrel I pinch the extractor with my thumb and carefully close the bolt, as 458 Win stated. That gives me and extra round in the gun but I only find that option questionably useful on DG. depending on magazine capacity, I am comfortable with 4 rounds in most cases. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Oh, thank you! I should have some training of fast loading. | |||
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I've just asked my friend to show me his new Prechtl in 416 Rigby. As it turned out it has difference with my bolt. When Prechtl is open there is a space between extractor and bolt. When it's closed - extractor close to bolt. That's why you can close that bolt with cartridge in the chamber. Something like modified mauser action? Sorry for phone pictures, but you can see the difference.   | |||
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Roman GBH, No, I cannot see what you are talking about in those two photos. Don't know which is which for starters. But, if your friends rifle works as a pushfeed into the chamber, extractor snaps over the rim of a cartridge in the chamber, then your friend's Prechtl-actioned Mauser has been modified as Phil described, and as Ray advises against. I agree. Your Mauser is truly a Controlled-Round Feeder and a Controlled-Round Extractor (CRF-CRE) until you go and mess with it. My Prechtl-actioned Mauser Magnum M98 rifle works just like your .416 Rigby, and I do not want that changed. No grinding on my extractor. And I won't be pinching on the side of the extractor unless I am really in a pinch myself. It feeds 4 of the 450 Dakota cartridges out of the box, slick as greased owl poop, and that is like crapping in high cotton. | |||
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Untold numbers of '98 Mauser and derivative controlled round feed claw extractors have been carefully altered to permit them to snap over a chambered round. There is no sound reason nowadays for anyone to accept a one round handicap when using such an action. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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All of this begs another question - exactly why is it such a bad idea to pinch the middle of the extractor occasionally when you need to drop a round directly in the chamber ? I have done it 15 or 20 times in the past 30 and everything seems to still work just fine. Can I do it another 30 years ? Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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First picture - bolt "closed". Second - "opened". I will try to show the space.  No, Prechtl was not modified. I asked another owner of Prechtl rifle - he can close the bolt with cartridge inside. And it works like CRF. By the way, Prechtl on his site tells that his magnum safari rifles have "best feeding, also in repeting overhead". And they've got 4+1 capacity. | |||
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I can not do this on my rifle. There is no space to move extractor. | |||
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Every Mauser has space to do that. When feeding the extra ammo try push with yours thumb the area which the red arrow points in picture:  | |||
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The M98 Mauser extractor has a dove tail foot on the front end of the extractor. It rides in a dove tail groove. If the fit is close the front end of the extractor will not lift out of the dove tail groove. I believe that Mauser designed this to keep the extractor from jumping off of a case rim and maybe to keep the extractor from being blown out of postion when a case head failed. Earlier Mauser designs had a straight blade or foot and they were easy to displace by squeezing the extractor. | |||
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Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Roman, if I'm understanding correctly, the space you are referring to is the space between the lugs of the claw and the bolt. That gap is there because the claw does not rotate in the action while the body of the bolt does. If you tried to take the bolt as show in the first picture, with the lugs at 3 and 9 o'clock and the claw at the 12 o'clock position, you would find that you couldn't put the bolt into the action. My guess to the reason your friends bolt can snap over a round and yours does not is the same as Phil's above, someone has ground the edge of your friends claw. Many, or shall we say most, claws for controlled feeding on a Mauser come with the lip of the claw squared off. This, as others have mentioned, is because the Mauser 98 is designed to be fed from the magazine. The claw then grabs the round as it's pushed from the magazine into the chamber. Here is a picture of the bolt face showing the squared off claw. You can see the edges of the claw that grab the casing are all sharp angles.  This is a modified claw that should snap over a round fed directly into the chamber. If you look at the bottom part of the claw towards the opening in the bot face, you'll see that the angle is more rounded. This allows the claw to "snap" over a round fed into the chamber.  I'm no expert on this, but it is my understanding that this modification came about to solve the "problem" of what do you do if you're getting stomped on by an elephant and need to put a round in the rifle real quick - a last resort if you will. Having the claw snap over a round fed directly into the chamber can cause the claw to break. This seems like a minor issue if an elephant is stomping you into the ground, but would obviously ruin your hunt if it happened as you were just casually loading your rifle. Feeding rounds from the magazine is still the preferred method as it puts the least amount of stress on the rifle components (i.e. wont break the claw). ____________________________ If you died tomorrow, what would you have done today ... 2018 Zimbabwe - Tuskless w/ Nengasha Safaris 2011 Mozambique - Buffalo w/ Mashambanzou Safaris | |||
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Thanks, friends! Now I understand Mauser action better. | |||
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The bolt face photos in Sevens post clearly show a condition I have commented on previously where posters are querying why they are having problems getting cartridges to feed smoothly from their magazines in a Mauser or a rifle with a Mauser type extractor. The first photo shows a sharp edge on the bottom of the extractor face which can slow down the cartridges ability to feed up under the claw onto the bolt face. The second photo shows an extractor claw with the bottom nicely rounded off which will really help with smooth feeding from the magazine. I sure found this out with my own Mauser 404 which feed like s..t from the mag and scratched cases something awful. A good stoning off on the bottom of the extractor claw produced magic. | |||
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Damn it eagle27 you just told these guys a secret about feeding that I've hidden from them for years. Now they all know and will be dremmeling away for days! I can hear the noises now. all those poor feeding big bore mausers suddenly feeding like silk. next Ray will adopt snap-overs as std practice. What is AR coming too?  -RobNever underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers to do incredibly stupid things- AH (1941)- Harry Reid (aka Smeagle) 2012 Nothing Up my sleeves but never without a plan and never ever without a surprise! | |||
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Sorry  | |||
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My Dremel tool has put my gunsmith's kids through private colleges. Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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I too on my Prechtl mauser, can slam and cam the bolt down on a pre-fed round in the chamber. DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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